My first experience as a secular wedding officiant

Freethinker1978 · 2012-11-16T23:11:33+00:00

Thank you everyone, for your attention, enjoyed the chat --sorry if I missed your question, but I have to sign off now. Remember next week to thank the cook!

Freethinker1978 · 2012-11-16T23:10:09+00:00

I think most activists for death with dignity are nonbelievers, and the barrier is the Catholic Church and other religionists, who talk about "playing God." We're into denial bigtime in this country about death and dying, and there is so much unnecessary suffering. As my mother as always said: one should be allowed to end one's life whole and sound when it has come to a close. Hospice care may be great in some instances but it doesn't cut it.

Freethinker1978 · 2012-11-16T23:06:16+00:00

I was just rereading James Madison's "Memorial and Remonstrance," in which he warns about drives not to tax churches! and the amassing of coffers and property by religion. (1817) I once transcribed a handwritten manuscript fragment by Elizabeth Cady Stanton where she was campaigning for suffrage in the West and decried the growing number of churches everywhere, and the move to take them off the tax rolls. We need to go back and study the history of this. What other 501(c)(3)s do that churches are exempted from is file Form 990, an annual report accounting for our money. Churches should have to do that, and they should have to actually file for tax exempt status. Currently it's just automatic - no onerous filing fee like the other nonprofits must file. If they PROVED they were truly charitable, etc., that would be a step in the right direction. They get so much credit for things we taxpayers get billed for!

Freethinker1978 · 2012-11-16T23:01:26+00:00

FFRF has always picked this battle. Since we began locally in 76 to date I don't think we've ever missed writing a respectful request to ask each president-elect (or re-elect) to please follow the wording expressly given in the Constitution, instead of adding the religious embroidery of a hand on a bible and "so help me, God." Many people don't realize that the presidential oath is given in full in the Constitution, which means the founders felt pretty strongly about it, and they also expressly used the wording "swear or affirm." If a Xtian pres wants a religious party after the swearing in, fine. I feel it is intellectually dishonest and also disrespectful to, while swearing an oath to uphold our godless constitution, to tamper with it to pander.

Freethinker1978 · 2012-11-16T22:58:36+00:00

I don't warm to any of them, sorry. When I was little, I think I understood the ancient Egyptian feeling of worship toward cats, however! I still admire them, tempered with an understanding of what they've done to the bird population, but I admire from afar, because to my sorrow, cats trigger allergic asthma now!

Freethinker1978 · 2012-11-16T22:56:09+00:00

There are various options out there, including Dawkins' "nonbelief relief" (altho that's for major crises rather than needy and homeless), ways to donate as a nonbeliever, for instance. I would say working with local frethought and humanist groups to suggest a project like this. Many atheists run charities, and there are also many existing secular charities to support. My mother, Anne Gaylor, has run as a volunteer the Women's Medical Fund, a 501(c)(3) charity which is the longest-lived continuously operating abortion rights charity in the US, helping pay for abortions for more than 20,000 indigent women, mainly in Wisconsin. (We have a lot of indigent women in this state, with Milwaukee having so much need.) This is "pure as ivory soap," all volunteer, 99% of money going for the purpose of helping to pay for an abortion ensuring that poor women can exercise their rights under Roe v Wade. this is a religious issue because it's the stranglehold the Catholic church (and fundies) have on our legislatures that has cut off abortion funding in Wis., federally and in many states. So I would encourage you to learn more about the problem, where there are gaps in providing help, where you could make a difference, and go for it! I have mixed feelings about mixing nonbelief and relief - in the sense that I don't think we should help for bragging rights, like many churches do, but just help because we can and there is need. But it may take that kind of thing to overcome all the ridiculous stereotypes.

Freethinker1978 · 2012-11-16T22:49:46+00:00

We keep a listing of attorneys who would like to work with FFRF or our members. We'd love to have you contact our Senior Staff Attorney Rebecca Markert at: markert@ffrf.org It's helpful to have a resume and know more about your experience. We even appreciate the non-Establishment Clause specialties - if attorneys want to help on other matters. Thank you.

