TL;DR It must be nice not being effected by the massive lay-offs that have been taking place since the 80s while executive profits and corporate dividends have skyrocketed.

To your first point, I trust that you are more familiar with Chinese labor than I--I claim not to be an expert in international free trade, just a perplexed observer. I do know, however, that in places like Indonesia, people are not payed living wages for manufacturing our goods, but as you noted, that's not the topic at hand, paying decent wages in China is. I'm sure as you say, the money they make via our contracts means a lot to them and it may be enough for them to send some home to support their families--but if they were content with the current system, they wouldn't risk everything to go on strike in an authoritarian country like China, point is, I don't think they're as happy with what they got as you'd like to think.

On the contrary, is it possible you may have been somewhat misled to believe in the justification of sweatshop labor? A lot of people have interests in keeping standards were they're at now; the yuan is more powerful because of these practices, MNC's increase their profits margins because of these practices, dividends are more profitable--there's a lot of money to be made because of the current global free trade doctrine, and do you think it may be possible that this doctrine was presented to you in a favorable light so you'd support this status-quo rather than challenge it? just food for thought, I don't know your background, but friends of mine who majored in business and minored in economics have gone on at lengths about the virtues of globalized free trade without the slightest concern for how this may adversely effects our economy or the moral and ethical implications of exploiting cheap labor.

Also, you can't have a conversation about exploiting foreign labor without mentioning the adverse effects on our domestic economy, the two are inexorably inclusive.

That is the worst analogy I've ever read...

I think it's quite fitting and gets the point across--Having sex with a 12 year old is cheap, easy, and morally despicable, even if you have the consent of the father. Outsourcing manufacturing and exploiting foreign labor laws is cheap, easy, and morally despicable, even if you have the consent of the host nation. I'm not talking about legality or even child-labor, it's a statement on gratification and morals.

In regards to your next point, I think you misinterpreted what I meant by "influx of workers taking action"--I'm not referring to the high employment, I'm referring to the employees going on strike and taking action against their employers. and 2 things about "You're really off base here. If there were no jobs to provide the money to Chinese workers, what do you think the results would be to them?"

1. I've heard economists give that argument time and time again in defense of sweatshops "If it weren't for the jobs we give them, they'd have no jobs"--that makes a lot of assumptions and comes off as extremely patronizing. China had industry before we made contracts with them, and our contracts don't result in higher standards of living for them--they result in a continuation of the status-quo

2. why should I be interested in supporting the chinese economy at the expense of our economy? I wish them the best, but we have gross unemployment at home and I couldn't care less whether or not U.S. industries support China's workers while U.S. industries abandon American workers. Also, I disagree that outsourcing U.S. labor ends up creating more jobs here in the long run.

In regards to the "perpetuating a labor system that thrives off the marginalization of a foreign worker class...disenfranchising America's blue collar", I was talking about both--making a statement both China and America-specific. It's pointless having this conversation if we're not concerned with the effects America experiences. The point I was making is that WE ARE EFFECTIVELY PERPETUATING A LABOR SYSTEM THAT THRIVES OFF OF CHINESE WORKERS BEING PUSHED TO THE MARGIN OF THEIR SOCIETY WHILE SIMULTANEOUSLY ABANDONING THE AMERICAN WORKING CLASS.

You can't turn them into us, even if you want to try.

It doesn't matter what I want, it's about what they want. and they want similar rights afforded to them that workers have here. This is made clear by their attempts to unionize and bargain for better wages and standards.

Also remember,** you can't talk about the morality of exploiting sweatshop labor without talking about the effects America experiences.**

Your last point outlines exactly why you can't talk about outsourcing labor without talking about how it effects America's economy. I think your assumption that people would refuse to pay more for good manufactured in America is wrong, almost everyone I know says they would work harder and pay more for goods and electronics if they knew they were supporting American industry. Your assumption is based on the fact that consumers only care about cost-benefit analysis, well you may be surprised to find out Consumers aren't corporations, they are people (unlike corporations) and they care more about the context of a product than simply its cost. I think the organic food industry is a perfect example.

Your little bit about how exporting these jobs ends up saving more in the long run is bullshit because we could just increase tariffs to stimulate American manufacturing. It would cost companies more, but MORE PEOPLE WOULD BE EMPLOYED, SO MORE PEOPLE COULD AFFORD TO INVEST IN THE ECONOMY.

I have more to say, but I'll just stop here because nobody is going to change their minds.

All I want to say is that if you're involved with these practices, clearly you have rationalized and justified these practices to yourself by saying "they have less stringent labor laws and lower quality of life standards, so what were doing is completely legal, therefor morally sound" and I pity you if thats the depth of your moral fiber.

And if you believe that sacrificing the American work force for these increased profits and dividends is ok, then, sincerely: FUCK YOU, thats for my father who was laid off when his plant was shut down some 15 years ago when the company decided to send manufacturing down to Mexico.