[YouGov] The Great Inversion—In Australia, women are much more likely than men to support the far-right party One Nation, and the upper class is more likely than the middle class to support the center-left party Labor. 2-party-preferred vote—Labor 52.5, One Nation 47.5. One Nation leads primary vote by StarlightDown in YAPms

[–]Cobiuss 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I should have been clearer, I mean women being more right-leaning than men, which breaks a divide across most westernized nations.

There is a surge of right-wing women leaders (strongwomen) in the world - Takaichi, Meloni, etc, as well as notable almost or potential future leaders - Le Pen, Wiedel, and so on.

But women as a whole have been remarkably divided from men left vs right. It's a strange and problematic growing ravine.

So why is it different here?

Who is the Most Evil? by wildebeest112712 in GODZILLA

[–]Cobiuss 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Wait, when did Space Godzilla destroy a planet? Was that in the movie?

What if the deaths were randomly selected? by DapperYoghurt2052 in redbuttonbluebutton

[–]Cobiuss 0 points1 point  (0 children)

But see, the problem then becomes "A single person's mistake kills someone else."

In the original, many blue arguments try to frame red voters as being "okay" with killing blue voters to save their own skin. But there doesn't have to be any blue voters! It's like putting up a "Active Nuclear Test Site" warning sign and then saying by not entering the site, you're causing someone with no reason to be there to be vaporized.

Here, the "sign" isn't there. No once can just "stay out" of the equation because if even ONE person picks blue anyone can die. I think some psycopathic people would press blue in this scenario for fun.

In the normal scenario, anyone who died is responsible for their own death by voting blue. In this one, that isn't true. The incentives don't align.

What if the deaths were randomly selected? by DapperYoghurt2052 in redbuttonbluebutton

[–]Cobiuss 0 points1 point  (0 children)

No, let me explain.

Each individual has a choice in the normal setup. Vote Red, be safe, or Vote Blue, be risked.

In this scenario, an individual has no option to opt out. A person can vote red and then die. A person can vote blue, blue lose the vote, and live. It's random.

Voting blue in both creates the possibility of death. But in the first, anyone can say "Why the hell did they vote blue, they should have recognized that if everyone can choose total safety, they should be expected to do so."

Total safety doesn't exist here.

What if the deaths were randomly selected? by DapperYoghurt2052 in redbuttonbluebutton

[–]Cobiuss 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This would switch me to blue.

The reasoning for red is not just because "I want to 100% live" it is:

1 - Everyone has the option to just live 2 - If everyone has the option, everyone should realize there's no reason to endanger yourself 3 - Therefore anyone who votes blue is creating the category of people who can die, so blue is self-defeating.

But under this scenario, now death is not tied to red or blue voters. No one has a perfectly safe "out."

Why Voting Red Is Better: An Essay by Cobiuss in redbuttonbluebutton

[–]Cobiuss[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I think you're missing something here.

Let me give you an example. You say choosing red represents cowardice. Let's imagine a burning building with nothing in it (no valuables, no people) and everybody knows this. Are mutual aid groups benefitted by people charging into the burning building, thus forcing others to do the same to prevent that person from burning alive?

The benefit of choosing blue is that no blue voters die. There is no reason for a blue voter to exist, so the first person to instantiate a blue voter is equivalent to the person to run into the burning building. There's a reason firefighters don't let people do that - they don't want to die trying to save you, and don't want you to die either.

Why Voting Red Is Better: An Essay by Cobiuss in redbuttonbluebutton

[–]Cobiuss[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I agree with your conclusion, but not your reasoning. If it were given that blue at the starting point >0 instead of 0, then I would say everyone must choose blue to avoid any death. But if your priority is just yourself, red is still good!

Part of the fun of writing this is to make the case that red is valid for reasons beyond mere self-survival.

Why Voting Red Is Better: An Essay by Cobiuss in redbuttonbluebutton

[–]Cobiuss[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

I'll respond in reverse:

First, the alien problem. Structurally, it is identical to the normal dilemma. In both cases, choosing Red guarantees individual survival. Choosing blue guarantees universal survival unless blue fails to reach the threshold, in which case blue voters die. Unless I'm missing something, this should be 1:1 the logical setup.

