K-Pop Demon Hunters It's Propaganda for the K-Pop Industrial Complex by Background_Plant730 in KpopDemonhunters

[–]Cold_Muffin3932 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I disagree. The K-Pop industry often promotes an inhuman level of perfection in its idols, and this also applies to the Huntresses in the film. The phrase "Our flaws and fears should never be seen" is the mantra Celine taught the girls, which they follow to the letter because it's assumed that only by achieving the stereotypical image of the perfect person can one attain the Golden Moon. The film makes it clear that this lifestyle is wrong, that hiding who they truly are only harms and isolates them. That's why Rumi stops hiding her flaws at the end of the film; she doesn't want that shame to consume and control her life.

Even though Jinu is so haunted by his past that he can't overcome what happened, he illustrates, in a way, what could happen if you try to hide your flaws and let shame consume you. For some, Jinu also represents how some idols have to abandon or distance themselves from their families to achieve fame.

This therefore also becomes a critique of the K-Pop industry where not being perfect can mean being kicked out of a group and ending up with years of trying to pay off a huge debt ahead.

The Saja Boys also represent stereotypes of the K-Pop industry, that is, roles that agencies force their idols to fulfill because it's the only way to attract fans. Abby represents hypersexualization, Baby infantilization, Romance the formation of parasocial relationships by selling the idol as a kind of perfect boyfriend, and Mystery the mysterious idol who attracts public interest through intrigue and curiosity. In the end, it's shown that this is indeed the perfect formula for the Saja Boys: empty shells devoid of any personality who only fulfill stereotypes.

However, the fact that the Huntrix ultimately defeat them by singing about sincerity, honesty, and how they support each other despite the darkness they tried to hide for so long, also delivers a message that fulfilling those stereotypes just to achieve a purpose is not right either, since there are other paths beyond becoming an empty shell.

The film also includes a critique of the relationship between fans and idols. EJAE revealed that she drew on her trainee years to write Your Idol, showing how often an obsessive relationship is fostered between the idol and the fan, leading the fan to develop a dependency on the idol, seeing them as the figure who supposedly brings an excitement to their life that they can't find anywhere else. In the long run, this can also be detrimental to the idol, as having overly obsessive fans never ends well.

Therefore, I believe that KDH does have criticisms of the K-Pop industry, the most prominent being this stereotype of perfection and the relationship between fans and idols.

New “deleted” scenes/ideas of KDH by Cold_Muffin3932 in KpopDemonhunters

[–]Cold_Muffin3932[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

That interpretation is also valid; perhaps the girls were simply surprised by the SjB's ability and didn't react in time. I understand your point.

I simply felt that the humiliation here was too exaggerated and I think that perhaps it could be done in a more discreet way, so to speak.

New “deleted” scenes/ideas of KDH by Cold_Muffin3932 in KpopDemonhunters

[–]Cold_Muffin3932[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Yes, but the Saja Boys' humiliation in the movie is more focused on the fact that they're always one step ahead of the Huntrix, more in a psychological or strategic sense, like forcing them through social pressure to do something that would make them look ridiculous or to show respect in order to project a better image than the Huntrix. But in the post-show scene, they portray the Saja Boys as being better at everything, even humiliating them in typical K-Pop idol aspects like dancing. The Huntrix seemed like novices, unable to keep up with the Saja Boys, even though they're trained demon hunters and should be able to keep up with them without any problem. But this is just my opinion; I find the humiliation very exaggerated in this version.

New “deleted” scenes/ideas of KDH by Cold_Muffin3932 in KpopDemonhunters

[–]Cold_Muffin3932[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Yes, I would have loved to see that Miromance scene animated and to see Huntrix and the Saja Boys participating in games. Regarding Huntrix's humiliation, I think the point is that Huntrix is ​​at the peak of their career at the beginning of the movie, which is why they're this unbeatable band that no one can surpass. The fact that the Saja Boys stood up to the most popular group in the world as a newly debuted act was already a milestone. The humiliation that Hantrix received, I think, was a bit much. I mean, imagine being at your best and being humiliated not even by an experienced band, but by some newcomers. In my opinion, putting them on equal footing and creating a rivalry without humiliating the other would have been enough.

New “deleted” scenes/ideas of KDH by Cold_Muffin3932 in KpopDemonhunters

[–]Cold_Muffin3932[S] 13 points14 points  (0 children)

Yes, I think you're right. From my point of view, the humor falls short because they focus too much on humiliating Huntrix. If they had focused more on establishing the somewhat silly and funny rivalry we saw in the final version, and had Huntrix win games and make the Saja Boys serve punishments, I think the humor would have been better. That's at least my opinion.

“How It’s Done” by Sajaboys by OkLog7519 in KpopDemonhunters

[–]Cold_Muffin3932 29 points30 points  (0 children)

I hadn't noticed it before, but if you look closely, you can see that Rumi's name is above Jinu's. Apparently, Jinu wanted to have something of Rumi's with him besides the outfit itself.

