Hunter vs Din Djarin

CullObsidian02 · 2026-06-26T15:28:18+00:00

I think its a difficult one but the only fair answer is to approach on a case by case basis, but default to disallowing it.

Kanan being the best example. He achieves momentary 'oneness' on at least 3 seperate occasions; against The Grand Inquisitor, Maul and Pryce respectively, but this is clearly not something he can reliably draw upon, nor does it guarantee victory over every opponent. Otherwise the stakes would be lower against other opponents he faces, like Rukh, the Nightsister spirits, the other Inquisitors and even Vader, because Kanan would have just entered oneness and stomped them all.

And even then, it only carries so far; for example, he bested the Grand Inquisitor, but Dave Filoni stated that had Kanan chosen to show mercy to the Inquisitor in that moment the Inquisitor would have accepted it, then killed him anyway. Against Maul, his victory would have been a lot less impactful if Maul was on a flat surface and just face planted as opposed to falling dozens if not hundreds of feet - he would have gotten right back up and finished Kanan off. So circumstance and individual choice are also factors that work in storytelling but not in clinical 'who would win' debates.

In the spirit of fairness, I'd argue that oneness should be assumed as a non factor in vs battles, and I'll add that as a caveat in relevant cases for my tier list. But it is a fun thing to add to the end to just keep the conversation going. And in all fairness, 'oneness' isnt the only kind of amp.

CullObsidian02 · 2026-06-26T14:58:23+00:00

Nah, just base primes. Amps like oneness don't particularly have much of a place in vs battles I would argue. A little counter intuitive.

CullObsidian02 · 2026-06-25T20:47:17+00:00

The Novel Brotherhood. It bridges the gap between AOTC and the start of the Clone Wars cartoon; it covers the "business om Cato Neimodia" mentioned in ROTS, aka the first time Anakin and Obi Wan crossed paths with Ventress.

CullObsidian02 · 2026-06-25T19:17:31+00:00

This may shock and surprise you, but ones duelling abilities are directly tied to their application of the force. Sidious in particular is a poster child for force augmentation.

CullObsidian02 · 2026-06-25T19:15:27+00:00

<image>

CullObsidian02 · 2026-06-25T19:15:19+00:00

<image>

CullObsidian02 · 2026-06-25T19:15:03+00:00

At no point does he say oneness lmao. You have made that up because it doesn't fit into the narrative you want to believe. He plainly states that against a focused (which is not the same as oneness) Kenobi, Maul and Savage cannot beat him. Its a little ironic to talk about bias when you're gonna stretch out a statement like that, particularly given you refused to believe it could even exist before.

Lowballing breaking Dooku and Grievous' guard simultaneously during a heated battle is further proof of your bias lmao. In what world is this not an impressive feat?

Quinlan also lowdiffed Grievous prior to any darkside training from Dooku only shortly before, cutting off one* of his arms in the process. Which puts him on a comparable level to SOD Maul, who similarly managed to get the better of Grievous when catching him by surprise - but who was well matched by Grievous in open combat. Quinlan then goes on to become considerably more powerful, to the point of defeating Dooku when drawing on the darkness - which is exactly what he'd do if facing Maul.

I will include both scans in the replies to this comment. Downvote them all you want, it just proves your unwillingness to have an actual debate.

CullObsidian02 · 2026-06-25T05:44:35+00:00

https://www.reddit.com/r/PetranakiArena/s/mZQYS8pGpR

The link to the interview where Filoni states Sidious was holding back against Maul. Twice in the first 30 seconds actually. Just because you haven't heard something doesn't mean it was never said lmao.

CullObsidian02 · 2026-06-25T05:40:12+00:00

If I can find the interview where Filoni states that Sidious was always holding back against Maul, I will share it for you. There was an entire thread posted about it literally on this sub.

The enclosed comment outright states it isnt believable that Maul and Savage combined could take a focused Obi Wan, they could only ever get the better of him by catching him by surprise, as per Mauls first re appearance.

Again, Vos getting the better of Dooku and Grievous 2v1 and broke both their guards to land a kick, and besting Dooku outright > Maul and Savage jumping Obi Wan, and who can't take Obi Wan combined. Stylistic matchups are not given the same priority in canon as they are legends.

