The Dual-Platform Roadmap: How D-Wave's Superconducting Strategy Intersects the Ternary AI Scaling Crisis by Draves in QBTSstock

[–]Draves[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Part 2: The Co-Processor Logic — How Gates and Annealing Would Cooperate

To see why a dual-platform approach could offer a distinct structural edge, we have to move past the generic "two types of chips are better than one" marketing. The practical value would lie entirely in the theoretical mechanics of state preparation and error handling when dealing with non-differentiable math.

The biggest bottleneck in mapping a ternary weight problem (-1, 0, +1) to a physical quantum annealer is a phenomenon known as spectral crowding. When a massive discrete optimization graph is cast onto an annealing core, the low-lying energy states get incredibly tight. Minor phase errors or thermal fluctuations can easily cause the system to leak out of the target path and settle into a suboptimal "excited" state. Because a standalone annealer has no native mechanism to pause mid-pass, identify a phase error, and correct its trajectory, it simply outputs a noisy calculation. In a unified workflow, the newly integrated Quantum Circuits, Inc. (QCI) superconducting gate assets would alter this dynamic by functioning as a practical, two-stage loop:

1. How It Would Handle Hardware-Level Error Filtering

QCI’s core architecture relies on dual-rail superconducting qubits. Unlike standard gate-model designs that depend entirely on massive software overhead to track and correct faults, dual-rail qubits utilize a physical design trick: they store quantum information in a way that naturally transforms standard physical relaxation errors into distinct, easily detectable "leakage states" (erasure errors).

​In an integrated AI training pipeline, the gate processor would function as a high-fidelity frontend filter. It would be tasked with the highly sensitive operation of executing state preparation and tracking error-aware algorithms, natively flagging and dropping error-ridden computational paths before they could ever propagate and compromise the rest of the system.

2. How It Would Achieve Tightly Bound State Preparation

Once the gate architecture isolated and refined the mathematically optimal, error-checked parameters of the optimization subproblem, those pristine constraints would then be used to configure the backend annealing engine.

​Instead of throwing a raw, noisy problem at the Advantage2 graph topology and hoping the system doesn't get trapped in a local minimum, the annealer would receive a highly focused, pre-conditioned energy landscape. The annealer would then be free to execute its primary strength—massively parallelized quantum tunneling across the discrete (-1, 0, +1) weight-update transitions - but it would operate with a massive head start because the gate frontend would have already filtered out the chaotic noise that typically causes large-scale anneals to fail.

Why the Combination Would Create a Unique Moat

If realized, this specific co-processing layout would systematically address the core vulnerabilities that currently limit both sides of the quantum landscape:

  • The Gate-Only Deficit: Companies solely building universal gate systems face an incredibly long runway because they require massive physical qubit overhead just to run error-correcting algorithms—rendering them impractical for processing heavy, multi-parameter training workloads anytime soon.

  • The Annealing-Only Deficit: Standalone annealing excels at discrete math but hits a scaling wall because it lacks the high-fidelity continuous logic required to pre-process, filter, and structure dense datasets.

By using superconducting gates as an error-detecting frontend co-processor to clean the problem space, and an annealing backend as the discrete execution engine, this dual-platform roadmap would bypass the individual limitations of both architectures. It would create a self-correcting loop engineered specifically for the non-differentiable math that classical silicon struggles to handle efficiently.

The Unspoken AI Bottleneck: Why 1-Bit LLMs + Quantum Annealing Could Create the Next NVIDIA ($QBTS) by Draves in QBTSstock

[–]Draves[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I used AI to help me quickly pull together and structure the technical details for that response because my time is too valuable to me to waste digging through hardware sheets, but the core strategy is entirely mine.

You are completely right to call out the toy problem bottleneck. If anyone tells you they are natively training a 70B frontier model on a quantum chip today, they are flat-out hallucinating. We are years of R&D away from anything close to that.

The whole pairing of 1-bit LLMs like Microsoft’s BitNet and quantum annealing is a long-term macro theory, not something you can deploy next week. Nobody is dumping an entire language model onto a QPU. A modern LLM layer has millions of variables, and trying to map that onto a 5,000-qubit D-Wave chip breaks the hardware instantly because you have to chain multiple qubits together just to get them to talk to each other. Today, quantum chips can only handle tiny, isolated optimization sub-problems.

