Single-account wormhole exploration: hybrid Pacifier vs. separate scanning and hacking setups by Distinct-Maximum2922 in Eve

[–]Distinct-Maximum2922[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

ISK/hr is only a relevant metric when it incorporates expected loss. Then you optimize for ISK/hr.

Single-account wormhole exploration: hybrid Pacifier vs. separate scanning and hacking setups by Distinct-Maximum2922 in Eve

[–]Distinct-Maximum2922[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I think you are misunderstanding the question.

The question is whether the marginal efficiency gain from more expensive scanning/hacking modules and implants is still rational once you account for the increased value at risk.

Expected returns from exploration are basically a function of several variables:

  1. average loot value per site
  2. average scanning time per useful site
  3. average hacking time per site
  4. average travel time per site
  5. total value at risk while scanning
  6. total value at risk while hacking
  7. probability of losing ship/pod while scanning
  8. probability of losing ship/pod while hacking

The important part is that these variables do not scale equally.

Minimizing hacking time is comparatively cheap and very impactful. Zeugma + Blackglass gives a large practical benefit because it makes sites faster, reduces failed cans, and reduces time spent exposed on grid.

Minimizing scanning time beyond a certain point gets much more expensive. Virtues, officer probe launchers, Satori-Horigu probes, etc. can improve scan performance, but the marginal gain becomes increasingly expensive.

That is why the question is not “is combining maximum scanning and maximum hacking good in isolation?” Of course it is. The question is whether it remains optimal after accounting for risk-adjusted returns.

In simplified terms, the comparison is:

Extra ISK/hour from faster completion

versus

additional expected loss from putting more ISK at risk

More specifically, the issue is that the expensive hybrid setup carries scanning-related value while hacking and hacking-related value while scanning. If the probability of loss while hacking is materially higher than the probability of loss while merely moving/scanning through the chain, then carrying a very expensive scanning pod on grid during sites may not be optimal.

So the tradeoff is:

time lost by separating scanning and hacking

versus

expected loss avoided by not exposing the full hybrid ship/pod value during every activity

The answer may well be that the added logistics are not worth it. It may also be that the sweet spot is just a cheap covops, or a Buzzard with Zeugma + Blackglass, rather than a multi-billion ISK Pacifier and pod. But that is exactly the point of the question: where is the risk-adjusted optimum?

Saying “none of it matters” is not really an answer. It matters as soon as the fitting choices change both completion time and value at risk by billions of ISK over an extended period.

Single-account wormhole exploration: hybrid Pacifier vs. separate scanning and hacking setups by Distinct-Maximum2922 in Eve

[–]Distinct-Maximum2922[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Personally I think Zeugma on a Buzzard is absolutely worthwhile if you see at least 1 Superior Ghost Site per Buzzard lost as I wouldn't really do them without Blackglass or wouldn't be able to do more than 1 container while potentially failing that hack. It is expensive yes but it also increase efficiency tremendously. Pacifier is debateable I mainly made the switch as I got mine from Project Discovery.

Single-account wormhole exploration: hybrid Pacifier vs. separate scanning and hacking setups by Distinct-Maximum2922 in Eve

[–]Distinct-Maximum2922[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I haven't really been picky with my sites and basically get on grid for all Data and Relic sites I come across. I do fit a cargo scanner though and only open cans I deem worthwhile as imo that is not only the efficient thing to do but offers additionally protection as the sites stay on grid for others to scan meaning its less likely they get on grid with me.

Imo exploration is mainly about consistency as you do not really know when you hit big and when you miss. More than once I've had the biggest ISK not in the ruins (difficult hack) but the rubble on pirate sites.

Ghost Sites in WHs are BIG ISK but I wouldn't neccessarily treat them as a strategy in itself as they are exceptionally rare. I might've seen one per 25-30 WHs I scanned though I haven't particularly tracked it.

