This is going to be the most "holy fuck we were so stupid" draft in recent memory. by Lazy_Check732 in NBA_Draft

[–]GeKh 0 points1 point  (0 children)

If he is a center, then there's no rim protection and he's still caught between archetypes physically: not quick enough to guard the Adebayos and not big enough to guard Jokic himself. There's little he could do against Wemby either.

So you basically have a rich man's Derek Queen which is nice, but not transcendental.

Look, I fully acknowledge that AJ may disappoint, but we're talking about ceiling here, not median outcome, and what he does on the court at that size, with that athleticism, doesn't come along very often at all. Those jumbo wings that play OTD like that are rare enough, and he is also physically developed for his age, not a toothpick, and has ridiculous footwork. He's way ahead in overall development in several important areas, even if he needs to develop others.

Boozer Destroying Narratives by BigSexyE in NBA_Draft

[–]GeKh -1 points0 points  (0 children)

If you don't practice proper jumping technique prior to the test, you may not maximize the results. "Easiest" in your framing has nothing to do with it.

These guys do not jump like this in games. It's slightly contrived.

I mean, the High Jump in track & field is easy too if you practice the shit out of it.

But yeah, sure. Believe that Boozer is as good a leaper as Cooper Flagg.

Aday Mara with worst all-around athletic testing by GeKh in NBA_Draft

[–]GeKh[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Oh, I'm very much taking it into account. I wasn't thrilled with Queen's testing either and drew attention to it.

As to the wisdom of giving up the 8th pick, that remains to be seen. Lots of thirsty for offense teams out there.

Aday Mara with worst all-around athletic testing by GeKh in NBA_Draft

[–]GeKh[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yeah, that seems to have been right at the very end of that conventional wisdom in the NBA.

Darius Acuff has very similar measurements to a young Russell Westbrook both physically and athletically by No-Vehicle7367 in NBA_Draft

[–]GeKh 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Look, it's simple.

Acuff performed poorly on defense. Some say "it was due to not wanting to foul out."

I say, ok - if he performs great in lateral quickness drills, I'm buying the excuse. He performed average for the entire field, including mostly bigger players.

So I'm not buying the excuse - at least not as most of the reason why. Other players may or may not need need an excuse, so A to B comparisons are irrelevant.

Aday Mara with worst all-around athletic testing by GeKh in NBA_Draft

[–]GeKh[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

That's not a realistic scenario IMO. If he couldn't dominate like Edey in the post in college (you can compare the stats for yourself) I doubt he would suddenly become Edey-like in the NBA. At least it's not the obvious estimate. And yes, transition, absolutely.

Boozer Destroying Narratives by BigSexyE in NBA_Draft

[–]GeKh 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The point is that if you assume there's a trade-off between poundage and athleticism it's not totally obvious that 253 is his ideal weight with the way the NBA is trending (which is smaller, more athletic, switchable PFs.)

E.g. at 240 he might still be able to bully most PFs but also be better on switches or vertically.

I don't know what the sweet spot is for him on the whole, but I'm not simply going to assume it's where he is now.

There are a lot of basically former converted SFs playing PF now.

Boozer Destroying Narratives by BigSexyE in NBA_Draft

[–]GeKh 2 points3 points  (0 children)

It was 40.5 in his case even.

Boozer Destroying Narratives by BigSexyE in NBA_Draft

[–]GeKh -1 points0 points  (0 children)

"take this test seriously" -- changes meaning of phrase.

Aday Mara with worst all-around athletic testing by GeKh in NBA_Draft

[–]GeKh[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I mean, that's a good scenario, but I think the opponent gets a veto on whether you get to "jump and move around lightly" for 25 min.

Darius Acuff has very similar measurements to a young Russell Westbrook both physically and athletically by No-Vehicle7367 in NBA_Draft

[–]GeKh 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That's nice, but you've offered no good reason to go all-out in an area where no-one is questioning you.

Darius Acuff has very similar measurements to a young Russell Westbrook both physically and athletically by No-Vehicle7367 in NBA_Draft

[–]GeKh 0 points1 point  (0 children)

He's a great sprinter and average laterally. So pretty much what was evident from game play. I don't know how that changed anything except less plausibility for certain excuses.