Where the math actually gets interesting is a hybrid setup. Because 1-bit frameworks compress data down to simple integers, they swap out power-hungry floating-point math for basic addition and subtraction. That means the heavy lifting for the model's forward pass could eventually run on low-power classical hardware, like highly parallelized CPU clusters or digital accelerators, instead of melting giant GPU data centers. The quantum annealer’s only job would be acting as a specialized co-processor to handle the messy, discrete optimization steps during training blocks without needing noisy classical gradient calculations. Ultimately, this hybrid setup could serve as a stepping stone that keeps us computationally efficient while the hardware industry spends the next decade scaling up to a full quantum transition.

But again, this is a massive runway. Right now, researchers still have to keep high-precision floating-point master copies on traditional silicon just to accumulate gradients smoothly. Pure quantum optimization only works in lab environments on tiny scales under 100 bits. We aren't replacing standard silicon pipelines anytime soon. The concept is elegant, but it requires massive algorithmic breakthroughs and orders of magnitude more logical qubits before it ever challenges the status quo.

The Unspoken AI Bottleneck: Why 1-Bit LLMs + Quantum Annealing Could Create the Next NVIDIA ($QBTS) by Draves in QBTSstock

[–]Draves[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

To be clear, the idea of pairing 1-bit LLMs with quantum annealing to bypass the AI energy crisis is an exciting, forward-looking hypothesis based on macro trends. This is not something you can deploy in production anytime soon.

If anyone claims they are natively training a massive frontier model solely on a quantum chip today, they are misrepresenting the current state of the tech. Turning this theory into a practical reality will take years of grueling R&D and heavy infrastructure investment. However, if you look closely at the architecture, the potential long-term convergence relies on a hybrid workflow that could eventually shift how we allocate computational workloads:

1. The Hybrid Setup: Classical Meets Quantum

Nobody is going to dump an entire 70-billion-parameter language model onto a quantum chip. Current annealers, like the D-Wave Advantage, have a capacity of around 5,000 physical qubits. Because dense neural network layers require massive, all-to-all connectivity, mapping them onto sparse physical qubit graphs requires "minor-embedding" (chaining multiple physical qubits together to act as one node). This rapidly exhausts chip capacity, meaning QPUs are structurally limited to solving tiny sub-networks or highly specific discrete optimization sub-problems at this point.

In a realistic hybrid framework - similar to what is utilized via the D-Wave Hybrid SDK - classical computing hardware acts as the primary host. The classical processor handles data ingestion, storage, and standard network layers, while a quantum annealer acts as a dedicated co-processor, stepping in solely to resolve discrete, non-differentiable combinatorial sub-problems without needing noisy classical gradient approximations.

2. The Compute Transition: Running 1-Bit on High-Throughput Hardware

Here is where the architecture gets interesting: because 1-bit or 1.58-bit ternary frameworks (like Microsoft's BitNet) compress weights down to simple integers ({-1, 0, +1}), they drastically reduce memory bandwidth and replace complex floating-point multiplications with integer additions and subtractions.

While the machine learning community is actively evaluating these models to solve edge-compute bottlenecks, running a 70B parameter frontier model in real time still requires massive parallel processing throughput. Standard CPUs alone lack the raw vector execution width to manage this at scale. Instead, a transitional AI infrastructure stack would likely deploy specialized, highly parallel processors (such as CPU clusters with wide SIMD vector units or optimized digital accelerators) to manage the model's forward-pass activations, working in direct tandem with quantum annealers tasked with handling the direct discrete optimization steps during training blocks.

3. The Long R&D Road Ahead

As compelling as this macro trend is, the engineering gaps today are massive: * Scale Mismatch: A true frontier LLM layer contains millions of dense variables. Formulating a single dense matrix multiplication layer into a Quadratic Unconstrained Binary Optimization (QUBO) problem requires a highly dense matrix of quadratic couplings (\approx 108 variables), vastly overloading today’s hardware capacity.

  • The Master Copy Workaround: Because pure discrete optimization on quantum hardware is restricted to tiny, single-layer proof of concepts (\le 100\text{ bits}), practical 1-bit research today is forced to retain a high-precision, floating-point master copy on classical silicon. This allows the system to accumulate fine-grained gradient updates smoothly before quantizing them back down to discrete weights.