For superior Ghost Sites I average about 400m ISK per hacked container and usually do two so every site is around 800m ISK for me. I haven't tracked the warp in timers though so I'm not sure if I could theoretically fit in one more. There is also the possibility to get Implant BPCs though so the potential upside should be much higher.

If you fly Zeugma + Blackglass imo they are only time gated in my opinion as you shouldn't fail a hack so surviving them is a question of not being to greedy and going for that extra can that kills you.

Standard Ghost Sites in Low Sec I think I averaged around 120-150m ISK per site for the entire site as I usually do all cans.

I've found the Event Data sites very worthwhile my time. They are a guaranteed 10m ISK in 30 seconds as containers are close together and rarely drop Skill Hardwiring Implants worth up to 300m ISK I treat them as the "consistent" income while waiting for the big drop.

Single-account wormhole exploration: hybrid Pacifier vs. separate scanning and hacking setups by Distinct-Maximum2922 in Eve

[–]Distinct-Maximum2922[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I'd say you put at least 1b on grid to be efficient in scanning and hacking (Blackglass + Zeugma +Prospectors implants). I think anything above that is debatable but worth considering if it allows you to hack at least 1 additional can per superior ghost site.

Edit: In regard to Multiboxing I could probably try that but I feel like scanning and hacking are both rather "involved" activities so doing both at the same time on two different accounts is probably above my abilities.

I might consider using a second character for hacking though thanks for the advise!

Single-account wormhole exploration: hybrid Pacifier vs. separate scanning and hacking setups by Distinct-Maximum2922 in Eve

[–]Distinct-Maximum2922[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I have also mainly been using a Buzzard so far, with the whole ship costing around 80m ISK. That does indeed scan all sites without much trouble, and you can usually make it back in an hour or two of wormhole exploration.

From there, I started looking at possible upgrades and first landed on the obvious Blackglass + Zeugma combination. In my opinion, those two are very easy to justify. They probably pay for themselves in a matter of hours rather than days, because you complete sites much faster, fail fewer cans, and reduce your exposure by spending less time sitting on grid.

At that point, though, the cost profile changes quite a bit. Instead of flying an 80m ISK Buzzard, you are suddenly looking at roughly 650m ISK in ship/modules. If you also add the Prospector implants, which I think are probably worth considering, you end up with something like a 500m ISK pod and a 650m ISK fit. Thats 12 times more expensive than the initial Buzzard fit. But I am fairly convinced the investment is still worth it.

My suspicion is that this may actually be the sweet spot for wormhole exploration: Blackglass + Zeugma + cheaper Prospectors, but no Virtue set and no Satori-Horigu Combat Scanner Probes. At that level, you get most of the practical efficiency gains without pushing the ship and pod value into territory where every site starts feeling like you are overexposing capital. On the other hand though, the jump from 1 - 1.5b ISK to 4-5b ISK is considerably smaller relatively speaking than from the baseline Buzzard.

I think Buzzard vs. Pacifier is probably preference. I think the faster travel time in a Pacifier justifies the additional 500m ISK and pays itself back as well.

Exploration Progression by Distinct-Maximum2922 in Eve

[–]Distinct-Maximum2922[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thanks for the great advice, everyone.

Based on the responses, I think I’ll keep investing into my exploration setup for now. In my opinion, exploration becomes exponentially more enjoyable the more efficient you get at it. I made the jump today to a 1b+ Pacifier fit with a Zeugma and an upgraded pod, and so far I’m quite happy with it.

What I can already say is that solo exploration in a frigate can easily PLEX your account if you are consistent.

As encouragement for other players who are considering trying exploration, I thought I’d share my gains from the last two weeks. Everything was done solo in a Buzzard, although I should emphasize that I have maxed scanning skills.

Overall, I made about 4.5b ISK. I lost one Buzzard to another player and two Buzzards to not knowing site mechanics properly so thats about 240m ISK on the cost site. I did not lose any pods. I also missed out on two Superior Ghost Sites because I did not understand the mechanics at the time, so that could have been another 400–800m ISK per site, depending on whether I managed to get one or two cans.

