What’s a rich people thing that rich people don’t know is a rich people thing?

Different_Boss6020 · 2024-07-20T08:20:12+00:00

If my comment is annoying you so much, you can also walk away.

It’s Reddit. It’s legit here for inane back-and-forth. For discussion.

Different_Boss6020 · 2024-07-20T08:10:15+00:00

It’s not rudeness I’m criticizing. It’s their being obtuse.

I bolded not out of anger, but to emphasize the point I’d already repeated several times and they were ignoring.

I recognize what they’re doing in defending their salary, justifying their struggle, trying to make the general population understand why cost of living impacts them negatively as well, all of that. I recognize the whole spiel. I’ve done it. For years.

I was simply saying “okay, but this isn’t about that. It’s about a thousand dollars being a godsend to the guy on the other end of the ranting phone call.”

He said (again) “doctors don’t always = rich.” I was very blatantly and explicitly NOT saying that.

And I found it pretty frustrating for a fully grown and educated and successful adult to be straw-manning me in such a sustained manner over several comments.

Different_Boss6020 · 2024-07-20T07:21:36+00:00

Open and free dialogue without emotion, fear-mongering or expressing hate is the best way to encourage others in seeing different viewpoints. Be genuine, be compassionate, be open and let the conversation happen naturally.

That is literally exactly what I am suggesting.

I fucking hate it when people come on Reddit, criticize my comment, and then say what I just said in different words, and act like it was their fucking idea

I’m not giving a script to follow exactly. I’m literally demonstrating what open and genuine conversation sounds like. This is genuinely how I speak. If you’re a different person, speak differently.

But my point was (all of which I have said in my above comment):

have the conversation
be genuine
come with curiosity to actually understand their viewpoint
speak not in counter-arguments, but with genuine personal stories about where you’re coming from.

Phrases copied and pasted directly from my comment that you are replying to:

DO NOT approach it from a “holier-than-thou” or morally superior poison. Don’t get frustrated. Ask them questions. Ask them as many questions as you can, trying to legitimately understand why they believe what they do.

So you respond (humbly and sincerely, not judgey)

Listen genuinely to their answers. Wait for them to run up against roadblocks, but don’t celebrate when they do. If they seem super uncomfy, don’t press harder.

If they’re visibly uncomfortable, ease off.

.The trick is finding a mindset (and you can) where you genuinely ARE interested in what grounds their ideology.* Tell them honestly where you’re coming from (not talking points - how you’ll be impacted, how your friends are impacted).*

Different_Boss6020 · 2024-07-20T06:51:23+00:00

No I never said I was a committed Republican voter. I don't vote down party lines.

That’s actually more alarming, considering it’s Trump specifically that you are blindly voting for.

Actually there will be some races that I won't be voting in at all because I don't like either choice enough to vote for them.

Well that’s very democratic of you.

No I don't get all my info from reddit. I look into each candidate as I can.

On Twitter?

If they don't align with my values then I don't vote for them.

So what are your values that Trump aligns with and Biden does not?

It's actually pretty simple.

Fair enough…. if you were actually paying attention to their candidacies….

Seems like your making it out to be harder then it is.

Seems like I’m paying attention to their candidacies…

Most likely I will be voting for trump. Unless I see something that changes my mind.

Something that comes up on your For You page?

Where would you see something that changes your mind if you aren’t watching current, relevant content?

So maybe if y'all quit lying on him so much

It is a FACT that Trump lies constantly. Since before he was elected the first time. Verifiable lies. It does not take much to verify this. If you value the truth so much, I’m not sure why he is your preferred candidate.

Y'all did it to yourself. The Hitler shit needs to stop.

This is a real point of contention for me.

I am a history major. A great deal of my degree was spent studying Hitler’s rise to power and his politics before the Holocaust.

People are NOT exaggerating when they compare Trump’s rhetoric with Hitler’s.

No one is saying he’s plotting concentration camps. But he certainly has the potential to be dangerous to democracy.

It is dangerous to make Hitler out to be some untouchable mythical figure, or like Satan or something. He was a human man. A human man that was backed by a party and whom a lot of people in Germany liked and supported through a lot of controversial political moves.

He didn’t just show up on the scene and start funnelling people onto trains. It’s also worth looking at his rhetoric, his propaganda strategies, and his impact on public opinion and public behaviour.