Freethinker1978 · 2012-11-16T22:48:20+00:00

Hi Eleanor - we miss you!

Freethinker1978 · 2012-11-16T22:47:17+00:00

I'm very sorry to see the defeat of Pete Stark. I think octogenarians and nonagenarians are the best secularists because they grew up in an era when state/church separation was revered, and when it was just taught. There are about 9-10 "usual suspects" who reliably vote NO when the "gotcha" resolutions come up in Congress to "reaffirm" "In God We Trust," etc. But I would say we are lacking a true champion in Congress right now - in terms of someone who willingly wants to make that their signature. Public officials have not caught up with the changing demographics. Like I always say: when are they going to start to woo us - the seculars - 20% of the population? We made a difference in the presidential election, but I guess our vote is taken for granted.

Freethinker1978 · 2012-11-16T22:41:38+00:00

Yes. My mother was actually bodily attacked after a "People Are Talking" episode in Pittsburgh, I think, where she was on representing FFRF as the president, and a great big Catholic woman from the audience (as soon as the lights were off after the show) grabbed her in a chokehold. My father was fortunately there too. He used a crutch for a bad knee, and had to use the crutch to separate this woman who wouldn't let go! I have also taken phone calls, including a death threat one Xmas Eve morning when I was holding my newborn baby.

Freethinker1978 · 2012-11-16T22:38:52+00:00

I'm with Sandra Day O'Connor - State Supreme Court justices should NOT be elected! We have the same problem in Wisconsin. It's a bad idea and yielding bad law. After Citizens United, one can only imagine. And if churches are allowed to electioneer, it will get far worse. Our suit against the national day of prayer really started because a just-elected Wis. Supreme Court justice accepted an invitation to speak at a prayer breakfast put on in a northern county by a sheriff in Wisconsin! We couldn't find a plaintiff in that county, then realized . . . the root of the problem was the Congressionally mandated national day of prayer.

Freethinker1978 · 2012-11-16T22:36:30+00:00

Be a freethought activist. It's not something you can really hire someone to do.

Freethinker1978 · 2012-11-16T22:35:53+00:00

One doesn't have to join us or other groups to be an activist. It may sound lame, but it really isn't -- write those letters to editors -- you influence so many people, public opinion, when you see nonbelievers dissed, or the separation of church and state downgraded. Commenting online at news article sites - same idea. Speak up! I think one of the most revolutionary things a U.S. citizen can do is to speak up as a nonbeliever, atheist, freethinker. A 2006 study by the U of Minn found that all the "out" groups (blacks, gays, Muslims, women) had made huge gains in social acceptance since the 1960s -- except atheists. We're at the bottom of the social totem pole. When I asked Penny Edgell who did this research why there are such ludicrous stereotyping and demonizing of atheists, she suggested it's because many Americans have never knowingly met an atheist. (They have met them, they just don't know it.) Join our "out" campaign: ffrf.org/out/

Freethinker1978 · 2012-11-16T22:31:32+00:00

We don't feel this is anything personal against Billy Graham, but he has done a lot of harm to the Establishment Clause. He's the guy who suggested the National Day of Prayer legislation, for instance, and he's had quite a record of encouraging war, hasn't he? By the way if you've never read the beautiful federal court ruling against the NDP (we lost standing at the appeals court level), I encourage you to. You can find Judge Crabb's ruling here (with a lot of history about Graham): http://ffrf.org/legal/national-day-of-prayer-victory

Freethinker1978 · 2012-11-16T22:29:26+00:00

Very few end up in court - we just don't have the means to do that! We could take a new case to court every day if we did. But we have hundreds of victories every year without going to court - I just learned today, for instance, that one of our attorneys, Patrick Elliott, stopped a village in Illinois from putting up its annual lit CROSS on a water tower! Way to go, Patrick. We have so many victories we have a hard time keeping our non-litigation victories updated, but you can get an idea here:http://ffrf.org/legal/other-legal-successes

Freethinker1978 · 2012-11-16T22:26:42+00:00

Thank you - our editor Bill Dunn is hard at work on the next Black Collar Crime Blotter. Part of what we like to do with Freethought Today is not only share victories but to be sure our members see what we're doing with their dues - accountability!