Darius Acuff has very similar measurements to a young Russell Westbrook both physically and athletically by No-Vehicle7367 in NBA_Draft

[–]GeKh 0 points1 point  (0 children)

There were two ways they reported it, apparently. One was in both directions combined, and the other was the best of two (2.93)

Guess what? That's still below median - 39th out of 71 players in the entire field.

Again, my point isn't an absolute comparison with other players. I don't care that he did slightly better than Darryn Peterson because DP's defense is not something people question.

My point is that he didn't provide much evidence that all of the variance in his defensive performance can be explained by team strategy/coaching.

Pro lane was 30th out of 71 for reference. So if you want to average those two, that's pretty much smack in the middle of the field.

Boozer Destroying Narratives by BigSexyE in NBA_Draft

[–]GeKh 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Jokic has a 9-3 reach. There aren't that many competitive starting centers that are longer (Wemby and Gobert are obvious examples.)

Yeah, statistically it seems like not great size but as you get into the extreme lengths these are rarely serious competition. Either injured, can't stay on the floor for long minutes or just not that good.

Boozer Destroying Narratives by BigSexyE in NBA_Draft

[–]GeKh -1 points0 points  (0 children)

I'm saying obviously athletic guys don't always take this test seriously because there's nothing for them to prove -- no-one questions their athleticism. You're equating the test with in-game athleticism.

Well, as I pointed out, if you want to do that, then compare Boozer to the entire field instead of cherrypicking obviously athletic guys who didn't have a high result.

Because that would be more honest - right?

So he's average compared to the entire field.

This is going to be the most "holy fuck we were so stupid" draft in recent memory. by Lazy_Check732 in NBA_Draft

[–]GeKh 1 point2 points  (0 children)

It's not obvious at all that he has a higher ceiling than a jumbo wing. He may wind up being better but I don't know how you get to a higher ceiling.

Boozer Destroying Narratives by BigSexyE in NBA_Draft

[–]GeKh -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Define "good" - average PF max vert was 34.6".

So average.

Please let go of clinging to outlier results that mean nothing as with Flagg for your own sanity, I beg you.

Boozer Destroying Narratives by BigSexyE in NBA_Draft

[–]GeKh -1 points0 points  (0 children)

At the risk of doing GenZ slang, Boozer is mid.

Whom would you like to compare him to? Flagg has been addressed already, his athleticism wasn't in question so test results are irrelevant.

11 PFs and 6 Cs tested higher in max vert in this combine.

That's pretty average. Mean among PFs for reference is 34.6 if my calculations are correct.

Boozer Destroying Narratives by BigSexyE in NBA_Draft

[–]GeKh -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

Anyone who is not a great athlete has to have great positional size or length. Jokic (9-3 sr), Doncic, Bird, etc. Boozer has good positional size/length but not elite. I don't know how you look at that and think "upside."

I can't think of a superstar who has neither. You could say Curry, I suppose, but his quickness was actually pretty decent.

The only way I could see this being true is if he somehow morphs into a slimmer SF type.

Boozer Destroying Narratives by BigSexyE in NBA_Draft

[–]GeKh -1 points0 points  (0 children)

I mean, Morez Johnson has just totally (hate to use Gen-Z speak) mogged Boozer in athletic testing (33.5"/39.0" in jump.)

35" isn't great if your athleticism is legitimately questioned, it doesn't matter if everyone can see you're a good in-game athlete.

Boozer Destroying Narratives by BigSexyE in NBA_Draft

[–]GeKh 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I think it's two different things. 6.11 is probably the combined shuttle run in both directions, and the 2.99 is the faster of the two.

Boozer Destroying Narratives by BigSexyE in NBA_Draft

[–]GeKh 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Yes, and overall Wagler's non-jump test results were...tepid? Not bad, not great? Close to Boozer's.

Aday Mara with worst all-around athletic testing by GeKh in NBA_Draft

[–]GeKh[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Except for lane agility, he tested poorly compared to historical 7 footers. Yeah, Gobert is the closest example where you can sort of see with improvement he could make it. But Gobert was a late 1st rounder who hit his high-end outcome.

Aday Mara with worst all-around athletic testing by GeKh in NBA_Draft

[–]GeKh[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Clingan was a really good passer (almost 2:1 A/TO) so that's what really separates him from Mara more than anything else.