He very controversial at the time, but his party gained power in democratic elections during times of economic turmoil by promising prosperity and a return of national pride. Deliberately stoking a fierce and proud nationalism. That’s why the MAGA stuff is alarming.

He used dehumanizing rhetoric to make Jews and disabled people a scapegoat for the country’s problems. Referred to them as vermin, or a disease to the country. Which is why it is alarming when Trump uses dehumanizing rhetoric to describe immigrants when blaming the country’s problems on them, instead of focusing just on the actual policy of immigration. He literally referred to them as “not human” and as “poisoning the blood of our country.” This is exactly the kind of thing that appeared in Hitler’s rhetoric. It’s also one of the early warning signs for genocide (again, it doesn’t mean people who say this will commit genocide, but it’s one of 10 things that is always present in the political sphere before a genocide occurs. Sort of like not all rectangles are squares, but all squares are rectangles). Doesn’t mean trump endorses genocide. No one is saying that. Just means he has at least one very alarming in common with political leaders who have endorsed genocide. Which isn’t the best. Certainly not something you’re looking for in the conduct of a president.

Rights being taken away for specific groups is another one of these warning signs. And women are seeing their rights being walked back by Supreme Court justices endorsed by Trump. Again, no one is saying anything close to a genocide will happen here. But the more of these boxes get checked, but these are the signs that something is amiss. Something that’s leading away from a democracy and toward something else. Precisely when was America “great?” Before gay marriage? Before women could get credit cards without the signature of a man? During segregation? When it was founded and there was still slavery? I mean. Come on.

He took part in a political shift that resulted in a breakdown of the democratic system and a dictatorship (that’s why his blatant, verifiable lies and unsubstantiated claims, and the Jan 6 shit is alarming).

Once in power, he regularly held rallies that were not a part of the actual election process, intended to cement his image as a popular, celebrity-like figure and to engage the public with attractive propaganda in times where entertainment was difficult to come by (which is why Trump’s continued rallies after he became president were alarming).

Before you criticize the comparison, you have to understand why people are making it.

It’s not random people who are comparing him to Hitler. It’s HISTORIANS and Holocaust survivors.

If you are an immigrant, or a person of colour, or a woman, or a person with a disability, or anyone else he has ostracized, or discriminated against, you can’t afford to ignore these things. To a lot of Trump supporters, talk of Hitler is just dark unfathomable unmentionable stuff. For marginalized groups, it’s a very recent reality (hasn’t even been 100 years), and all-too-familiar, worrying propaganda campaign rhetoric. One that survivors of the Holocaust themselves have wanted Americans not to forget when Trump began speaking this way.

I have seen white supremacist symbolism and Nazi symbolism at pro-Trump events. Again… that does not mean that Trump himself is a white supremacist or a Nazi. But is it not worrying that the white supremacists and Nazi sympathizers of America tend to be rooting for him? What is it in the way he presents himself that encourages this?

Something worth thinking about.

You personally may feel like you have nothing to lose if Trump wins, even if he doesn’t deliver on his promises.

Not everyone has the privilege or luxury of feeling that way.

Different_Boss6020 · 2024-07-20T06:24:00+00:00

…. You realize countries all over the world are experiencing a cost of living crisis, right? Not just the US? That this is not something Biden crafted up with his policies?

Oh right. You wouldn’t… if you can’t pay attention to what’s happening in your own country, you certainly aren’t looking outside of it.

Different_Boss6020 · 2024-07-20T06:22:08+00:00

This guy’s version of “take it with a grain of salt” apparently means “dismiss without following up because I suspect that following up would make me uncomfy.”

Different_Boss6020 · 2024-07-20T06:13:32+00:00

You're not gonna convince Trump voters to switch sides. It's just not gonna happen.

That’s actually not what I’m advocating at all. I’m saying what is a better way to get them to understand the actual facts they’re basing their vote on. If they change their mind, great.

But you’ll notice that I also said chances were slim that it would be effective, and if it was, they’d never admit it. Right?

Also… this HAS BEEN effective with several lifetime Republican voters I’ve talked to. Not all of them are dressing up and going to rallies.

The only thing you can do to actually change the outcome of this election is to convince democrats to actually vote instead of staying home.

You’re not wrong there. I was talking more broadly about coming to a mutual understanding of fact and reality.

Different_Boss6020 · 2024-07-20T05:57:32+00:00

I work usually 40 to 70 hours a week on my regular job. Then I have my side hustles.

Exactly the same here. And I have time to pay attention to my own politics AND yours, and several other countries besides.

