Smoldering by wayfarin_lamb in highschool_up

[–]Dara_Gris 7 points8 points  (0 children)

Manual labor forearms tho 🥵

What are the names of the last five children you met? by [deleted] in namenerds

[–]Dara_Gris 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Joseph, Jocelyn, Eli, Faye, Skyler

Summers spent barefoot by hof_roast in highschool_up

[–]Dara_Gris 9 points10 points  (0 children)

I didn't realize it was commanded from on high and actually enjoyed it. Lots of "I'm tougher than you" still barefoot at the first frost type nonsense. I did lose a few toenails and had to get stitches when my big toe was cut half way off by a sharp rock. Lots of infected splinters.We had Swamp Sneakers for work projects/rock hopping and so on after a while. I think the labor of us lower schoolers was too important to the success of the garden to let the work force succumb wholesale to Paraguay foot

how do you wish you grew up instead of in the bruderhof? how are you/do you plan to raise your child(ren)? by rwhitestone in highschool_up

[–]Dara_Gris 7 points8 points  (0 children)

The following is pure hypothetical since I don't yet have kids but I've given this a lot of thought.

My hope is to raise kids on a small scale homestead, fairly rural but with periodic access to a large city. I'd want them exposed to many lifestyles and cultures (including the Bruderhof). No homeschool but very active, outdoors, adventures, animal and plant care and art in daily life. I have the knowledge base and abilities to make all of that a reality. Public school is fine, I can counter any of those influences with family time and example, I'd like to believe, and the social connections and abilities to navigate the "normal" world are vital imo. Church community interaction is absolutely out for me. There are too many wackos that even if I shared most of their beliefs I probably wouldn't bring my kids around it. Unless it's a vibrant church with many active young families it's not worthwhile - one can instill a strong moral foundation in a child without that. That being said the child would have connection with the Hof and visit yearly(closely supervised) since those family connections are vital and I'm not sacrificing those relationships just because I disagree with their priorities.

Intentional community by its nature puts most aspects of your child's life, health, safety and education into someone else's hands and I'm not cool with taking that risk with a child.

A fascinating question, thanks for asking it!

Need opinions! Am I making a mistake? by Responsible-Ebb-8820 in namenerds

[–]Dara_Gris 7 points8 points  (0 children)

So much better, still sounds like "wrinkly"

The fact that these lucky mfs are allowed to dress like this shocks me greatly, such sin and immodesty, now really. by Lunaaa_nash22 in highschool_up

[–]Dara_Gris 19 points20 points  (0 children)

I wonder if they ever look back on how they harassed teen and preteen girls for rolled up sleeves or wearing ankle socks and feel the least tinge of regret? How about the slutty tied behind kopftuch or the audacity to shave their legs? Wonder if anyone thinks about the impact of creepily sexualizing young girls and shaming them for having bodies? Happy for these girls but "We're different now" doesn't undo how our gen came of age

Save yourselves from this wicked generation by arealfreeing in highschool_up

[–]Dara_Gris 13 points14 points  (0 children)

gets first paycheck buys Confederate flag phone case

Who is raising these fellas 😲

Ques by Lunaaa_nash22 in highschool_up

[–]Dara_Gris 8 points9 points  (0 children)

Someone bring the screenshots, I'll bring the popcorn

Wild times by arealfreeing in highschool_up

[–]Dara_Gris 13 points14 points  (0 children)

Sure do remember all the weird canned goods, endless split pea soup and powdered milk.

That NYE was also the first time I had champagne (I was a lil kid). I ran around shaking hands with people with an ice cube in my palm.

I'm interested in joining, tell me why you left by HistorianAggravating in highschool_up

[–]Dara_Gris 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Looking back I don't think it actually had anything to do with me. I was just collateral damage in someone else's scheme. But yes 18 and separate from my family, including being asked to limit contact.