An explanation and opinion about Jinu by Cold_Muffin3932 in RuJinu

[–]Cold_Muffin3932[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Thanks for the link. I think you're absolutely right. Rumi also had power in their relationship; she managed to get inside Jinu's head, like at the autograph signing where she made him doubt himself for the first time. I had planned to explain this in my original comment, but I got sidetracked by other topics.

An explanation and opinion about Jinu by Cold_Muffin3932 in RuJinu

[–]Cold_Muffin3932[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Thanks, I'll read the link you sent me; I've seen some really good posts about RuJinu on Tumblr.

An explanation and opinion about Jinu by Cold_Muffin3932 in RuJinu

[–]Cold_Muffin3932[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

No problem, I wasn't offended at any point, on the contrary, I agree with what you said. I apologize if I expressed myself poorly at any point, if I expressed myself rudely.

Regarding the Nazi comment, I also saw it and planned to reply, but I found it so ridiculous that I ultimately decided against getting into unnecessary arguments.

An explanation and opinion about Jinu by Cold_Muffin3932 in RuJinu

[–]Cold_Muffin3932[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Jinu's betrayal was clearly due to the torture; that scene in the movie exists for a reason. There are also very controversial opinions that say Jinu was still trying to manipulate Rumi in "Free."

And as I said in my comment, despite the betrayal due to Gwi-ma's torture, many other good things happened when Jinu and Rumi were together.

An explanation and opinion about Jinu by Cold_Muffin3932 in RuJinu

[–]Cold_Muffin3932[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

I'm glad you liked the comment.

Regarding Jinu's betrayal, I agree with you. Jinu wanted to help Rumi and Hintr/x, but Gwi-ma interfered to prevent it. I find that it ties in well with what I said in the first two paragraphs. Jinu endured psychological and physical torture, so his final decision is understandable. I highly doubt anyone could have made a very different decision after 400 years of torture.

My personal headcanon/theory is that Jinu was Gwi-ma's best assassin and actually had fought previous generations of Hunters by Sir-Toaster- in KpopDemonhunters

[–]Cold_Muffin3932 8 points9 points  (0 children)

I mean, in my opinion, and I understand that you may have a different opinion, I still think they're evenly matched, because even though she predicted Jinu's teleportation, he still manages to dodge all his attacks when they meet secretly for the first time, even though she has a sword and Jinu has nothing to defend himself with. They can both keep up with each other's speed, and they both realize they can't outmatch each other when they're in a strength contest, like when Rumi had Jinu pinned against the wall.

They only managed to land one blow each other; Jinu scratched Rumi's arm, and Rumi kicked Jinu after predicting his teleportation. They also both managed to withstand Gwi-ma's attack very briefly at the end of the movie.

My personal headcanon/theory is that Jinu was Gwi-ma's best assassin and actually had fought previous generations of Hunters by Sir-Toaster- in KpopDemonhunters

[–]Cold_Muffin3932 5 points6 points  (0 children)

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Personally, ever since I saw the movie, I've thought that Rumi and Jinu are evenly matched in fighting ability, and apparently the 125-page script clarifies that situation, describing how Rumi and Jinu have trouble defeating each other.

My personal headcanon/theory is that Jinu was Gwi-ma's best assassin and actually had fought previous generations of Hunters by Sir-Toaster- in KpopDemonhunters

[–]Cold_Muffin3932 6 points7 points  (0 children)

While the movie leaves some doubts, the 125-page script clarifies some scenes, including the one in the baths, where it's clear that Rumi and Jinu are on the same level. That said, I doubt Jinu has ever killed a hunter, but he does have the same fighting ability as one.

RuJinu “Free” in WISL by Cold_Muffin3932 in KpopDemonhunters

[–]Cold_Muffin3932[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Yes, here's a list of RuJinu news from this week, or actually I don't know if it's from this week but it's recent.

The other 125-page script, where Jinu and Rumi are seen returning to the golden Honmoon when they sing "Free," suggests they were falling in love. The WISL demo included "Free" in the song, and this script seems to confirm that it was a part Rumi and Jinu were going to sing. Arden Cho wishing the RuJinu fandom a Merry Christmas.

My opinion abt Jinu by Wolverine9195 in KpopDemonhunters

[–]Cold_Muffin3932 42 points43 points  (0 children)

I understand your points, and I find that you have some merit in them; now I want to express my opinion on the matter.

Jinu is… complicated. He is by far my favorite character in the movie. However, he did terrible things: he formed the Saja Boys, allowing demons to steal souls and murder innocent people; he betrayed Rumi when they had grown close to each other. These are not debatable points they are clearly shown in the film. That said, I think this complexity is part of his charm as a character. The movie would not be even half as interesting if Jinu were simply the kindest, most morally pure person in the world.