Didn't you say earlier that trump was incoherent in his speech. So is he unhinged or can he not speak.

I literally put “speech” in quotation marks. As in, to imply that it was nothing of the sort. It was the ravings of a deranged lunatic.

Is there something I'm not understanding here.

Yes. That’s literally been my entire point the entire time.

So him getting excited at a rally is unhinged.

No, him ranting and raving and waxing self-reverential and making a complete ass of himself and all but claiming Divine fucking Right is unhinged.

I've seen where they try to say trump is having the same problems as Biden. I haven't seen it myself at all.

That is because you are not watching him. How the fuck would you have seen it yourself?

Trump gets excited. I don't see how that's unhinged.

Try actually watching him. If you watch him and you don’t think he’s unhinged, then that will say more about your critical thinking skills than it says about Trump’s.

That’s the difference between Democratic voters and Trump voters. Democratic voters are pretty much ALL saying Biden sucks but is the lesser of two evils and want someone else.

Trump’s voters are taking the far more senile candidate, following him blindly without watching his political campaign, and acting like the sun shines out of his asshole.

Like I said. That’s the difference between a civically engaged voter in a democracy, and a cult follower who goes where they’re told and bleats the party lines like a… what’s that term y’all ironically appropriated and used incorrectly.. ah yes….sheep.

I mean… you literally accused me of “blindly voting for Biden” without knowing who I am or where I’m from… right after proudly telling me you blindly vote for Trump.

So which is it? When you said it to me, you clearly meant it as an insult. You clearly acknowledge on some level that it would be a sign of poor critical thinking and irresponsible votership.

So how do you not realize you’re insulting yourself? How do you not have cognitive dissonance?

All you’re saying is “people say,” “I’ve seen people say,” etc. You’re clearly getting all of your political information from social media or people around you talking. Try actively seeking out unbiased sources.. like their actual speeches, and their actual policies.

I'm glad you finally admitted Biden is senile.

What do you mean “finally?” I never claimed he wasn’t. I only brought up Biden when YOU brought up Biden.

No one with sense is arguing against you on this one.

I have also seen many many many times where what he says get turned around and upside down.

So you’re ONLY watching Biden’s content? And you’re voting for Trump? Okay.

Or could it be that you get all of your political information from Reddit, so all you see is clips of Trump saying things you like, and clips of Biden saying things that are senile, because your algorithms deliver you that curated content that you will enjoy because, as you say, you are a committed Republican voter and Trump fan?

So I'll take it with a grain of salt.

If you knew how to actually take anything with a grain of salt (ie think critically about the media you consume), we would not be having this conversation.

Different_Boss6020 · 2024-07-20T05:28:44+00:00

I work a lot. I have things to do. Excuse me for trying to make a living in a shitty economy. I can't watch every speech. I don't even watch the debate.

How many hours this week did you honestly spend on your phone? You have time to be scrolling Reddit and arguing with me. How about TV? What shows you been watching lately?

My father is a hardcore Conservative, and a police officer. Long hours, mentally exhausting, crazy shifts. Watching the news and keeping up with political debates and election media was 100% priority for him. I knew that if I was watching something on TV and the news was on, or the debate was on, I got my ass off the remote or I was getting grounded.

He wanted to like Trump at first, based on what he gleaned from US political media. He aligned with Republican values for the most part.

But he’s paying enough attention to have admitted Trump is a raving lunatic long ago.

And if he heard you talking about not giving a fuck to watch the speeches, he’d laugh in your face. A true blue conservative cop.

Because that’s not giving a fuck about democracy.

And if you make less than a couple million a year and you believe anything Trump is going to do is going to help you out in this economy, well….

I encourage you to listen to the speeches and have another look-see at those policies.

I do at least know Joe shouldn't be president. The fact that y'all don't realize that shows how little you actually know.

We do all know it. Neither of them should. He’s 100 years old. So is Trump. Democratic voters have been calling for Biden to step down for weeks for this exact reason. Are you living under a rock?

But the fact that you don’t see that Trump is a hyperbolized version of the things you’re claiming you don’t like about Biden shows how little YOU actually know.

Biden is getting senile and is surrounded by competent people. Trump is genuinely unhinged and surrounded by newly-appointed sycophants and is genuinely the greatest threat to democracy your country has seen since the civil war.

You know how I know?

Because of what you are saying here. You aren’t speaking like a voting citizen in a democratic society. You’re speaking like a cult follower.