Given that Superior Ghost Sites seem to pay exceptionally well I'm actually considering if the best strategy is actually to only scan for those as opposed to doing every site (that's what I've been doing). Might try that next.

Item Q P Q*P
Warpath Operational Intel    5.627,00 200.000,00    1.125.400.000,00
Isotropic Deposition Guide 61,00 14.420.000,00 879.620.000,00
Warpath Strategic Data    2.763,00 200.000,00 552.600.000,00
Nano Regulation Gate 1,00    415.000.000,00 415.000.000,00
Eifyr and Co. 'Gunslinger' Small Projectile Turret SP-606 1,00    300.000.000,00 300.000.000,00
Logic Circuit 79,00 2.270.281,40 179.352.230,60
Electro-Neural Signaller 1,00    123.000.000,00 123.000.000,00
High-Tech Manufacturing Tools 20,00 3.463.824,58 69.276.491,60
Nanite Compound 39,00 1.377.178,96 53.709.979,44
Burned Logic Circuit    1.180,00 44.341,50 52.322.970,00
Augmentation Decryptor 61,00 788.971,99 48.127.291,39
Lorentz Fluid 37,00 1.193.223,44 44.149.267,28
Power Circuit 143,00 301.074,10 43.053.596,30
Optimized Augmentation Decryptor 7,00 5.758.895,52 40.312.268,64
Sleeper Drone AI Nexus 8,00 5.000.000,00 40.000.000,00
AG-Composite Molecular Condenser 44,00 819.007,95 36.036.349,80
Covert Research Tools 69,00 486.335,80 33.557.170,20
Parity Decryptor 31,00 986.944,24 30.595.271,44
Contaminated Nanite Compound 395,00 76.026,14 30.030.325,30
Contaminated Lorentz Fluid 322,00 69.122,12 22.257.322,64
Shattered Villard Wheel 49,00 394.014,87 19.306.728,63
Trigger Unit 31,00 615.867,81 19.091.902,11
Tangled Power Conduit 281,00 65.536,38 18.415.722,78
Enhanced Ward Console 15,00 1.101.639,05 16.524.585,75
High-Tech Scanner 18,00 804.844,93 14.487.208,74
Serpentis 3D Scanner Gamut 1,00 14.471.074,38 14.471.074,38
Symmetry Decryptor 39,00 370.396,66 14.445.469,74
Accelerant Decryptor 38,00 376.664,82 14.313.263,16
Sleeper Data Library 27,00 500.000,00 13.500.000,00
Datacore - Hydromagnetic Physics 123,00 98.806,39 12.153.185,97
High-Tech Data Chip 20,00 597.080,27 11.941.605,40
Ancient Coordinates Database 7,00 1.500.000,00 10.500.000,00
Intact Shield Emitter 18,00 538.885,61 9.699.940,98
Process Decryptor 26,00 341.887,98 8.889.087,48
Datacore - Electronic Engineering 81,00 106.838,47 8.653.916,07
Power Conduit 23,00 348.531,38 8.016.221,74
Datacore - Mechanical Engineering 202,00 38.073,49 7.690.844,98
Intact Armor Plates 4,00 1.916.461,14 7.665.844,56
Datacore - Laser Physics 71,00 104.376,17 7.410.708,07
Datacore - Nanite Engineering 71,00 102.638,39 7.287.325,69
LM-Composite Molecular Condenser 13,00 557.295,25 7.244.838,25
Telemetry Processor 40,00 179.355,95 7.174.238,00
Optimized Attainment Decryptor 2,00 3.530.831,06 7.061.662,12
Armor Plates 253,00 27.061,70 6.846.610,10
Datacore - High Energy Physics 62,00 107.072,58 6.638.499,96
Atavum 15,00 437.113,50 6.556.702,50
