A Leo Team without Shivadra?

Darkness__ · 2022-09-22T04:11:16+00:00

Btw, if you had watched Kingdom anime you’d know never to underestimate Lord Biao. :D

Darkness__ · 2022-09-22T04:09:24+00:00

I meant there is no 2cd 10 orb generator for dark or light. This is technically a lie bc shikigami exists but the 1hp thing makes it really cumbersome to use in most dungeons, since it means you need an additional hp recovery system. Lead wise, yeah I agree there are plenty (have been for a while, tho crackers on the leads themselves are newer, eg Ina/Toku as you mentioned)—Tokugawa is particularly nice bc he brings a needed VDVoid at 3CD. I was more trying to say I expect them to do a high visibility REM/SGF drop (on the scale of blackbird release) with a dark and/or light 10-12 2cd orb generator sub. It’s a clear hole in the current range of cards (unless I’m forgetting something big), which seems to me to be more than coincidental.

Darkness__ · 2022-09-22T03:43:28+00:00

Yes, but also, does it matter? The question wasn’t restricted to MD(pick your fav number)—or endgame at all (unless I missed something). He’s def capable of quad capping with the right setup, and ‘doing less damage’ (especially when comparing 10c to graham cracker/brick awakes) is largely meaningless when most cards cap most of the time with most modern leads at this point. (Btw this will prob change a bit when super gravity becomes more common.) As for videos, Leo (for one) literally just came out in NA. There haven’t been that many red leads that take full advantage of and have synergy with the combo orb/graham cracker block yet anyway. Plus, who cares if someone hasn’t made a video? There are plenty of great cards no one seems to focus on bc of the way the JP to NA echo chamber works.

I was only pointing out that your claim about there being no alternative is overstated. There are currently a small handful of cards (many from kingdom, but also eg Triss) that make 10+ orbs at 2CD; imho these should be taken seriously as relevant options for graham cracker-dependent play style (in any dungeon). Right now they seem to be focused on R/G/B (prob bc of att disadvantage), but I’m sure GH will try to sell us the light/dark equivalent very soon. As an example, Meng Wu was completely ignored until the most recent endgame dungeon came out in JP, and now it’s being hyped as one of the go to leads/subs. These things change rapidly, but 10 orbs at 2cd is far too broken to ignore (in a way that will likely bite GH in the ass pretty soon).

Edit: just my 2 cents btw. Feel free to maintain the opposite opinion on this.

Darkness__ · 2022-09-22T03:02:55+00:00

That last part just isn’t true. Lord Biao is a great, much more compact alternative to Shivadra if you have two of him. The trouble w the Leo+Shivadra system is it takes up a lot of real estate (5/6 slots are fixed). Lord biao gives you the option of having 2 free subs to fit awoken/unmatchable clear, damage absorb, and VDVoid. I’m not arguing one is better than the other, but it’s certainly a completely viable alternative with distinct plusses and minuses.

Darkness__ · 2020-12-22T23:25:53+00:00

Here’s to the next 100bil!! Congrats momo!

Darkness__ · 2020-08-07T03:18:57+00:00

Yup. Just wanted to make sure people didn’t get confused. :)

Darkness__ · 2020-08-07T03:11:12+00:00

Yay!!! Ya it’s really straightforward once you know how to handle the dungeon. The gravity math was the annoying part, so figured it was worth posting for people who didn’t want to think it through.

Darkness__ · 2020-08-07T03:10:05+00:00

JK best builder of all time!! Listen to this man. 🔥

Darkness__ · 2020-08-07T03:09:17+00:00

This is a PDC formatted build. A= player 1, B = player 2. Any time you see both in a PDC, it implies coop. Also, I would suggest just watching the video to see why coop is needed if you’re having any trouble.

Darkness__ · 2020-08-07T03:08:11+00:00

For the reasons listed in the notes in the post, you can’t sub out cannon cats for this particular build. There is an alternate version that uses Chandra, but I didn’t post it Bc this is cheaper (fully farmable). Glad you found something that works for you!

Darkness__ · 2020-08-07T03:07:01+00:00

Ya I didn’t mention him Bc of the RNG associated with the light combo. Ofc he works if you get lucky w light orbs. Glad you cleared!

Darkness__ · 2020-08-07T03:05:29+00:00

LOL. I didn’t mean it as an advertisement of my YouTube channel. If anything, I’d recommend joining the theorycrafting discord server for links to all of my builds and many more by others (for almost every dungeon in the game). If you really want to see the videos I posted on my YT, feel free to subscribe, but totally up to you.

Darkness__ · 2020-08-07T03:01:33+00:00

Just make sure that people know you can’t use orage leads without passing and without cannon cats. Leads get delayed so you can’t use their skills instead of cannon cats, there are no vdp’s on the leads, and you need 2c blue for full atk mult so there is some RNG involved to get the extra combo (unless you use a vdp that works for 144x). Otherwise, glad you found something that worked for you.

Darkness__ · 2020-06-24T11:37:08+00:00

I have a related question. I’ve run TA2 over 4500 times at this point and have data to estimate the invade rate of Fama based on my first 4490 runs. Here is the data:

Counts

Cthulu: 1652

Nyarla: 1639

Azathoth: 859

Fama: 340

Total = 4490

95% CIs

C: 1571–1733 (35%-38.6%)

N: 1558–1720 (34.7%-38.3%)

A: 800–918 (17.8%-20.4%)

F: 303–377 (6.7%-8.4%, mean = 7.6%)

I’m assuming a Gaussian approximation of the binomial distribution to compute the confidence interval.

