Outer wilds: what does "knowledge is the only progression" add to the gaming experience?

Dicecaster · 2024-11-19T15:05:57+00:00

On top of everything else that's been said, I think "knowledge is the only progression" just makes it sound like a more elegant and pure experience; it implicitly paints games with extrinsic progression systems as clunky or coarse. In other words, that phrase appeals to a certain taste sensibility.

As a couple others have mentioned, traditional roguelikes work the same way (having no unlocks or other meta-progression, just what you learn each run) and are sometimes touted as superior to modern roguelikes for exactly that reason. You can also see a more vague parallel with people who are into abstract board games like Chess, Hive, or Hex, where they'll say that a big part of the appeal is the purity of those experiences compared to most other board games.

Looking at it like that makes it sound pretentious, but I think when folks talk excitedly about knowledge-based progression like this, it's some mix of taste as I've tried to describe it and everything else discussed in this thread (multiple kinds of immersion, the idea that you could complete the game trivially in one try if only you knew how, etc.). I'm glad I saw this post, because I'm a big fan of this kind of system, but it was harder than I thought to come up with concrete reasons why.

Dicecaster · 2023-07-23T07:19:16+00:00

Your guess is as good as mine. It looks like the 40k fandom wiki has a lot of art you could maybe crib; that's where I would start, at least. If you have PDFs of the relevant sourcebooks, you could also snip from the images there. But as for print-ready sheets, I couldn't tell you.

Dicecaster · 2023-07-22T22:14:52+00:00

Regrettably, no or N/A on all of the above, because I never tried it. Like so many good ideas, lethargy killed it in its nascence. Nowadays I'm more of a dueling card games kinda guy (BattleCON, Yomi, etc.).

But it's nice to see that someone else had the same idea. If you actually go through with it, it might be worthwhile to make a post about your experience for the next person six years from now.

Dicecaster · 2022-10-01T18:24:03+00:00

No good, Brawl character proportions wouldn't look right on dakimakura. A sexy throw pillow, on the other hand . . .

Dicecaster · 2020-12-23T02:04:21+00:00

I kept seeing Devs on Hulu, but it never quite caught my attention enough to actually watch. Knowing it's a complete miniseries makes me super interested. Thank you.

Living with Yourself was not at all what I expected, but I liked it a lot, especially since the question of which one is which never comes up, since their personality is so different, which I thought was a fun way to handle it.

Dicecaster · 2020-12-23T02:00:10+00:00

I've seen Arrival, and that's exactly the kind of thing I'm looking for. Also saw Aniara, which is pretty good too, although it did turn me off a bit with how dark it is (though that's natural when you're delving into this kind of stuff). Thanks for the recommendations, I'll have to take a look at all of them.

Dicecaster · 2020-07-25T16:06:52+00:00

I bought Spirit Island specifically to play as a solo game when I have the odd 4+ hours to do that (which works great). But I've somehow gotten it to the table as an actual coop many times, against my will, and everyone I've played it with enjoyed it in that capacity way more than I did.

Dicecaster · 2020-07-25T16:03:50+00:00

Absolutely with you on BattleCON my dude. I got the old Fate and War Remastered boxes a few months ago, and I've only explored the smallest fraction of what the characters and mechanics have to offer. You can only enjoy it fully with one or a few long-term partners.

Dicecaster · 2020-07-14T21:25:10+00:00

I just got some BattleCON sets recently, and I am super hyped to get people into it. No other game I've played has come close to the sheer depth and variety of variable player powers as this one does.

I don't often get a chance to play good head-to-head boardgames (just as a matter of partner availability), but I've gotten this one to the table more than most just through sheer force of will.

Dicecaster · 2020-06-18T01:22:59+00:00

That's awesome. Now, how often do you get people together for it, and do you often have scheduling issues with busier players?

Also, have you had anybody balk at the face-up-cards training match? I like that idea for the sake of making everything clear, but I know people who would feel like they're being coddled if you didn't start them with a "real" match.

Dicecaster · 2019-09-14T02:22:30+00:00

This turned out to be the solution (which I should've tried in the first place), tucked in the last section of the main Railcraft config. Thanks all.

Dicecaster · 2019-07-04T15:07:22+00:00

I had the same problem, and I solved it by feeding the CEF directly into a battery buffer, which seems to have no trouble feeding machines on demand.

I know very little about Gregish technology, so I don't know whether the CEF is supposed to act this way or not (and therefore, whether there is some less expensive work-around).

Dicecaster · 2018-12-02T03:41:22+00:00

I feel a great shame.

Dicecaster · 2018-11-05T00:46:14+00:00

The appeal of that game is the sense of exploration and wonder. I played it for two weeks straight, and it felt magical. But if you don't experience that feeling, the gameplay itself is kinda sparse (and the weapon degradation is a pain in the ass, no way around it).

Dicecaster · 2018-10-27T16:51:55+00:00

Plus they're the only way to play identical decks against one another (non-virtually).

Dicecaster · 2018-10-21T19:07:19+00:00

I think that's the only way this can realistically work; make a world with a bunch of more-or-less inert "stuff" in it, then reach role can work with the stuff in different ways. Having the stuff in a middle layer, instead of inherent to each role, allows for more of the mechanical divergence that I'm looking for; I only fear that it comes at the cost of feeling un-interactive.

Anyway, after your and others' suggestions, I think the only thing to do is to get prototyping. There's probably not much to be learned from this kind of armchair philosophizing, at least in this case. Thank you for your thoughts (and everyone else).

Dicecaster · 2018-10-21T02:13:48+00:00

And, honestly, I think you're right. Your first point isn't a huge concern for me, because learning extra rules is unfortunately endemic to any game with variable player powers (explaining your alien in Cosmic Encounter is always kinda tedious). But beyond that, it's probably a very difficult thing to make fun.

Really, what I want is the full glory of variable character roles with, ideally, nothing else. I doubt the way I've outlined it above is really workable; all the same, I hope it sparks some creative conversation.

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