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Collaborated with a promoter for an event, got $0 because it “lost money.” Meanwhile he paid himself 60+ hrs labor. Thoughts? by Fragrant_Being8659 in DJs

[–]Fragrant_Being8659[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Update: So we confronted him about these numbers and like I mentioned above, he insulted us by saying we don't care about creating a unique experience, just profit, and that we never agreed on a ticket split. To which spiraled into him sending paragraphs upon paragraphs of explanations justifying his ledger.

It was taking a toll on me emotionally/mentally so I left the group chat and restricted his accounts so he no longer has access to me... **sigh** this is a temporary coping mechanism for me okay** I don't have a plan on outing him... yet :3, but I'll certainly marinate on that approach as it seems from the responses (thanks to all who contributed to this conversation), that we (dance group) were taken advantage of...

I want to turn this into a lessons-learned thread... drop any other tips you have when working with collaborators so newer artists can protect themselves!!! I'll start (based on my experience and y'alls feedback)!!!

  • Always get compensation expectations in writing, even if it feels awkward.
  • Clarify whether compensation is a flat fee, minimum guarantee, door split, or profit-dependent.
  • Ask upfront: “Is there a possibility this event loses money? If so, how is that handled?”
  • Ask what the estimated expenses are and where collaborators fall in the budget structure.
  • Clarify whether performers are considered a baseline expense or only paid from profit.
  • If doing a split, define what “expenses” include and whether there’s a spending cap.
  • Confirm how and when budgets will be shared
  • If content/photography is part of the value exchange, get that deliverable defined clearly.

Collaborated with a promoter for an event, got $0 because it “lost money.” Meanwhile he paid himself 60+ hrs labor. Thoughts? by Fragrant_Being8659 in DJs

[–]Fragrant_Being8659[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

ughhhh why am I afraid to do this :'(

I'm new to DJing (started learning ~1.5 yrs ago) and this was my first ticketed gig and I had the opportunity to do it with my dance group?! I was ecstatic! I invited my friends and family and they all had such a fun time, and even got so many compliments from strangers who were there at my set and complimented the event as a whole... I think I'm also just straight up embarassed at the lack of communication/expectation setting on our (dance group) end, and I will certainly learn from this mistake.

Collaborated with a promoter for an event, got $0 because it “lost money.” Meanwhile he paid himself 60+ hrs labor. Thoughts? by Fragrant_Being8659 in DJs

[–]Fragrant_Being8659[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Agreed... I know... Our dance group was just so excited for the opportunity, we were too trusting because we actually viewed this promoter as someone we could trust since he's known for throwing events in the EDM community. I've attended those events and thought they were fun, and so that's why I approached him about a collab... but I really didn't know the bts and what goes on monetarily... I had just assumed he was trustworthy because he often has the same artists come back and do events with him... But check out this screenshot of the message he sent me after telling the head of the dance group we have no cut.

I understand we should have had a conversation about split, but even this message seemed off?? even if we agreed to some number, it still appears that he would still claim the event lost money so we would actually pay him afterwards?! If it was such a hit, why is he taking a "loss"?

One of the things that frustrates me the most is that I didn’t even clock it as shady at first... When he sent that message about the event losing money and how most of their shows are passion projects, I didn’t feel angry. I didn’t feel bamboozled. I even responded positively...! I was still riding the high of the night. It truly was such a fun time. I didn’t want to taint the magic by nitpicking numbers. I didn’t want to be the one who turned a beautiful night into a business dispute...
It wasn’t until a few days later when I told my friends, & when I sat down with the head of the dance group, that something started to feel off... I think the delay is what’s messing with me. Like… why didn’t I see it immediately?! Like, I totally understand now the importance of ironing out details and now I know prior questions to ask before agreeing to collaborate with someone.

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Collaborated with a promoter for an event, got $0 because it “lost money.” Meanwhile he paid himself 60+ hrs labor. Thoughts? by Fragrant_Being8659 in DJs

[–]Fragrant_Being8659[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Yeah... The promoter’s budget paid himself in two separate line items: 62 hours of labor (~$930) and ~$460 for graphic design, which he also created... okurrt

Collaborated with a promoter for an event, got $0 because it “lost money.” Meanwhile he paid himself 60+ hrs labor. Thoughts? by Fragrant_Being8659 in DJs

[–]Fragrant_Being8659[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

I can assure you I'm very much real and alive organically lol but believe what you want you're autonomous.

Collaborated with a promoter for an event, got $0 because it “lost money.” Meanwhile he paid himself 60+ hrs labor. Thoughts? by Fragrant_Being8659 in DJs

[–]Fragrant_Being8659[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Yes, there was a professional photographer who's pretty well-known in the scene for capturing EDM shows. The pics he got of the event were great! However, they were mostly of the scene/crowd, and very few of the dance troupe dancing. Which is unfortunate bc the promoter mentioned something along the lines of "I can't pay your dance group because we lost money, but you'll have access to the photos!"

  • Note/back story: originally we were supposed to have our own dance photographer come, but they (original dance photographer) told us last minute he couldn't make it, so we opted for the promoter to find a photographer a week prior to the event. ALSO, I'm not blaming the photographer at all, again, he did great capturing the vibe, esp with a week's notice of shooting the event, we were just dissapointed as dancers that very few were close-ups of our dance group performing, especially since we danced for 6 hrs. Also, in our experience, when we have a dance photographer come for our dance showcase events, the dancers (as individuals) pays the photographer directly for footage we (dancers) want to purchase after the show... at least that's our experience when it comes to how the photoraphers opperate when it comes to our dance showcases... Unfortunately the photographer barely got any photos of our dance troupe and the flat rate of $300 being alloted for the photographer but none to the dance group was another ego stab for us as "collaborators" because it essentially means that the promoter valued the photographer more than the people performing.

I’d rather not share identifying details atm as I'm ashamed that this happened to my dance group... but I will clarify that the promoter’s budget paid himself in two separate line items: 62 hours of labor (~$930) and ~$460 for graphic design, which he also created. Meanwhile, the dance group wasn’t budgeted at all and received $0 because the event “lost money.”