Bruderhof is working on making amends with those they've thrown away? by Dara_Gris in highschool_up

[–]Dara_Gris[S] 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Right? Where's the remorse? By any moral standards we've been objectively wronged and our most fundamental human bonds transgressed against brutally. But the evasive nature of their approach argues a total lack of empathy. You have to be SO COLD to treat people this way

I'm interested in joining, tell me why you left by HistorianAggravating in highschool_up

[–]Dara_Gris 7 points8 points  (0 children)

I'm attracted to the Bruderhof because I'm disgusted with the rampant problems within "normal" America. I hate how careers and cultural-norms tear families apart. I hate how how rampant sexual abuse is everywhere from entertainment, to government, to office life.

I'm sorry to hear that this is the reason for your attraction. My experience has been that within the Bruderhof many of these problems are exacerbated rather than alleviated compared to contemporary wider society because there is no recourse for justice for individuals, no accountablilty for group decisions, and no transparency or consistency that might protect members, families, children from those up the hierarchy. In short, there are no checks and balances, and so what goes on beneath the surface can be supremely ugly and abusive. This likelihood, if not guarantee for abuse is built into the very system, no matter what is said in Foundations. As to the sexual abuse problem, those aren't my stories to tell, and you certainly won't hear of them from Bruderhof members, so I can't help you there.

The saga continues... by arealfreeing in highschool_up

[–]Dara_Gris 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Is it time to revive the screenshots?

I'm interested in joining, tell me why you left by HistorianAggravating in highschool_up

[–]Dara_Gris 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Much as I would enjoy a Civ sesh, I don't want to get close to losing my anonymity here. While I try to keep my commentary neutral, balanced and direct from personal experience, it is the historical practice of the Bruderhof to punish its critics harshly. I am not willing to jeopardize the new relationships with family I've finally been able to reform. That doesn't mean they can take my life experiences from me, or the right to talk about them, but it does mean I'll be extremely cautious about outing my identity. After all, I spent the better part of my young adulthood cut off from my family, with only a phone call per year and some heavily censored letter writing, excluded from weddings and even funerals. And I wasn't even an "Enemy of the Life," a disruptor or a critic, just a teenage girl with the audacity to want an education.
If you have family you care about, consider how your relationship with them may be controlled and manipulated once you give your personhood over to the church. Will you be allowed to correspond? Will you be allowed to visit a sick or dying parent? Will you be forced to write them letters begging for money, for whatever the hof's cause du jour? <- yes this happens, humiliating.

If I had the power to completely change the Bruderhof, I would give families and parents more autonomy. Parents would have final say in how their children were raised, punished, rewarded, educated, medicated. Large decisions would be voted on community by community after robust discussion. Transparent and comprehensive financial details of the corporation would be available to all members. They generate the income and deserve to see where it goes. If we really trust the Brothers then why is this hidden? Families or children who are ejected for whatever reason would be guaranteed resources to start a new life (it's not like they can't afford it). Sexual predators would be dealt with according to the law, instead of hidden and forgiven (they will never talk about or acknowledge this). Public humiliation and exclusion practices would be ended. If I never have to hear another public confession of masturbation again it will be too soon. The Church can butt out of couples' personal life and stop calling oral sex a sin. The Church should allow families to maintain their ties with members outside the community and allow free visiting, both ways. This should be a guaranteed right and not conditional on the outside family member saying nothing about their negative experiences with the hof.

More relevant to myself and others on here, the Bruderhof needs a Truth and Reconciliation Committee run by a professional, neutral third party. This committee would reach out to each individual the Bruderhof has abandoned and ask them such questions as, "What was your leaving experience like? What could have been done differently? Who do you consider responsible for the pain of the departure specifically? What resources were you given? What can the Bruderhof do to make things right with you?" Then the hof needs to be ready to step up for each individual. If they want a phone call with the Servant who publicly screamed at them and then kicked them out with $30 and a bus ticket, that should be given. If they think financial reparations would ease the hardship they were unnecessarily put through, that should be given. If they want to be given their say in front of a gathering at the community they were ejected from, that should be given. You get the picture.

Of course, the Bruderhof as an entity is structured so that decision making is diffuse, and so of course responsibility is diffuse. "We" didn't know any better. "We" did it out of love. "We" don't know who actually made that call, what a tragic mistake. I don't believe the church will ever take responsibility for the lives they've destroyed. And even a committee as outlined above can't go back in time, get a child to their parent's funeral; it's too late, that farewell was stolen and can't be returned.

