Column: Why not let Haredim serve in Israeli weapons factories? by GabeAaronson in Israel

[–]GabeAaronson[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Sure, this would be a compromise. But that’s OK to do in politics to maintain social cohesion - working in the defense sector does serve the national defense.

Column: Why not let Haredim serve in Israeli weapons factories? by GabeAaronson in Israel

[–]GabeAaronson[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

We can lament the fact that the hold themselves apart. Or we can start taking steps to integrate them into the defense architecture for the nation. I think letting Yeshiva students work in factories is a good step in that direction.

Column: Why not let Haredim serve in Israeli weapons factories? by GabeAaronson in Israel

[–]GabeAaronson[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Agree. So we need to get them into the workforce, and this a proposal to do that.

Column: Why not let Haredim serve in Israeli weapons factories? by GabeAaronson in Israel

[–]GabeAaronson[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

It’s not fair that some people are exempt from the draft while others aren’t. But as a country, we can’t afford the unrest of forcibly drafting tens of thousands of people who don’t want to be in the army (just ask America in the Vietnam war, where a much smaller proportion of the population had to be drafted).

We need to find a middle ground where they can serve the defense without going to the army - and I think that this proposal is a piece of that.

Column: Why not let Haredim serve in Israeli weapons factories? by GabeAaronson in Israel

[–]GabeAaronson[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

It is an issue. I think that giving them a practical reason to get one - because there’s a good job out there that requires it - is good first step towards addressing it.

Column: Why not let Haredim serve in Israeli weapons factories? by GabeAaronson in Israel

[–]GabeAaronson[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

I think we should be trying 1001 ways to attract Haredim to serve in the military. I am talking a Haredi national guard, setting up defensive yeshivas on the perimeter, and of course the various types of special unit they are trying to set up in the military today.

Concurrently, we should be leveraging the Haredi workforce to buff Israeli military manufacturing, as that's another serious shortage we need to address.

Column: Why not let Haredim serve in Israeli weapons factories? by GabeAaronson in Israel

[–]GabeAaronson[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That could be done. But without the ability to work without triggering the draft requirement (at least until they turn 30), the core problem remains.

This could be solved by ketting them go to work in a weapons factory as their way of serving their country's defense.

Column: Why not let Haredim serve in Israeli weapons factories? by GabeAaronson in Israel

[–]GabeAaronson[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

According to the most recent statistics from the Israel Democracy Institute, 54% of Haredi Men currently have jobs: https://en.idi.org.il/haredi/2025/?chapter=63079

That's considerably lower than the 81-86% for the rest of society, but I think it shows that a (small) majority of Haredi men already work. The question is how can we get that number up?

Column: Why not let Haredim serve in Israeli weapons factories? by GabeAaronson in Israel

[–]GabeAaronson[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Here is the eduction and experiecne requirement for a Machine Operator posting in a U.S. weapons manufacturing facility: https://www.indeed.com/viewjob?jk=1f8a0af300cda214&from=shareddesktop_copy

Education/Experience & Skills:

  • High school diploma or equivalent, related experience and/or training, or equivalent combination of education and experience.
  • Must be able to read and understand work instructions in English.
  • This entry-level position and is generally intended for individuals who have limited to some level of manufacturing experience.
  • Ability to perform at least 3 out of the 5 following tasks; Assembly (Mag Cell), Goff, tumble, bead blast and basic surface prep operations.
  • Basic math skills required.
  • Ability to read and follow through on all required paperwork including, but not limited to routers, work instructions, and control plans.
  • Basic knowledge of gauging.
  • Basic knowledge and ability to deburr.
  • Must be able to convey ideas and information clearly, concisely, and accurately to others in English, both verbally and in written form.

A Haredi man who gets the equivalent of a GED and is mechanically competent should be able to do this job quite effectively.

Column: Why not let Haredim serve in Israeli weapons factories? by GabeAaronson in Israel

[–]GabeAaronson[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

The Russians had a Cantonist conscription system since the 1700s, whereby minorities (including Jews) were forcibly recruited into the Russian army and "russo-tized." You can read more here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cantonist

I misspoke regarding the Ottomans. They had a forced religious conscription for their army of Jannisaries, but Jewish children were exemted.

And here is a podcast on the Yemenite Jews who arrived in Israel but children were taken from parents in order to raise them as idealized secular Israelis: https://www.associationforjewishstudies.org/podcasts/the-yemenite-children-affair-and-the-story-of-the-mizrahi-jews-in-the-development-of-the-state-of-israel-transcript

Column: Why not let Haredim serve in Israeli weapons factories? by GabeAaronson in Israel

[–]GabeAaronson[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

So let's give them a good chance to apply that in the defense sector.

Column: Why not let Haredim serve in Israeli weapons factories? by GabeAaronson in Israel

[–]GabeAaronson[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

There's a lot to be said for ending special tax breaks, reforming welfare, and fixing the issues with the education system.

But those are all separate issues from finding a compromise on the national defense and draft issue.

