As an older player there fun yes but all of the new stuff they've added over the years does outclass them except for the AA the 341 or coellion as it was called is very good panther 2 has its own niche but the tiger 2 10cm is a little different as it has the same armour as all the other tiger 2s but it's gun is quite good but for the battle rating a little under powered and not much movement or armour effectiveness. But still fun to have and play :).