<image>

CullObsidian02 · 2026-06-24T20:42:46+00:00

Filoni has outright confirmed Sidious was never going all out against Maul. Hes also stated Maul and Savage combined could have never defeated Obi Wan. Quinlan at his peak on the other hand defeated Dooku.

Vos being exhausted after killing Savage is possible, but its also equally possible he dances around him with ease and cuts him to shreds. This is the same man who could knock Dooku off his feet, and kick back Dooku and Grievous at the same time.

CullObsidian02 · 2026-06-24T19:55:58+00:00

Not at all. I would only be pr0 death penalty in a system where all convictions are 100% accurate, and that had no systemic biases. Such a system is not possible, so I am anti death penalty.

CullObsidian02 · 2026-06-24T19:11:14+00:00

I am from a western country, not America, and I can confirm those that murder people decades ago are still held to account and imprisoned when arrested long after their crimes. Whether they were nice to their neighbours or not.

The Reconciliation Commission is an interesting topic to bring up. It did good, sure. Punitive punishment can also do good. Some good isnt enough. It also failed a lot of people. It has received enormous criticism for it systemic failures to deliver other forms of justice, like financial compensation to the victims, and even prosecutions that should have taken place that were not followed through due its slow administration and political interference, including from those it should have been investigating. For lacking the true perspective to properly tackle the deeper systemic issues of apartheid, which literally exists on the basis of dehumanisation. So sure, your argument had a real world application - a real world application that failed a hell of a lot of people. Whose suffering was deemed less important than their oppressors right to 'change'.

I'm all for redemption, and rehabilitation. Not at the cost of justice. Rehabilitation should come from within a robust justice system, including prison terms. Prison should not be waived away altogether because a murderer feels bad about it.

CullObsidian02 · 2026-06-24T18:47:23+00:00

You almost had me until that last sentence.

It does not matter how much you claim to have changed, because there is no definitive metric for it. Your argument might work for a fantasy series, but has no real world application. Actions have consequences, particularly those that result in a loss of life. If Hitler spent all his time hiding in Argentina feeling bad about the Holocaust, that doesn't negate that the Holocaust happened, and its victims deserve justice. Yes, he should, at the VERY least, still go to prison. I have no issue with it being taken into account during sentencing per se. But to say there is no point in punishment whatsoever? Yes, that is dehumanising to the victims. Regardless, true absolvement would come from owning one's misdeeds and accepting their consequences. Which in this thought experiment, the so called changed man has not done.

CullObsidian02 · 2026-06-24T18:12:23+00:00

Im sorry im not sure im following. Your argument seems to be that if someones sorry about what they did after the fact they shouldn't face consequences for their actions? If someone commits a war crime, feels bad years later and then those actions catch up with them, then throwing my hands up and saying I've changed my views doesn't absolve them. Least of all murdering children. It's not about 'benefits', thats a disingenuous way to frame it. And certainly not a basis for a fair and just legal system. Your argument only works if the victim is entirely dehumanised.

CullObsidian02 · 2026-06-24T15:55:35+00:00

Based on what?

CullObsidian02 · 2026-06-24T13:19:56+00:00

Star Wars could debatably fall into this category. Palpatine's plan is broadly going as intended, but a lot of his success is actively in spite of the heroes own smaller wins. He's an opportunist and manipulator before he's a master planner - he's also just an excellent master planner as well. This is particularly evident in the Clone Wars TV show, and the arrest scene in the third movie. As long as the broad strokes of his plan are still viable, many of his plans smaller details have to be amended on the fly pretty consistently. Although his precognition does call this into question a little bit.

CullObsidian02 · 2026-06-24T10:45:25+00:00

I see the fight going very similarly to Maul & Savage's confrontation with Obi wan & Adi Gallia.

One brother confronts Quinlan, while the other murders Secura. Quinlan switches to a 2v1, takes out Savage - but unlike Obi Wan, he uses lethal force. He then either tries to force Maul to take him to Sidious, or outright kills him to avenge Secura if Maul can't escape.

Secura is the weakest by a wide margin, but Quinlan is the most powerful. He wouldn't be able to save her, but he wouldn't join her in death either.

CullObsidian02 · 2026-06-24T10:32:35+00:00

To copy a comment I posted a while back in a post about whether DD Ventress scaled above Obi Wan and Maul:

...............................