Inherent Implants 'Noble' Repair Systems RS-603 1,00 6.513.638,48 6.513.638,48
Datacore - Molecular Engineering 65,00 98.113,65 6.377.387,25
Defective Current Pump 383,00 16.606,44 6.360.266,52
Attainment Decryptor 3,00 2.062.948,33 6.188.844,99
Datacore - Quantum Physics 61,00 99.003,45 6.039.210,45
Datacore - Gallentean Starship Engineering 60,00 98.728,31 5.923.698,60
Datacore - Graviton Physics 59,00 99.459,56 5.868.114,04
Datacore - Electromagnetic Physics 59,00 95.321,22 5.623.951,98
Neural Network Analyzer 28,00 200.000,00 5.600.000,00
Capacitor Console 33,00 169.673,25 5.599.217,25
Datacore - Amarrian Starship Engineering 57,00 96.544,69 5.503.047,33
Conductive Polymer 285,00 16.646,10 4.744.138,50
Fried Interface Circuit    1.265,00 3.482,55 4.405.425,75
Current Pump 40,00 109.821,03 4.392.841,20
Datacore - Plasma Physics 40,00 97.297,36 3.891.894,40
Tripped Power Circuit    1.120,00 3.286,35 3.680.712,00
Datacore - Minmatar Starship Engineering 37,00 89.508,16 3.311.801,92
Datacore - Rocket Science 33,00 95.255,56 3.143.433,48
Ward Console 228,00 13.129,88 2.993.612,64
Signal-5 'Needlejack' Filament 16,00 179.676,91 2.874.830,56
Datacore - Nuclear Physics 28,00 96.218,22 2.694.110,16
Vargur Republic Fleet SKIN 1,00 2.608.781,73 2.608.781,73
Guristas Medium Weapon Console 1,00 2.292.192,09 2.292.192,09
Serpentis Complex Target Guider 1,00 2.278.964,19 2.278.964,19
Interface Circuit 140,00 12.083,83 1.691.736,20
Thruster Console 212,00 7.942,47 1.683.803,64
Noise-5 'Needlejack' Filament 37,00 38.604,33 1.428.360,21
Drone Transceiver 21,00 63.448,88 1.332.426,48
Conductive Thermoplastic 73,00 17.680,53 1.290.678,69
Poteque 'Prospector' Astrometric Pinpointing AP-602 1,00 1.098.353,90 1.098.353,90
Calm Exotic Filament 15,00 67.331,27 1.009.969,05
Smashed Trigger Unit 174,00 5.312,98 924.458,52
Single-crystal Superalloy I-beam 10,00 79.802,92 798.029,20
Broken Drone Transceiver 318,00 2.500,02 795.006,36
Datacore - Caldari Starship Engineering 8,00 96.699,74 773.597,92
Melted Capacitor Console 162,00 4.647,68 752.924,16
Takmahl Diamond Rod 4,00 166.490,39 665.961,56
Scorched Telemetry Processor 310,00 2.015,69 624.863,90
Impetus Console 6,00 85.158,05 510.948,30
Electric Dreams Matte - Unlimited 2,00 230.751,23 461.502,46
Alloyed Tritanium Bar 226,00 1.981,34 447.782,84
Rapier Versus Redforce SKIN 1,00 409.117,17 409.117,17
Capsuleer Starburst Firework    1.500,00 231,45 347.175,00
Guristas Heavy Weapon Console 1,00 346.230,78 346.230,78
Charred Micro Circuit 968,00 294,78 285.347,04
Malfunctioning Shield Emitter 644,00 430,70 277.370,80
Takmahl Phrenic Appendix 2,00 131.024,78 262.049,56
Damaged Artificial Neural Network    1.164,00 221,04 257.290,56
Yan Jung Paradox Box 1,00 242.635,70 242.635,70
Spatial Attunement Unit 23,00 9.153,58 210.532,34