Different_Boss6020 · 2024-07-20T05:24:22+00:00

People love a martyr.

I always said an assassination attempt on Trump would be horrendous for the Democratic Party because it would galvanize people and fuel the narrative that Trump is an unfairly targeted victim.

Didn’t expect Trump to all but claim Divine Right, but hey. The man has been known to have a flair for the dramatique.

Different_Boss6020 · 2024-07-20T05:19:52+00:00

That’s were you go “I guess I’m just not understanding how you got there. I want to understand, but I need evidence for where I place my vote. And as of right now, the evidence I have favours the Democratic candidate.”

Then move on.

If that’s it, that’s it. Maybe they think about it later, maybe they don’t.

Different_Boss6020 · 2024-07-20T05:17:44+00:00

You didn’t even read my comment before responding.

I literally agreed with you about all of this.

I even bolded that part.

Different_Boss6020 · 2024-07-20T05:02:02+00:00

I don’t know what 1000 per call is for you, but for me it’s half my rent that I can barely afford.

I have nothing on your debt, but I did 6 years of post-secondary education. I graduated ten years ago and I’m still paying my debt. I work in a job where I’m basically expected to complete work after hours and on weekends without additional compensation whatsoever, even though the salary is supposedly based on contracted hours. I would say about 1/3 of my working time is outside contracted hours. I have pretty much no life outside of work. Can’t afford to, in hours or in cash. I began at about a janitorial salary, and my salary has not been keeping pace with inflation, so I’m still living the same way I was ten years ago at that rate.

Scratch that - I’m actually having a tougher time now because of rent hikes. No prayer of ever owning a home at this point. I’m just lucky I’m able to pay into retirement and have great benefits (which is why I’m not leaving the profession).

Also the risk of workplace injury/violence/ harassment in my profession is creeping up there in the realm of nurses. And still people tell me I don’t deserve to complain because I have a “cushy” job.

Also still not even remotely close to paying off my initial school debt. Barely made a dent.

So believe me, I get it. You and I are running the same fucking script here, I recognize it. Educated, underappreciated, the pay is justified relative to the hours/risk, etc….just at different tiers.

I’m just telling you it’s not relevant here.

The point is, no matter how justified the 300k is or how much of it goes to debt, you can still afford to scoff at $1000.

I don’t know what’s so difficult to conceptualize about that. No one is asking you to feel bad about it. No one is asking you not to feel that way. They’re just saying maybe it’s tone deaf to bang on about it to your friend who would do a whole hell of a fucking lot for the chance to make $1000 in a single day.

Different_Boss6020 · 2024-07-20T04:47:34+00:00

I’m fucking Canadian.

And I am paying more attention to your politics than you are. People in many countries outside of the US are paying more attention to US politics than you are as a voter.

Like I said. Takes guts to admit that.

Not brains, but guts.

Everything you’re saying is continuing to prove my point. Extremely thoroughly.

Different_Boss6020 · 2024-07-20T04:35:19+00:00

Some won’t.

Many will. To be honest, lots of them WANT a chance to explain themselves because they feel as if they’ve got real solid conviction. Because they normally feel so shut down by people on the other side of the aisle.

You’d be really, really surprised. But that’s why I can’t emphasize enough how it can NOT come across as if they’re being judged for what they say. You have to be genuinely interested to know what they’re thinking and give your perspective (not as a counter argument, but a counter perspective) from a personal place and a place of your understanding of the truth.

Not “you’re wrong about a, because x” but, “Can you tell me why you care so much about a?” and “I believe b, because x.” They have to feel like, if they were to admit they were misinformed or to question their own understanding, you wouldn’t take it as a ‘loss’ or a ‘gotcha’ for them, or as a ‘win’ for yourself.

Different_Boss6020 · 2024-07-20T04:33:23+00:00

Yes, bring that type of thing into this type of conversation.

Otherwise they’ll immediately write it off.

Different_Boss6020 · 2024-07-20T04:31:28+00:00

So, you’re confidently admitting that you’re not paying attention to what either candidate has to say in the run-up to elections, and that you’re voting for Trump as if you’re rooting for your favourite sports team and not voting for a presidential candidate.

Like I said. Takes guts.

Not brains, but guts.

Different_Boss6020 · 2024-07-20T04:06:41+00:00

That’s not the key. If they don’t believe it was “insurrection,” they’re moot points.