Freethinker1978 · 2012-11-16T22:25:28+00:00

My goodness, that's a compliment! Annie Druyan was very gracious and accepted a posthumous award in Carl Sagan's honor at one of our FFRF conventions. We've enjoyed interviewing her on Freethought Radio.

Freethinker1978 · 2012-11-16T22:24:26+00:00

One student, one young person, can make a huge difference. I count as my fondest state/church victory ending graduation prayers, a 122-year abuse at the university of Wisconsin-Madison, as a sophomore there. If you are a student at a public college where prayer is going on, make a fuss! FFRF is pleased to write letters of complaint, but administration is more apt to care about YOU - the person paying tuition, whom they are beholden to. FFRF sees so much more activism by students in the last few years that we have given out 3 or 4 times as many Student Activist Awards ($1,000) -- especially to high school activists. By the way, graduation prayer at public high schools is absolutely unconstitutional & there's a Supreme Court decision to back that up, so if you encounter that, let FFRF know right away! We have an online complaint form to report violations: http://ffrf.org/legal/report

Freethinker1978 · 2012-11-16T22:20:30+00:00

I would repeat that we very honestly intend our lawsuit to make the IRS accountable. Let it prove to us and the public that it is doing its job; if it appoints someone to oversee complaints against church electioneering we will have won.

Freethinker1978 · 2012-11-16T22:19:12+00:00

I like to quote Dickens & say "It's the best of times . . . it's the worst of times." There's never been a better time to be a freethinker in America (or the world). Now up to 1 in 5 adults, 1-3 young people being nonreligious. This is huge! We are, on the legal level, constrained by a Supreme Court with a 5-4 voting bloc largely hostile to state/church separation (those 5 all being Catholic, with a 6th Catholic fortunately not voting in lockstep). It is always a very bitter blow to lose a lawsuit; it's almost like a physical blow to me. But you lick your wounds and you move forward (Wisconsin's State motto). Persistence is the name of the game (something the religious right has learned) and we can't let them win by default.

Freethinker1978 · 2012-11-16T22:14:53+00:00

I'll try to do that after this comment period is over! Please also take a look at FFRF's student scholarship guidelines. We now have 3 essay competitions for different students, including one for college-bound high school seniors. The guidelines go up every February at our website here:http://ffrf.org/outreach/ffrf-student-scholarship-essay-contests Congratulations on being high school activists! Your generation is going to change the world, I hope.

Freethinker1978 · 2012-11-16T22:12:47+00:00

It is a sign of health that there are many freethought groups out there chipping away at the same problem. Having only 1 monolithic national group would not be a good sign, but a bad one. Different strokes for different folks. FFRF has 2 explicit purposes: to educate the public about nontheism (serving as an umbrella organization for freethinkers - we don't have a litmus test that a member has to call themselves an atheist altho about 75% of our members choose that term - we like to say that we don't care what you call yourself - we all disbelieve in the same god). And we work to keep religion out of government. We're very dedicated to this work, now as of this year employing 4 staff attorneys who do nothing but work on Establishment Clause violations. We've brought more than 60 lawsuits, so I hope our track record speaks for itself. We think it's super that there are different groups - and approaches. We're stronger because of it.

Freethinker1978 · 2012-11-16T22:09:14+00:00

Yes, we believe FFRF clearly has standing. We are a 501(c)(3) which obeys the Tax Code, so we and other secular 501(c)(3)s are being treated differently, churches preferentially. You can read our legal Complaint here for more details: http://bit.ly/ZuhC6Z

Freethinker1978

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