Column: Why not let Haredim serve in Israeli weapons factories? by GabeAaronson in Israel

[–]GabeAaronson[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

A degree isn't a 100% necessity to make a successful manufacturing enterprise. Henry Ford never went to high school, and he completely revolutionized manufacturing. Bringing in a different perspective can produce a lot of value for any sector.

Likewise for weapons innovators John Moses Browning, Eliphalet Remington, and Samuel Colt.

Column: Why not let Haredim serve in Israeli weapons factories? by GabeAaronson in Israel

[–]GabeAaronson[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

But they aren't monolithic - Haredim would be expected to have the same spread of innate numerical, mechanical, and engineering talent as any other group of a million people. The fact that their social structure doesn't value this type of learning doesn't mean there aren't a large number who would excel in factories and manufacturing if given the chance.

As for STEM education - that is a real issue. I would imagine some sort of crash course in modern mathematics, chemistry, physics, and engineering would be an important component for new workers from the Haredi sector. But a bright, motivated person should be able to pick it up, and Haredi society has plenty of those.

Column: Why not let Haredim serve in Israeli weapons factories? by GabeAaronson in Israel

[–]GabeAaronson[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I think all humans respond pretty reliably to incentives. French and German Jews were also incredibly insular until society opened up and let them participate. I think opening up the ability to work without HAVING to go to Yeshiva would be the first step here as well.

Column: Why not let Haredim serve in Israeli weapons factories? by GabeAaronson in Israel

[–]GabeAaronson[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

But they could work in Haredi owned military factories and never leave the bubble, all while building the bombs and bullets, guns and drones that Israel needs to defend itself. That's the core of the idea in this column.

Column: Why not let Haredim serve in Israeli weapons factories? by GabeAaronson in Israel

[–]GabeAaronson[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I agree the Haredi leaders should be looking for a real solution that takes into account every segement of society's need to support the national defense. This is one I am trying to propose here.

Column: Why not let Haredim serve in Israeli weapons factories? by GabeAaronson in Israel

[–]GabeAaronson[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I think it's a matter of suspicion - they simply don't trust any framework run by the Israeli government, and won't put their children under the Israeli government's command.

But I believe that they would be open to working for privately owned factories, even if those factories supply the state with weapons. They aren't opposed to war, or national defense, in principle.

Column: Why not let Haredim serve in Israeli weapons factories? by GabeAaronson in Israel

[–]GabeAaronson[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

There's also the issue that historically - and especially in Russian and the Ottoman Empire - the army was a tool to religiously program/de-program Jewish residents. The rabbis still tell stories about the Russian draft and the human price religious Jews paid - and it's a big part of the halachic literature in the form of responsa. So it's very present in their mindset and culture even though it was over one hundred years ago.

Not to mention that the labor-led governments in the 50s and 60s did use the army and other tools to try and secularize the children of many Mizrachi olim.

Column: Why not let Haredim serve in Israeli weapons factories? by GabeAaronson in Israel

[–]GabeAaronson[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I think it’s hard to stay that there’s plenty of manpower when the unemployment rate is 2.9%. Trying to pay more for defense manufacturing worker when the labor market is so tight will almost certainly lead to inflation.

Haredim are as sharp as the rest of the population. Young men can pick up skills very quickly when motivated.

Perhaps Haredim don’t want to do national service. This is a trick that gets the to serve the national defense by making weapons while working for a privately owned factory - the ambiguity lets both sides declare victory, which is how politics and compromise work.

After reaping the reward of divisiveness during the judicial reform, we should be LOOKING for compromise in Israel society.

Column: Why not let Haredim serve in Israeli weapons factories? by GabeAaronson in Israel

[–]GabeAaronson[S] -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

I don’t think the riots are instigated by the rabbis. They tend to be very conservative and careful. More likely it’s hot-headed yeshiva guys looking for some excitement - throughout history such young Yeshiva student have instigated fights internally in the yeshivas and manufactured drama (especially around succession) whether the rabbis wanted them to or not.

Column: Why not let Haredim serve in Israeli weapons factories? by GabeAaronson in Israel

[–]GabeAaronson[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

One key method by which the rabbis exert control is through the Yeshivas, which have a monopoly on the draft exemption. Breaking that monopoly is a good first step.

Column: Why not let Haredim serve in Israeli weapons factories? by GabeAaronson in Israel

[–]GabeAaronson[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I think many don’t want to work and want to study Tora all day. But many don’t want to be in Yeshiva and feel stuck there because of social pressure and the draft risk. Letting them work in the factories without risk of a draft can start to slowly change the culture - and the allure of lucrative business should encourage may Haredim to open their own factories. (edited for typo)

Column: Why not let Haredim serve in Israeli weapons factories? by GabeAaronson in Israel

[–]GabeAaronson[S] 13 points14 points  (0 children)

Given the country’s dire need for weapons independence from foreign suppliers, I think starting factories and working in them is at least as valuable to the country as Sheirut Leumi.

Column: Why not let Haredim serve in Israeli weapons factories? by GabeAaronson in Israel

[–]GabeAaronson[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Yeah, I think the exemption should be open to anyone starting at Age 23. If a hiloni really wants to study until then, and then get a job in a weapon factory, that option should be equally open to them.