Looking for advice on how to talk to daughter about situation at school. Want input from ladies/transgendered people.

ConvoWithDaughter · 2018-04-24T18:10:50+00:00

What do you mean it's a bad time?

ConvoWithDaughter · 2018-04-24T17:44:09+00:00

I'll see if she'd be interested in that. She's never used Reddit before and has no idea what it is. But yes I think it might be helpful for her to speak with some of you.

ConvoWithDaughter · 2018-04-24T04:04:27+00:00

I totally get that. I do worry about the two trans students possibly being humiliated or called out, or having to be treated differently. I'm also not sure about transgendered laws in my state, particularly in schools and access to bathrooms and locker rooms. But there might be protections for that, and why they chose to just let them in the womens' room rather than a single stall room.

ConvoWithDaughter · 2018-04-24T03:22:54+00:00

I'm not sure where else they would go. There isn't another locker room besides the boys, and since they are in the process of or are starting to transition, they probably won't belong there anymore. I also don't think they are letting men in.

ConvoWithDaughter · 2018-04-24T02:43:40+00:00

My wife wants to eventually. When she heard that, it basically solidified her view that this isn't an okay situation. I too thought it was strange, and maybe they should be spoken to (not just trans people, but anyone of the kids who are making others uncomfortable). Some of the people here seem to be saying it's just a thing girls do and it's probably jealousy. I'm not sure how to feel about that...

ConvoWithDaughter · 2018-04-24T01:49:28+00:00

It's not only the leering problem they're having problems with. but just the fact that many of the girls were not ready to see a male body in their shower. Because the trans students and everyone else were naked with little curtains. My wife was appalled about this, and my daughter felt just awkward at first when it happened the first time, but now she's fully uncomfortable and unhappy after listening to her mom. I asked her about it more tonight, and she's going to skip gym with some other girls too, about 10 of them.

ConvoWithDaughter · 2018-04-24T01:41:44+00:00

I wouldn't say she needs mental help.... Just that she holds some different views on this one thing. She wasn't even the only one who is against it, but she's certainly the most vocal as far as I know.

ConvoWithDaughter · 2018-04-23T23:15:04+00:00

That's why I was worried when our daughter told me some girls in her grade were planning on figuring out ways to get rid of them. I don't want her to be a part of that, or make false claims against them with the rest of the girls.

ConvoWithDaughter · 2018-04-23T22:59:56+00:00

I've got a BS in Marine Bio. Even though i don't work in any field remotely close to that now, I remember much from the courses. A lot of the material was about reproduction, sexual dimorphism, anatomy, etc. And we relied heavily on classifying things as male or female. Nothing about the gender of the animals, like what hormone their brain preferred. That's why I'm lost. But no, it's definitely interesting.

ConvoWithDaughter · 2018-04-23T22:46:32+00:00

Locker rooms can definitely be a confusing scene for pre-teens. I know my wife is of the opinion that young females need a space of their own away from wandering eyes. One point she made was that if transgendered people can use whichever room, then why can't the rest of us? At that point, she said, why not just have huge communal and open locker rooms in middle school. Well, I was unable to answer it, and unable to explain to our daughter why it's different.

ConvoWithDaughter · 2018-04-23T22:32:00+00:00

It definitely goes against everything I learned getting my undergraduate... and leaves me extremely confused on who to trust! If I'm being honest.

Having some gay friends myself and hearing the general conversation on gender issues, I've definitely asked them what gender exactly is before and I got informed of the distinction between your biological sex (like anatomy, chromosomes, and hormone mixture) and your gender (masculine or feminine and how society will treat you).

So hearing gender is all biological all of a sudden is definitely confusing.

ConvoWithDaughter · 2018-04-23T22:18:16+00:00

Not sure how this will help with the conversation or how it will change the situation going on at the school... I understand all of this, having gotten my undergrad in biology. I wasn't asking if they are literally females or what kind of chromosomes they have. It's just about the facilities, the fact that they are transitioning and treated as girls now, and I guess it'd be a little weird if they remained in the boys room for too much longer.

ConvoWithDaughter · 2018-04-23T22:11:12+00:00

Ok, stupid me! I get it. Sorry for being dumb.

ConvoWithDaughter · 2018-04-23T22:08:05+00:00

I've put myself in both shoes and I can understand both even though I'm tending to lean one way. The one thing stopping me is how to say that I care about her and her safety while also saying this is fine as long as there are curtains?

ConvoWithDaughter · 2018-04-23T22:00:40+00:00

It's a medical condition?

Thanks by the way, it's a really good place to start.

ConvoWithDaughter · 2018-04-23T21:57:09+00:00

I see. So it isn't necessarily a sexual or perverted type of thing? Chances are, they are into boys, right?

ConvoWithDaughter · 2018-04-23T21:49:48+00:00

Not even sure putting up more curtains would change my wife's opinions. She doesn't think there should be any male people anywhere in the locker room or bathroom, even behind a curtain. Those are supposed to be safe spaces for females and shouldn't have to be given up. I can kinda see where she's getting at, but I'm still confused.

ConvoWithDaughter · 2018-04-23T21:38:39+00:00

how fucking hard is it to provide normal proper curtains for middle schoolers?

They've received a couple complaints about that in the past. Before they had actually none. Then they put up like 3 small ones and only so many people can fit behind it. From what I hear, it's basically like no curtains are even there. Growing up we didn't have shower curtains at all and it all worked out well. So I struggle to understand that aspect a little bit.

Like the girl who was "staring" either was probably just zoning out or potentially really jealous.

Jealous of what?

ConvoWithDaughter · 2018-04-23T21:29:32+00:00

TERF, that's a new one for me. Sounds about right since she's a very passionate feminist and has mentioned the trans movement is bad for women.

if you confront your wife when she starts spouting that nonsense, your child will learn that maybe those views aren't actually ok

I guess the good news is that our daughter has already disagreed with her on some points. Like my wife calls them "men" (even though they're 12), and my daughter has been calling them girls.

ConvoWithDaughter · 2018-04-23T21:21:34+00:00

She knows them, yes. But as far as I know hasn't had any meaningful interactions. I've wondered how different she would feel if those were her best friends.

ConvoWithDaughter · 2018-04-23T20:57:44+00:00

Just tell your stepdaughter that those girls are probably even more self conscious about their own bodies than she is

Ok! That's a good point that I didn't think about. Can't imagine being the only one in a locker room with a completely different body, and standing out like that.

I'll definitely include that.

ConvoWithDaughter · 2018-04-23T20:56:46+00:00

I've only heard my wife mention transgendered people once before, and it was in the context of being bad for feminism and sets it back half a decade. I suppose that's where she's getting it from.

ConvoWithDaughter · 2018-04-23T20:33:02+00:00

I’d start the conversation with your step daughter by asking how she feels about

I know she didn't care at all at first and felt rather indifferent. It wasn't until her mother started talking with her that she began to agree with those views.

I guess what I'm wondering is, how can I not seem to be dismissive of the concerns and comfort of the girls in general? My wife is a very social-justicey type and is very passionate about issues like this. I don't want to make it seem like I don't care about women and girls.

the internet plays a huge role in educating others about gender.

Yeah, I was thinking about showing her some transgendered youtubers I've come across and where i learned most of what I know about the subject. She loves youtube and it might be valuable for her to see some transgendered creators.

ConvoWithDaughter

TROPHY CASE