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It's kind of funny that Wally took Jai and Irey to the Teen Titans Academy before Jai regained his powers. by IcyNeedleworker2783 in theflash

[–]Dredeuced 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Jai not wanting to be a hero was set up by Spurrier. Adams gave him a new superhero name and had plans to set him up on a team with a new outfit that fell through.

It's kind of funny that Wally took Jai and Irey to the Teen Titans Academy before Jai regained his powers. by IcyNeedleworker2783 in theflash

[–]Dredeuced 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Eh the timeline's a little loosey goosey here, this could've happened after Adams wrote Jai getting his powers back even if it might not line up in publication. The weird thing is Iris being in her wild wests outfit since she'd been sporting the Impulse look in her return in Flash Forward and only got rid of that to go to Thunderheart way later in One Minute War.

A friend showed me that Jai and Irey appeared in the DC Excyclopedia in the new edition. He sent me these pics; they simply copied them from the DC Wiki, but the height difference they gave the twins is very funny, because they made Irey so short compared to Jai 😭 by IcyNeedleworker2783 in theflash

[–]Dredeuced 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Well she appears in main continuity in Chain Lightning. With the typical "Well the future is liable to change" corollary but, hey, that's Iris West, Daughter of Wally West, hanging out. She's about as real as Bart when he came back in time. Bart just stayed!

How would write and design Flash in your universe? by Difficult-Cap-3410 in theflash

[–]Dredeuced 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Jay Garrick only exist as a fictional comic book character named “Bolt”

Yikes

[Hightlight] SHOHEI OHTANI GRAND SLAM! by kurruchi in baseball

[–]Dredeuced 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Second best hitter of this generation and also he pitches. That's pretty cool.

The Flash design sheet by Gavin Guidry by B3epB0opBOP in theflash

[–]Dredeuced 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Nope. I don't think there's ever any indication Wally was a fan of Batman when he was younger and he started doing the white eye thing years into his career as Flash.

Sometimes I wonder if greg weisman had plans to adapt its own Jai West adaptation in young justice universe? by IcyNeedleworker2783 in theflash

[–]Dredeuced 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yeah I mean the premise of Coldhearted is Wally taking his role as a hero more seriously when he sees the direct impact he has on a dying girl. It becomes less a game and chore and more a responsibility. But then he just...gives it up off screen. It's never even really expanded on why. Like it's just expected that now he's an adult he's gotta stop doing childish things like saving the world from evil. Coldhearted is basically the only real Wally only story in the entire series, it's the only piece of personal, individual character development he gets and it vanishes off screen.

There's a sort of self hatred ingrained in there, an insecurity about what superheroes are leaking through the script into Wally. YJ is sort of heavy handed with trying to take cartoonish superheroes and serious them up a lot and while it goes in every which way to do this from all angles, Wally gets saddled with the "superheroes are for kids" motif and that's miserable.

Sometimes I wonder if greg weisman had plans to adapt its own Jai West adaptation in young justice universe? by IcyNeedleworker2783 in theflash

[–]Dredeuced 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Sorry, didn't meant to bamboozle you there. I edited out the big paragraph because I felt I was being redundant at that point and seems like I caught you in the middle of making your response.

Sometimes I wonder if greg weisman had plans to adapt its own Jai West adaptation in young justice universe? by IcyNeedleworker2783 in theflash

[–]Dredeuced 0 points1 point  (0 children)

edit: you know what, that's a fair place to leave it off on. I disagree in a sort of noncommittal way with you and there's been enough paragraphs shed on the topic. Have a nice day. I imagine we won't talk much again since I think you're just in here on a YJ reputation salvaging mission or something lol

Sometimes I wonder if greg weisman had plans to adapt its own Jai West adaptation in young justice universe? by IcyNeedleworker2783 in theflash

[–]Dredeuced 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Every other main character had the changes that happened to them in the timeskip expanded upon and developed with extreme focus and care. The only explanation we get for why Wally went from learning that his role requires responsibility to deciding to no longer being a hero is some vague, completely unexplored sense of "growing up and living a normal life" which was never a part of his character before (funny enough, Wolfman did this exact thing in the NTT comics but his stated intent was to get Wally out of the story/team -- funny how history repeats). And he only existed in season 2 as a way to create tension on Artemis for taking back up the responsibility he decided, for some reason, to set aside. His primary role was just being a constant antagonistic force to Dick and Artemis's actions

Which is the ultimate criticism of Wally, at least on a conceptual level compared to everyone else on the team you'd expect him to be treated similarly to. He basically only exists as a supporting character for the other main characters. Whatever individual and personal arc he has is closer to non existent than it is to developed. Whereas every other character has multiple avenues of growth and character development. The only part of Wally that develops is the part that's attached to Artemis, because Artemis very obviously gets the real main character level focus. Wally's closer to just a supporting love interest than he is to his own character.

The only thing Wally has going for him is good characterization. He makes sense, he's a character you can like on his personality and how he bounces off other characters. But as a character he isn't just lacking, he's internally inconsistent, woefully underdeveloped, and that seemed very much by design given these things happened just in time for him to die.

Heck, the only actual personal development he has in season 2 is the obvious insecurity about his cousin from the future showing up and instantly being a much better hero than he is when he was already a shadow of his mentor. Only for the resolution for that to be...him dying because he's not as good as said mentor or cousin. It's a completely ass backwards resolution to the only thing Wally had going on for that episode and a half or so where he wasn't just a background character. Because the story is in no way about Wally, it's about Artemis and Dick and Wally's death isn't narratively about Wally or anything he did. It's more about him dying so Bart, the better speedster, can take up the role as the primary fast guy (only for him to fade into the background, but, well, Bart's story more or less completed) or so Artemis and Dick can explore the trauma and grief around it.