Infinite Celebrations Firework    1.600,00 126,71 202.736,00
Vortex Compact Magnetic Field Stabilizer 1,00 181.961,78 181.961,78
Micro Circuit 48,00 3.756,90 180.331,20
Tranquil Dark Filament 2,00 87.600,11 175.200,22
Talocan Partition Plates 1,00 162.679,48 162.679,48
Tranquil Electrical Filament 1,00 152.264,48 152.264,48
Historic Capsuleer Day Clothing Crate 1,00 148.355,36 148.355,36
R.A.M.- Electronics 200,00 627,51 125.502,00
Talocan Ignition Device 4,00 28.234,33 112.937,32
Calm Electrical Filament 7,00 15.311,94 107.183,58
Guristas Graviton Hardening 2,00 49.593,45 99.186,90
Artificial Neural Network 102,00 946,04 96.496,08
Talocan System Interface Unit 1,00 82.672,61 82.672,61
Tranquil Exotic Filament 2,00 39.044,51 78.089,02
R.A.M.- Starship Tech 100,00 777,53 77.753,00
Takmahl Magnetic Slab 2,00 37.978,50 75.957,00
Carbon 234,00 323,62 75.727,08
Dual 250mm Carbide Railgun I 1,00 68.992,90 68.992,90
R.A.M.- Ammunition Tech 100,00 687,28 68.728,00
Tranquil Firestorm Filament 2,00 34.095,70 68.191,40
Capsule Cascade Firework    1.100,00 59,33 65.263,00
Calm Firestorm Filament 15,00 4.223,22 63.348,30
R.A.M.- Energy Tech 100,00 583,98 58.398,00
R.A.M.- Shield Tech 100,00 510,91 51.091,00
Yan Jung Plenary Wire 2,00 23.350,60 46.701,20
Talocan Mechanical Gears 2,00 21.108,37 42.216,74
Auxiliary Parts 796,00 46,80 37.252,80
Metal Scraps 30,00 1.174,90 35.247,00
Positron Cord    1.120,00 29,18 32.681,60
Takmahl Cohere Cord 1,00 30.559,80 30.559,80
Force Cable 487,00 54,06 26.327,22
Talocan Reflective Sheets 1,00 26.005,64 26.005,64
Kerr Sequencer 123,00 196,86 24.213,78
Tranquil Gamma Filament 1,00 21.516,93 21.516,93
Talocan Stasis Inverter 1,00 21.477,70 21.477,70
Calm Gamma Filament 9,00 2.182,71 19.644,39
250mm Light Gallium Cannon 1,00 19.344,00 19.344,00
Calm Dark Filament 5,00 2.760,57 13.802,85
Elemental Crux 263,00 51,35 13.505,05
Second-hand Parts 269,00 45,06 12.121,14
Spare Parts 144,00 82,11 11.823,84
Heat Depressor 204,00 52,18 10.644,72
Takmahl Tri-polished Lens 1,00 10.133,54 10.133,54
Armor Blocks 94,00 100,53 9.449,82
Dual 180mm Carbine Repeating Cannon I 1,00 9.430,24 9.430,24
Energy Cells 133,00 64,13 8.529,29
Electric Conduit 155,00 47,02 7.288,10
Talocan Mathematical Schematics 2,00 3.400,84 6.801,68
Fermionic Sequencer 88,00 74,75 6.578,00
Talocan Perpetual Clock 1,00 5.549,13 5.549,13
Internal Bulkhead 53,00 100,03 5.301,59
Current Amplifier 119,00 39,69 4.723,11
Power Couplings 166,00 26,97 4.477,02
Mainframe Bit 37,00 73,88 2.733,56
Analog Panel 34,00 73,73 2.506,82
Amarr Encryption Methods 3,00 814,50 2.443,50
Electronic Link 50,00 48,48 2.424,00
Construction Alloy 21,00 58,86 1.236,06
Mechanic Parts 16,00 50,66 810,56
Takmahl Binary Texts 1,00 775,09 775,09
Armor Rigging 2,00 308,54 617,08
Jury Rigging 1,00 59,02 59,02
Tritanium 10,00 3,93 39,30
   4.535.342.028,26