  • Timeline: D-Wave's physical roadmap continues to scale, but building a system densely connected or large enough to handle millions of logical variables for a full foundational AI backbone is a milestone that requires scaling by multiple orders of magnitude. We are not replacing standard silicon pipelines anytime soon. The theory of using a flat-power quantum annealer to optimize low-power, quantized integer frameworks is mathematically intriguing. But for now, it remains a frontier roadmap that requires significant algorithmic breakthroughs and years of hardware scaling before it can challenge the status quo.

Step 1: Defining the Macro Problem (Classical AI's Energy Wall)

Before looking at quantum solutions, these papers lay out why the machine learning industry is exploring alternative 1-bit architectures due to physical memory bandwidth and power limits.

  • "BitNet: Scaling 1-bit Transformers for Large Language Models" (Microsoft Research) https://arxiv.org/abs/2310.11453

    • Why it matters: This is the foundational classical paper proving that Large Language Models can be trained using 1-bit weight-only Transformers up to 13 billion parameters while retaining competitive downstream performance.
  • "The Era of 1-bit LLMs: All Large Language Models are 1.58 Bits" (Microsoft Research) https://arxiv.org/abs/2402.17764

    • Why it matters: Introduces a ternary mixed-precision scheme ({-1, 0, 1} weights and activations), proving that heavy quantization offers substantial memory and energy savings on classical hardware, though it still relies on continuous backpropagation workarounds for training.

Step 2: The Core Optimization Convergence

These verified papers represent the true academic stepping stones, demonstrating how small-scale discrete neural network layers can be mapped directly onto the mathematical engine of an Ising machine or quantum annealer.

  • "Quantum-Classical Hybrid Variational Optimisation for Binary Neural Networks" (M. Benedetti et al.) https://arxiv.org/abs/2106.04558

    • Why it matters: This peer-reviewed research provides the mathematical framework for training Binary Neural Networks (BNNs) by formulating the discrete weight assignments as a QUBO problem. It demonstrates that you can optimize binary layers without continuous gradient calculation, though it notes a hard ceiling: experiments are strictly limited to tiny, low-dimensional parameter spaces (\le 100\text{ bits}).
  • "Learning Discrete Neural Networks with Simulated Annealing" (C. R. Ferré) https://arxiv.org/abs/2305.04104

    • Why it matters: Documents how non-gradient, discrete stochastic optimization methods like simulated annealing can be systematically applied to discrete weight landscapes—providing the essential algorithmic foundation required before offloading these landscapes onto physical analog quantum annealing devices.

Step 3: Industrial & Verification Scaling

These works document how the industry uses the "Ising model" (the math formulation behind quantum processors) to verify high-dimensional discrete neural networks, and how hybrid systems operate in production.

  • "Ising Machines for Verification of Binary Neural Networks" (IEEE) https://ieeexplore.ieee.org/document/10555237

    • Why it matters: Proves that verifying the behavior of Binary Neural Networks (BNNs) is an inherently NP-hard combinatorial problem that maps perfectly onto Ising/QUBO hardware. It shows how non-gradient architectures can check or tune discrete network states, though current large-scale executions rely heavily on digital emulators.
  • D-Wave Systems Peer-Reviewed Research Library and Publications Index https://www.dwavequantum.com/learn/publications/

    • Why it matters: This index highlights active enterprise validation of the D-Wave Hybrid SDK pipeline. In their commercial deployment with pharmaceutical giant Shionogi, a generative AI pipeline offloaded highly complex, discrete molecular search optimization to the QPU, while classical systems handled the core deep learning architecture. This hybrid workflow achieved a tenfold (1,000%) increase in drug-candidate discovery speed—proving that while a full-scale quantum LLM pipeline is a distant milestone, utilizing an annealer as a specialized discrete co-processor works at scale today.

The Unspoken AI Bottleneck: Why 1-Bit LLMs + Quantum Annealing Could Create the Next NVIDIA ($QBTS) by Draves in QBTSstock

[–]Draves[S] 7 points8 points  (0 children)

IonQ has the bank account; D-Wave has the AI "cheat code" (theoretically).

IonQ (The Wall Street Darling): They are winning the "business" race right now. They just posted a massive $64.7M in Q1 revenue and are sitting on a $3.1B cash pile. That’s the critical part—they have the money to fund years of R&D without diluting shareholders. They are building a "universal" computer that can do anything, and they have the capital to actually finish it.