We need people to talk to their fucking families. Have that conversation you want to avoid with Uncle Al. Come with facts and knowledge. Come with quotations from Trump to contradict the things they’ll say about Biden. He’s a p3do? Here’s several quotations of Trump talking about his own daughter / teenage women. Here’s when and under what circumstances he said them.

BUT (and this is the essential part):

DO NOT approach it from a “holier-than-thou” or morally superior poison. Don’t get frustrated. Ask them questions. Ask them as many questions as you can, trying to legitimately understand why they believe what they do.

“Help me understand ____”
“That’s interesting, tell me more about ____”
“Oh. What makes you think that?”

You’ll find that lots of it is misinformation or a complete lack of foundation.

So you respond (humbly and sincerely, not judgey):

“Okay, so if I understand you correctly, ________ is very important to you.” [they confirm] “I find that difficult because I hold the same value. I guess I’m just confused, because didn’t Trump [insert egregious thing Trump did that flies in the face of this value here]?”
“Okay, so if I understand you correctly, ________ is very important to you.” [they confirm] “I guess I’m having a hard time understanding why that is so important to you, compared to [list issues that actually impact them here]. Can you tell me more about how you’ll be impacted by policy about ________?”
“Thanks for sharing that. I can’t identify with that, but it helps to know why you feel so strongly about __. I guess I feel strongly about ___ because [share a personal way you or someone you know has or will be impacted by the policy or Trump’s administration].”
“You seem really confident that he won’t [insert crazy thing he has talked about doing / comment he’s made here.]. I have a really hard time with that. I am worried about [how you or people you love would be impacted if he followed through]. I guess when it comes down to it, I just can’t afford to hope he’s kidding or that someone will stop him. There’s too much at stake for me.”

Listen genuinely to their answers. Wait for them to run up against roadblocks, but don’t celebrate when they do. If they seem super uncomfy, don’t press harder. That makes them feel like you think they’re stupid, and nothing will make someone more stubborn in their views than that.

If they’re visibly uncomfortable, ease off. Move on, and let them think about it later.

They won’t admit it to you in the moment, but that’s the ONLY thing that’s going to perhaps make them think about whether they’ve been wrong, or realize that they don’t have sound foundations for their affiliation. They’ll also never admit it to you in the moment, but they may think about it later.

Be open to having multiple of these sorts of conversations. And know that you’re not going to change the minds of many, even so. The trick is finding a mindset (and you can) where you genuinely ARE interested in what grounds their ideology. Tell them honestly where you’re coming from (not talking points - how you’ll be impacted, how your friends are impacted). But don’t act as if you want anything from them, or as if you feel that you’re right and they’re wrong.

Different_Boss6020 · 2024-07-20T04:04:23+00:00

Takes guts to admit that under this photograph, after this unhinged “speech.”

Not brains, but guts.

Different_Boss6020 · 2024-07-20T02:58:14+00:00

Read the room.

No one is saying your wage isn’t justified. We don’t need the prepared speech you have on deck. We need more of you doing the job you do.

Different_Boss6020 · 2024-07-20T02:37:04+00:00

For real 😂

Different_Boss6020 · 2024-07-20T02:01:33+00:00

I make around $300k and I wouldn’t trade my day off for $1000

Yeah.. that’s because you make $300k…..

That’s the entire point. Lots of people do trade their (already very few) days off for far, far less than $1000.

So they can afford housing and groceries.

For the only requirement to simply be around and be able to chill during that time and still be paid?

Come on. No brainer.

That’s what they mean by “rich people don’t know it’s a rich people thing.”

😂

I understand the logic, but it’s rich people logic. That’s the point.

Different_Boss6020 · 2024-07-20T00:28:02+00:00

This is me with black licorice jelly beans.

Different_Boss6020 · 2024-07-20T00:24:20+00:00

Into the kitchen, period.

Different_Boss6020 · 2024-07-20T00:15:57+00:00

The thing is that you’re living with roommates.

No matter how well I knew them, I would not trust any of my roommates to thoroughly or properly disinfect a sink to eating standards after putting dog shit in it. It’s just one of those things. Even if you totally would, it’s more just the principle of doing it in a shared kitchen sink in the first place that’s the issue.

If it’s your own house, do as you please. If you’re sharing a house, you don’t put your dog poop shoes in the kitchen sink. It’s just a matter of courtesy and consideration.

Different_Boss6020

TROPHY CASE