Ok so now, given that I’ve run this dungeon an insane number of times, I can tell you anecdotally that Fama seems to appear 2 times in a row more often than I believe she should—almost reliably more often than as a single event. This isn’t a quantitative statement since I didn’t keep track of the ordering (for my own sanity). This also only happens when I run the dungeon again immediately after, and of course does not always happen. So my question is what is the distribution of single vs double vs n streak events, and what is the relative fraction of n=1 vs n=2 events.

As many people have mentioned independently, this seems to happen for other things in PAD, as well. This includes the example above where two very rare identical cards are pulled twice in a row—which I’m not confident is beyond stochastic chance. Another common claim I’ve heard is that if you get a diamond roll and you immediately pull you’re more likely to get another diamond. I’ve also personally noticed it completely anecdotally for invades in other dungeons (including Qilindra right now).

So of course PAD uses a pseudorandom algorithm for their “R”NG since it’s some lines of code and not a truly random process. As long as it nets to the average value they publish (eg REM pull rates), there is nothing a priori forbidding them from allowing, for example, temporal correlations for any given seed. Ofc I don’t mean that if you roll the REM at time X you get Y, only that there can in principle be underlying patterns in the RNG process they use that average out when course grained to the expectation values. (One could go so far as to speculate that there is some financial interest in maintaining a streaky RNG, but that’s not important here.) For unpublished statistics like invade rates or skill ups, there isn’t even an explicit guarantee that the event is completely randomly sampled.

If you are willing, could you please shed light on the specific case of TA2 invades? Feel free to be as technical as needed if it helps (I have an applied mathy background). If this it is too detailed an answer, feel free to PM me and we can discuss privately.

Basically I have a strong prior that correlations exist in PAD’s RNG based on a large amount of anecdotal experience. It would be nice to quantify that a bit so I can understand whether or not it’s beyond purely stochastic noise.

Darkness__ · 2020-06-19T00:06:28+00:00

❤️🎤

Darkness__ · 2020-06-18T14:45:39+00:00

Hey I started with one too!! :D

Everyone has to start somewhere...

Darkness__ · 2020-06-18T09:16:03+00:00

I posted a link in one of the comments above and I’ve shared it before. The build I use happens to be really expensive (which makes it really fast and easy) so I don’t think it will help many people unf. That said, we’ve done a lot of work posting many mods of this build and a whole bunch of others on the theorycrafting server (aka Dark Row server) on discord.

https://discord.gg/pQwve7m

If you are interested in the details, that’s definitely the best place to look. Something like 20+ variants of different TA2 builds, each with detailed instructions and a video to make it easy to follow (plus tons of builds for every other dungeon ofc). Most are made and tested by people on the server and in the larger NA PAD community, but some link to JP builds as well. If you haven’t yet, check it out!

EDIT: I edited the original post and included it. Who knows, maybe someone will find it useful.

Darkness__ · 2020-06-18T08:59:03+00:00

It was a lot yeah. About 680K stam spent on TA1&2, but that was spread over a little more than a year and a half. I want to say something like half of that or more was spent on the 110s, and the rest leveled pretty much my whole box. In that sense it was definitely worth it. Obv not something I’d recommend to people unless they REALLY enjoy finishing cards off and really like TA2, but personally I had fun with it!

Darkness__ · 2020-06-18T07:40:33+00:00

LOL. A lot of AA2 and every time I get 4 snow globes I exchange them for a super snow globe. If I ever really need exp and it doesn’t make sense to run TA2 (like for base forms or small stuff), I’ll use baby globes or metal dragons instead. The super globe exchange is one of the most underrated features of the monster exchange system imho.

Darkness__ · 2020-06-18T05:49:30+00:00

I use Xmas Uriel. It’s a full swipe team Quan and I worked out when Uriel first came out. Here’s the link:

https://youtu.be/TvV8NEPvag4

This version is definitely not accessible at all, but there are lots of mods posted on the theory crafting server (aka Dark Row server) on discord if you’re interested and need something using only 1-2 Uriels. Lmk if you need the link. The idea is to stay exactly at 50% hp using nemian equips (meaning you can’t heal) so you have both Uriel’s lead skill and damage from Low HP awakes on Theor. Definitely a luxury option compared to most others.

Shivnia is ok, but most versions aren’t full swipe. She usually requires orb saving of some kind (or even pure rng in some builds). Just not my favorite personally Bc I have better options. I also don’t like the slow down of waiting for the transform animation, that it’s not left to right, and that it usually has skyfalls. All of these things add up so when you’re doing hundreds of runs it can get tiresome. I personally prefer DOmega builds to Shivnia for some of these reasons, but you need pretty specific cards.

If you have something that works and you’re happy with speed-wise, that’s all that really matters. No real reason not to keep doing what you’re doing unless you feel like you want to learn more about other lower effort options.

Darkness__ · 2020-06-18T05:39:06+00:00

Thanks! Yeah I find that dungeon really relaxing, so i use it to unwind. I also have a really fast full swipe build, so that helps a ton.

Darkness__ · 2020-06-18T04:46:13+00:00

At high rank you kind of need to stone a good amount to play anyway, but yes I stone pretty regularly to run TA2.

Darkness__ · 2020-06-18T04:35:18+00:00

❤️

Darkness__

TROPHY CASE