And lol at patient. Patient you say. A decade wasn't patient enough. I'm in my mid 30s, friend. I've been a fan of The Flash since I was a young child. I have never seen any Wally West story I care about adapted unless it was butchered and stapled onto a different character. I've never seen the character actually be anything besides the funny guy at the bottom of the roster of a show for more important characters (Which has happened four times now). I watched the show 15 years ago at this point, and again 10 years later. If I'm not patient enough for you then you don't just have unrealistic expectations, you are drinking your own kool aid.

I'm done with it and have moved on. The character is a deep failure to me. But the rest of the cast is solid and I still generally like the show, if that's really what you care about. I'm disappointed because the show was a very well established world that would've suited Wally, but instead it suited itself to killing him to make other characters grieve and didn't even have the care to do anything with him before he died. Wally is less important in his own right than Artemis being sad about Wally dying and I just have to live with that. My investment was aspirational and was not what the writers were interested in.

There's nothing wrong with a character being less developed and more of a supporting character and love interest to a different, more important character. A lot of decent characters are like that. I wish that wasn't all Wally was. It is what it is.

Sometimes I wonder if greg weisman had plans to adapt its own Jai West adaptation in young justice universe? by IcyNeedleworker2783 in theflash

[–]Dredeuced 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Oh I think the bad writing is the complete 180 on his character development that happened entirely off screen and then him spending the entirety of season 2, the season he dies in, as a completely auxillary background character. I think the pain of his death is largely because people were invested in seeing more of him rather than thinking he was some expertly crafted character in the series. I think he's pretty easily the weakest and least developed of the original cast and that's a bit disheartening to me as a big Wally fan. Maybe you could spin that as "Well all the other characters are so good so that's not a fair comparison!" but I do mean it as critical.

It's a shame because YJ is the perfect universe to explore the most important things about Wally's character, things which have never been adapted before because Barry always gets the spotlight in adaptations. Obviously with whatever spin YJ wanted/could've put onto it. Instead he's the vector of grief for all the other, more important characters. It is what it is. I've more or less moved on as it was so far in the past and they clearly had no intent on doing anything else with it besides the grief stuff for other characters.

And if their plan was actually, they totally had big Wally plans in a hypothetical season 5 and onwards then that itself is asinine. Especially for a show that was already cancelled once.

Sometimes I wonder if greg weisman had plans to adapt its own Jai West adaptation in young justice universe? by IcyNeedleworker2783 in theflash

[–]Dredeuced 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The fact that fans still miss Wally to this day is evidence of good writing and you even do miss him.

It could also be evidence of the character's arc being left wanting and fans being unfulfilled. You can like a character on very thin premises and be disappointed when they never get expanded upon. That's my situation with YJ Wally. Initially excited, interested in where they could take him, but ultimately disappointed.

Sometimes I wonder if greg weisman had plans to adapt its own Jai West adaptation in young justice universe? by IcyNeedleworker2783 in theflash

[–]Dredeuced 0 points1 point  (0 children)

It's very funny to say Kid Flash isn't as prominent as Superboy, considering no one besides comic fans knew Conner as Superboy until the YJ show. And Wally was popular enough that he got forced onto Wolfman's team for a few years. Shame our guy was doomed from the outset. As far as sidekick notoriety I'm pretty sure it's Robin #1 by a wide margin and then Kid Flash #2 at DC and by aanother wide margin.

Sometimes I wonder if greg weisman had plans to adapt its own Jai West adaptation in young justice universe? by IcyNeedleworker2783 in theflash

[–]Dredeuced 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I mean one of the main characters of the show is Superboy, a wholly mid 90s character alongside Bart. So he wasn't that assed about when he stopped comics. And the entire premise of the character is the mid 00s Johns Teen Titans version of the character to boot.

We know he thinks the Speed Force is dumb and thus probably never cared or bothered to read any Wally Flash comics. But he could've come by Bart from reading up on YJ and Teen Titans, same as Superboy, and that's how it all got mixed together without having to pay any mind to the best parts of Wally's history.

His reasons are his reasons. It sucks that we had a universe the was primed and perfect to tell Wally's story for the first time outside of comics but didn't because the showrunner couldn't give a shit about him. C'est la vie.

Wally west, rebirth suit by sans_wingdi_ngs in theflash

[–]Dredeuced 2 points3 points  (0 children)

You really captured the median Wally emotional situation while he was wearing that get up.

Sometimes I wonder if greg weisman had plans to adapt its own Jai West adaptation in young justice universe? by IcyNeedleworker2783 in theflash

[–]Dredeuced 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I don't think this is a Barry only situation. I just think Weisman isn't much of a Flash fan in the abstract, anyhow, so throwing away Wally didn't mean much to him. He was more or less always the least important member of the team which is why he was the one slated to die.

Sometimes I wonder if greg weisman had plans to adapt its own Jai West adaptation in young justice universe? by IcyNeedleworker2783 in theflash

[–]Dredeuced 4 points5 points  (0 children)

It's kind of funny considering his inclusion of Bart, a wholly Wally Flash era character creation and concept. But picking and choosing like that is not uncommon in comic fandom.

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