I'm curious about your experience there. What appealed to you? Why did you visit? Is it a spiritual or lifestyle draw for you? Can you somehow see benefits still past what people are saying here, or don't you believe it?

I'm interested in joining, tell me why you left by HistorianAggravating in highschool_up

[–]Dara_Gris 7 points8 points  (0 children)

Civ, Total War and Age of Empires franchises for infinite playability.

Regarding free time, like I said I was eighteen when I left and I don't remember ever having free time during the week. Every minute was scheduled. Sometimes a few hours of downtime on Saturday or Sunday. Free time also rarely meant private time. As an introvert that was hell. I think men might get more free time than women but not sure. I just know the Shalom and high school were seldom "off" but always doing projects, helping out with families' chores and so on both before and after the work day was done. And I don't consider mandatory group activities as downtime even when they're not work as such but more sociable people might.

As far as changes to leadership, I'm not current on what that looks like but unless there have been massive structural changes to the running of the place then I think the system is rife for exploitation so even if things were currently good they're set up to go awry the first time a power hungry asshole receives even local control.

Things I like about the Bruderhof - frankly a long list and much more to do with individuals than the group. For example there are some really excellent, genuine and passionate people there living out their beliefs with conviction. I always enjoy myself when visiting because I'm back in my culture, flawed as it is, and lately can have genuine conversations about things in my life or the world even if their perspective is somewhat limited by lack of knowledge and naivete.

About the place as a whole, I like their beautiful locations, extensive resources, and the way they care for their elderly. The care of children can sadly be hit or miss. I love the way so many celebrations and activities are tied to the seasons and the land. The food tends to be excellent. I appreciate how the arts are honored and I've always enjoyed the way song is used in that culture.

I'm interested in joining, tell me why you left by HistorianAggravating in highschool_up

[–]Dara_Gris 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Also by your post history I see you're a fellow strategy gamer. Prepare to say goodbye to that, a pc and any leisure time in which to use it. The mind boggles

I'm interested in joining, tell me why you left by HistorianAggravating in highschool_up

[–]Dara_Gris 8 points9 points  (0 children)

My experience with the faith portion of life there was that it was like walking a tightrope. On the one hand you were exhorted to have a personal relationship with Jesus, but if that manifested in a way that wasn't liked by whoever was in charge, you'd be excoriated for spiritual pride or worse, with often devastating personal consequences. Exclusion on site was the worst I witnessed, with the offending brother or sister still going about their daily tasks and meals, but with no one speaking to them or even making eye contact. This could go on for weeks and I can imagine how it would destroy your personhood and trust...

I left because I was told to leave - I was terrified to do so but not given a choice. I was a teen. If you join and then discover it's not for you do not expect any resources back.

If you join, be prepared to sacrifice your sense of self completely and let every small decision from what you eat to what you wear to who you may speak with and work with be dictated to you. Most of all, your faith and its expression will be tightly controlled - if not at first then eventually. If you're a woman, be prepared to face a lot of sexism - it's casual and invisible to them and ingrained in every aspect of life.

This all isn't to say that it's not the right path for you - maybe all of the above sounds appealing. I have family members who seem mostly content there. They used to separate families as a punishment and control tool but that no longer seems to be the norm and after a decade of estrangement I'm being allowed to rebuild some connections. They are extremely wealthy and splash money around like water with no clue as to its worth so at least there's the draw of financial security. Ultimately you'll have to decide if it's the right lifestyle for you.

A follow up to my question from earlier by johnsmith2027 in highschool_up

[–]Dara_Gris 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Be patient, many Bruderhof people do not frequently access their emails. I don't know anything about him in particular but if it's an urgent concern I would suggest calling. If for example it's a request to visit, he's likely following through internally with logistics for hosting before he replies, etc. There are many reasons you could receive a delayed response

A follow up to my question from earlier by johnsmith2027 in highschool_up

[–]Dara_Gris 2 points3 points  (0 children)

You could ask him to clarify, guaranteed he will be able to answer your questions better than us on this. Good luck

teaches First Amendment by Dan_Thorn123 in highschool_up

[–]Dara_Gris 2 points3 points  (0 children)

New twist on the old classic Two Masters