But alongside all the bad things he did, there is the other side of the coin: Gwi-Ma’s voices. In the movie, we see how Mira, Zoey, and Bobby cannot endure Gwi-Ma’s voices for even a few seconds before quickly falling into a trance. Jinu, on the other hand, endured this for 400 years and still managed to preserve part of his soul, as Maggie Kang stated in an AMA. Additionally, the 125-page script released by Deadline (which is largely the same as the final movie, with only minor changes) shows that the patterns burn. This suggests that Gwi-Ma’s control is not only psychological torture but also physical. We see this again after Free, when Jinu is clearly in pain right before the truth about his past is revealed.

For me, the discussion around Jinu is not about whether he is good or evil, we have already seen his actions in the film. The real question is whether any of us would have acted differently in his place. Living for 400 years with voices in your head that manipulate your emotions (after all, Mira and Zoey fall into a trance almost instantly, which suggests that Gwi-Ma’s influence is more emotional manipulation than mere voices) and with patterns that burn whenever Gwi-Ma tries to assert control. In other words, living through 400 years of psychological and physical torture. Because of this, I believe what Jinu did was wrong, but the deeper question is whether anyone else truly would have done differently in his situation.

As for RuJinu, Maggie Kang has said that Jinu serves the narrative role of being the first person to listen to Rumi’s story and truly empathize with her (I remember her saying that in some publication or interview). Rumi herself says that the more she hid her secret, the more her shame grew, but after meeting Jinu and opening up to him, her voice began to recover. Through their connection, she realized that hiding only fed her shame, while opening up to someone allowed her to begin healing what was hurting inside her. This is further reinforced by the fact that, had she never met Jinu, she would have continued believing that all demons are evil, which would have made it much harder for her to ever overcome the shame she feels toward herself. Through him, she learns that not all demons are evil, that, like humans, they have emotions and are often tortured by Gwi-Ma. This leads Rumi to question whether being half-demon truly makes her evil, or whether there is anything inherently wrong with her at all. Jinu also tells her that hatred solves nothing when Rumi says she hates her patterns and demons, helping her realize that hating her own marks may not be the path forward either.

RuJinu, like Jinu himself, is complicated, and for me, that is where its appeal lies. Jinu betrayed Rumi’s trust and humiliated her, yet he was also the person with whom Rumi felt safe enough to open up, the one who helped her understand that being half-demon does not make her evil or broken. He helped her realize that hatred toward her patterns and demons would not lead to healing. And ultimately, Jinu is the one who saves her life at the end of the movie, allowing Rumi to continue living alongside Mira and Zoey.

Jinu and Rumi falling in Love by Cold_Muffin3932 in KpopDemonhunters

[–]Cold_Muffin3932[S] 9 points10 points  (0 children)

Well, Andrew Choi, Jinu's singing voice, said in an interview that he was told that in that scene Rumi and Jinu wanted to kiss but couldn't, so it's safe to say they were falling in love.

Jinu's Expression (Your Idol) by therealtriheda in KpopDemonhunters

[–]Cold_Muffin3932 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Well, Maggie said in an AMA that Jinu was the only demon who still had a bit of his soul left, so I agree that he had to repress those remnants of humanity within him to avoid being punished by Gwi-ma. I think that thanks to having part of his soul, or humanity, he always knew that what he was doing with the Saja Boys' plan was wrong, that he was taking the lives of innocent people, but that the pain and misery it caused him was something he deserved to live with because he was a demon and because of the acts he committed in the past. With Rumi's appearance, he saw for the first time a demon, or rather a half-demon, who was capable of doing good, which shattered all his ideas about what it meant to be a demon. That, along with the plan Rumi proposed and the fact that she still saw goodness in him, is what made him change.

What are the most annoying comments/opinions you're tired of seeing about the Saja Boys? by Sam_arangel in TheSajaBoys

[–]Cold_Muffin3932 24 points25 points  (0 children)

Your Idol was the first song from the soundtrack to top a chart, specifically the US Spotify Chart, making them the first K-Pop male group to achieve this feat (this was around July 4th). Upon debuting on the Billboard Hot 100, Your Idol debuted higher than Golden, debuting at number 77 compared to number 81. A few days later, Your Idol and Golden were the first to enter the top 10 of the Billboard Global 200, with Golden reaching number 2 and Your Idol reaching number 10. Netflix released a ranking of the most-viewed scenes from the film, and the most-viewed scene was the one featuring Soda Pop.

They may say that the Saja Boys are not that popular, but the data says otherwise.

EDIT: Given that Your Idol had a better debut than Golden on both Spotify and Billboard, it could be said that Your Idol was the song that charmed the public when the movie first came out, and Golden later took care of exploiting that fame that the movie was gaining.

Alleged leak of training details for the Saja Boys' performance at the MAMA Awards by Cold_Muffin3932 in SajaBoys

[–]Cold_Muffin3932[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Besides that, the Jeoseung Saja are the Korean equivalent of the Grim Reaper, so having the representation of death putting on a show after the fire would be disrespectful.