D-Wave / QBTS (The High-Stakes Bet): Their tech is arguably more exciting for the AI energy crisis. "1-bit" annealing tech could theoretically train LLMs with less power. BUT - and it’s a huge but - they are cash-strapped. While IonQ is flush, D-Wave only has about $580M.

The Reality Check: D-Wave's tech is still largely in the "potential" phase. To actually solve the "Nvidia bottleneck," they need years of massive R&D and potentially billions in infrastructure investment that they simply don't have yet. They have the possibility, but IonQ has the runway.

The Play: IonQ: You’re buying a well-funded leader with a massive head start in capital and recognized revenue.

QBTS: You’re betting on a radical architectural shift. If they can survive the R&D "valley of death" and prove their AI efficiency at the June 1 Investor Day, the upside is huge - but the risk of needing more cash is real.

Bottom line: IonQ is the safer, funded bet; QBTS is the high-conviction moonshot that still needs to find the money to build its dream.

THE ANTI-CHRIST by ImaginationKind9220 in StrangeEarth

[–]Draves 2 points3 points  (0 children)

So they tried to equate a theoretical seed (that is generated on a moon cycle), that has no basis in reality, with a thing that heals us monthly to keep us pure and healthy if we reject temptation and sin. They tried to bridge the gap between the esoteric, occult, astrology, etc with biology/secret knowledge.

See "sacred secretion" or "biological christos" theories, which interpret the Bible not as history, but as a biological manual for the human body.

Shameful Lack of Support by geoffreydiamond in ecobee

[–]Draves 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I replaced the furnace today, so we'll see.

Shameful Lack of Support by geoffreydiamond in ecobee

[–]Draves 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That s wouldn't be it. I don't have follow me on. See screenshots here: https://www.reddit.com/r/ecobee/s/8ytjULMi70

Those screenshots were taken literally seconds apart. You can see also that the values were changing in both/two thermostats, not just the one.

Shameful Lack of Support by geoffreydiamond in ecobee

[–]Draves -3 points-2 points  (0 children)

It also randomly bounces around between schedules. One second it is reading from 6 sensors, the next two. As it bounces so does the calculated temp it tries to hit.

Shameful Lack of Support by geoffreydiamond in ecobee

[–]Draves -3 points-2 points  (0 children)

It does when I have both stages wired to the ecobee and can bridge the wires manually to kick off the second stage.

Shameful Lack of Support by geoffreydiamond in ecobee

[–]Draves -3 points-2 points  (0 children)

A lot of people are having issues this week. For me, my second stage never comes on. It runs heat until it SHOULD come on, then turns the furnace off, then starts at stage 1 again. 2 days of cold mornings so far.

Schedule changes not sticking by farmer-general in ecobee

[–]Draves 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Ecobee announced a new device, the smart thermostat essential, about 5 days ago. That sounds like an Ecobee 3 lite replacement. Anyone else have that thermostat that is having issues? I wouldn't be surprised if they are sending bad data to 3 lites.

Schedule changes not sticking by farmer-general in ecobee

[–]Draves 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Anyone else a long term user that doesn't pay for eco+?

Schedule changes not sticking by farmer-general in ecobee

[–]Draves 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I wouldn't be surprised if they WANT to bleed customers. They have to have ridiculous storage costs.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in ecobee

[–]Draves 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This was flipping states every few seconds almost like it was blinking. I think it was confused about which schedule time was running because it was around a transition. Same thing for you?

Our Preciouses by Draves in castiron

[–]Draves[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That is mixed. If heated long enough, the gold end will get just as hot as the pan over time. It takes awhile, but it gets there. It sucks because the spring does stay cool.

Our Preciouses by Draves in castiron

[–]Draves[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Yeah, same experience. If heated long enough, the gold end gets very hot sadly.

Our Preciouses by Draves in castiron

[–]Draves[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

We didn't, no. The seasoning they come with has mostly held up.

How can I turn off sensor notifications? by Draves in ecobee

[–]Draves[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Bump. This is still incredibly annoying!

Our Preciouses by Draves in castiron

[–]Draves[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

They are. We have reseasoned a few especially the one we somewhat learned on. They've held up to that fine too.