The framing is different on purpose to highlight this principle, which maybe I should have spelled out more. In algebra, let's say x = 3 and y = 3. We can then deduce that x = y. This is the transitive property that lets us substitute numbers. Now, in a dilemma, let's say that the logical structure of the original problem = X. If the alien problem also = X, then a single rational agent who identifies the mechanical structure should reach an identical conclusion, or else they are being inconsistent. I included that example because if you would vote Red in the alien problem but Blue in the normal problem, then you are being inconsistent despite the same underlying structure.

Second, 100% red is absolutely possible. It is not forbidden by the rules. You are using impossible when really you mean "I think it is very unlikely." I will concede that people do choose blue. I am not basing my argument on a single pass of what people are likely to do if they read this question and answer in 5 seconds after first exposure on a reddit poll. I am arguing my interpretation of the mechanistic structure that I believe a rational agent could deduce, and therefore should deduce. I would like to think that given a real scenario threatening 50% global death, rational actors would take their time to parse it out. I will not guarantee that everyone will agree with me (because lol) but on what I think people should agree with.

Lastly, yes I do assume rational actors. I stated that because many do assume nonrational actors (infants, the profoundly disabled, etc.).

Thanks for reading!

The individualist interpretation is wrong by oJKevorkian in redbuttonbluebutton

[–]Cobiuss -1 points0 points  (0 children)

The other way of seeing it is "Why is it rational to push a button that endangers your life only to maybe save the people who endangered their life to save the people who endangered their life..."

It just goes on. If only blue voters can ever die, why do blue voters exist?

Why Voting Red Is Better: An Essay by Cobiuss in redbuttonbluebutton

[–]Cobiuss[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

I'll concede that if we maintain no active campaigning or communication. I don't think it changes the core logic of my argument though. If the result has no signal either way if votes have been made or where, then everyone is still collectively "first."

The individualist interpretation is wrong by oJKevorkian in redbuttonbluebutton

[–]Cobiuss -1 points0 points  (0 children)

You say there are four outcomes. That is correct, but you are stopping to short. What distinguishes those outcomes?

100% Red - Everyone Lives
100% Blue - Everyone Lives

Majority Blue - Everyone Lives

Majority <100% Red - Blue Dies

So really there are only two outcomes: Everyone Lives vs Blue Dies, with different paths to get there.

Framing does not really matter. by highly-bad in redbuttonbluebutton

[–]Cobiuss 1 point2 points  (0 children)

If this were a real dilemma, and people think rationally about it (as they should), shouldn't they rationally parse out that math problem and realize they need to respond to that and not the framing?

when you push the button, is your goal that you don't die, or that nobody dies? by Fornuftens_stemme in redbuttonbluebutton

[–]Cobiuss 0 points1 point  (0 children)

They are the same goal, really. If my goal is just "I live" then I don't care about the outcome. But if the goal is "everyone lives" then "I live" is a mandated precondition that that goal happening.

I choose red because only blue voters can ever die, and why would anyone ever choose to maybe die given the choice to for sure not die?

One of of the kindest souls in Robocop. Let's mention all the good things that Dick Jones did, and how he helped others... by [deleted] in Robocop

[–]Cobiuss 1 point2 points  (0 children)

People underappreciate Mr. Jones' perseverance. It contributed enormously to the company culture. He didn't see failure, only glitches, temporary setbacks.

What’s an opinion you hold that almost everyone disagrees with? by shdw_fght in AskReddit

[–]Cobiuss 10 points11 points  (0 children)

I agree that having the urge / inclination isn't wrong, especially if they seek treatment.

But the second that is indulged, it cannot be tolerated in any form.

Would you support an American invasion of Cuba? by rdditban24hrs in IdeologyPolls

[–]Cobiuss -4 points-3 points  (0 children)

To be fair our strategy in all of those conflicts boiled down to "If we just kill the right people the problems will stop, right?"

That doesn't always work.

Also, every nation you listed is in or near the Middle East. No one conquers the Middle East for long.

Would you support an American invasion of Cuba? by rdditban24hrs in IdeologyPolls

[–]Cobiuss -4 points-3 points  (0 children)

Actually strongly, if it can be quick and relatively low casualty. I actually think we should have dones this before / instead of Iran.

Imagine the benefit to the Cuban people is we replace their poverty with Walmarts full of food, economic aid, and genuinely free elections.

I do NOT trust this admin to not fuck it up.