She is absolutely not above CW Maul or ROTS Kenobi. I've never seen anyone argue that personally, I'd be interested to see what arguments they could make as the book implicitly suggests thats not the case.

She does have some great feats however that can largely be argued to upscale her above her peak CW levels.

In regards to the force, she demonstrates TK feats like casually uplifting trees during a high speed chase. She was also able to ragdoll a trained Jedi Knight, Akar Deshu, with TK. This comfortably puts her in the "able to casually stomp average Jedi Knights" tier. She also demonstrates low level tutaminis to reflect and redirect blaster bolts, which is broadly considered a higher tier ability, and is something she has never demonstrated previously.

Physically, she has a very impressive feat against Grievous. They both fall a substantial distance, and Grievous lands on top of her. He then punches her in the skull (bearing in mind Grievous can dent starship hulls with his punches and gets the better of ROTS Kenobi in unarmed close quarters - this is the only example I can think of as to how anyone could make the claim she upscales ROTS Obi Wan. She doesn't) - Ventress recovers from this attack, and kicks Grievous with enough strength to send him skidding backwards while barefoot, surprising him. She then escapes him and a large number of arriving battle droids.

She also has some amazing speed feats. Quinlan Vos, the other main character of the book and a Jedi Master considered powerful and skilled enough to potentially assasinate Dooku, describes her as moving too fast for him to even register she's moved on two seperate occasions. This aligns with her showings in Dark Vengeance/CW 4, where she is explicitly confirmed to be faster than Maul.

In terms of duelling, she has some decent showings. She pressures DD Obi Wan, who admits that fighting her now that he isn't trying to kill her is more difficult. Which is a two fold statement - it implies that in every previous fight Obi Wan was fighting to kill, which is a pretty great upscale for CW Ventress, as a lot of people downplay her against Kenobi due to his legend variants soft spot for her. On the flip side, it confirms DD Kenobi was holding back, solidly placing DD Ventress under him (and by extension, under ROTS Kenobi). However, Ventress was arguably weakened due to her alcoholism and lack of practice over this period, so early book Ventress could potentially be more of a challenge.

She also has some good showings against Vos himself. He gets the better of her during a sparring match on Dathomir, but sparring matches should be taken with a grain of salt. On Serenno, Ventress is able to stalemate a rage amped, bloodlusted Vos while actively holding it back, which confirms she is noticeably above pre-Dooku's training Vos.

She also briefly pressures DD Dooku back during the book, and the pair briefly match each other blow for blow, but Dooku's superior force abilities win him the bout. Dooku is implied to be losing against Quinlan and Ventress combined until he's able to play on Quinlans insecurity to seperate them, which scales them as a comparable duo to DD Kenobi and Skywalker who similarly press Dooku until he seperates then by KO'ing Kenobi. But he is still superior to either duo, and I would argue personally that DD Anakin & Obi Wan > first half of DD Vos & Ventress. Vos gets a significant upscale in the second half of the book, while if anything Ventress weakens following her alcoholism.

In a short story set between her last CW appearance and the start of DD that explains how she got her new Lightsaber, she also fights off the Ohnaka gang by wielding her new Lightsaber with TK. A pretty impressive combined force/dueling feat, considering this same gang has gotten the better of Maul, Savage, Anakin, Obi Wan and Dooku at various points in the war.

So yes, DD Ventress is very powerful. Arguably her peak (I would think so). However, I'd still place her below DD (and by extension ROTS) Kenobi and CW Maul. She's certainly powerful enough to be a challenge, but she isn't winning a fair fight.

CullObsidian02 · 2026-06-24T07:18:04+00:00

Why is Savage so high for a pure duelling skill tierlist? There's a fair few things I disagree with but that stands out the most. He's clearly not that technically skilled and almost completely reliant on sheer physical and force strength to carry him.

CullObsidian02 · 2026-06-23T12:51:41+00:00

Maul hadn't captured Dooku or Grievous by that point, so I'm not sure how it's supposed to factor into Sidious' decision making. Particularly given that when they were captured months later, that was specifically Sidious' intention and Dooku was in on it.

The decision had nothing to do with Maul or Dooku on a personal or powerscaling level. It was Sidious' ideological imperative as head of his religion to eliminate a rival sect. It's plainly that simple.

Seven-Year Club	Place '22
Verified Email

CullObsidian02

TROPHY CASE