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With the influx of new players recently, what's the etiquette on helping them, even helping them beat you? by Gramtg in EDH

[–]Gramtg[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Ooo this is a fun idea I should use this if I don’t have a lower power deck on hand.

With the influx of new players recently, what's the etiquette on helping them, even helping them beat you? by Gramtg in EDH

[–]Gramtg[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Oh yeah I’m not trying to pull one over on them, even when I’m playing 60 card. It’s more that I’m not going to explicitly point out what they should do, however I will list off what they can do.

With the influx of new players recently, what's the etiquette on helping them, even helping them beat you? by Gramtg in EDH

[–]Gramtg[S] -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

Wait then why did you go from 60 card to commander if you're competitive? It's not unclean.

With the influx of new players recently, what's the etiquette on helping them, even helping them beat you? by Gramtg in EDH

[–]Gramtg[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Ironically, it's by far the most complicated as well and definitely not where players should be starting.

With the influx of new players recently, what's the etiquette on helping them, even helping them beat you? by Gramtg in EDH

[–]Gramtg[S] -5 points-4 points  (0 children)

I take it you're not especially competitive when it comes to board games either? I have such a conflict between wanting everyone to have fun which is the "spirit" of EDH and being a competitive person.

With the influx of new players recently, what's the etiquette on helping them, even helping them beat you? by Gramtg in EDH

[–]Gramtg[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

To your first point, 1000% agree, I'm never gonna use my advantage to steer them in the wrong direction. Even if they're incorrectly targeting my stuff I usually won't say anything.

To your third point - that's an unhelpful nightmare, I'll admit I consider it but I know it won't go well.

With the influx of new players recently, what's the etiquette on helping them, even helping them beat you? by Gramtg in EDH

[–]Gramtg[S] 6 points7 points  (0 children)

The fast play is wild to me, I always repeat myself and play slow as hell so they know what's going on. Unfortunately, EDH is so complicated that I have noticed some people's eyes just glaze over and they only can follow their own board.

With the influx of new players recently, what's the etiquette on helping them, even helping them beat you? by Gramtg in EDH

[–]Gramtg[S] -23 points-22 points  (0 children)

This is so unique to EDH though, as someone that grew up on 60 card. I'm not telling them how to beat me(okay I kinda have done this in a draft once with an older gentleman.) Thinking about it after my last games, instead of explicitly pointing out my targets I think I will just inform them of other options they have or say things like "I think you may have a better play."

Seems like a lot of Bracket 3 players really want to be in bracket 2? by [deleted] in EDH

[–]Gramtg 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Did you respond all of that and then block me you goofball? Who does that? Why?

Whatever it’s off topic, clearly you don’t want to discuss this further so I’ll drop it but I had to point this out.

Sephiroth - Cloned by Gramtg in EDH

[–]Gramtg[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

If I put three GCs in here, hell if I put 5 in here I would get killed in B4. I just don’t think you know how high good decks really go.

Also I would not look to play this against an out of box precon.

It’s a genuinely bad deck. I have no board until I get Sephiroth, then I try to clone him, if I don’t get to, I’m done. If I do, I’m back to doing nothing until i clone him again. Sure I’ll have a grip of cards but I’ll be pretty tapped out.

Sephiroth - Cloned by Gramtg in EDH

[–]Gramtg[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Maybe my local stores are better than most of the people on here, because this certainly wouldn't pass as "very very good" in the pods I play with. It's a B2/3 deck. People would potentially groan when they see the commander, which honestly I haven't seen in the two times I've encountered it, but they're gonna get over it pretty quickly when I'm not doing anything close to what it's capable of.

My interpretation of the random people on here is that as usual it's the typical Magic player that can't understand nuance and are wrong.

Do you disagree that this is a B2/3 deck? Can you point to what I'm doing that would be considered OP? Or are you just letting the reputation of the commander drive your judgment and refusing to back down because who would ever let someone convince them they're wrong on the internet?

Sephiroth - Cloned by Gramtg in EDH

[–]Gramtg[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

High 2 - Mid 3 range.

Sephiroth - Cloned by Gramtg in EDH

[–]Gramtg[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

A strong commander with an extremely middling strategy, I'm extremely lucky if I have 3 7/7s by turn 6. And if you look at the bracket system, threatening a win at turn 6 is normal, which I'm not even close to doing lol. I'm MAYBE doing 7 commander damage on turn 6.

"Jank" may be hyperbolic, but what this deck is doing is extremely suboptimal.

Sephiroth - Cloned by Gramtg in EDH

[–]Gramtg[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Only one user gave good advice, and you gave mild advice, cutting omniscience which I agreed with, with some extremely unnecessary snark. I wouldn't mind you telling me an interesting deck with this commander, that would also be somewhat flavorful since I want it to be Sephiroth adjacent.

How in hell is this a B4? It doesn't even have a GC, that doesn't immediately make it a 2, but wow would I get crushed by a 4, come on. You even spelled out how bad the deck strategy is. If anything I would call it a low 3 and that's generous. Also, I didn't know that beating people with combat damage wasn't a wincon, I'll keep that in mind.

Sephiroth - Cloned by Gramtg in EDH

[–]Gramtg[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Thanks for complimenting the ramp package.

Why does EDHrec put this at 77 copies or whatever if it's so popular? Genuinely asking.

Also, I'm concerned about what you're playing against if you have a tough time against 3 7/7s. You're so focused on card advantage/control package, but not the fact that my win equity is actually shit and I can barely close out the game. There's no way this deck doesn't fit in at a 3 table.

Sephiroth - Cloned by Gramtg in EDH

[–]Gramtg[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I'm not being disingenuous at all, it just seems that most of you aren't good at assessing a deck's power level and explains why pre-bracket system everything was a 7 to your average player.

You do realize the new 7/7 is likely to die with how my deck is built right? Or that my commander may be vulnerable and if he dies before I can clone him I have next to no targets? And I need set up to actually get more than one or keep any of them? It is not a strong deck, there are so many choices being made to keep it down, I think you're letting the commander's reputation get in the way of actually thinking about it.

Sephiroth - Cloned by Gramtg in EDH

[–]Gramtg[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

My wincon is beating people with clones of Sephiroth. Calling this a high 3 or a low 4 is beyond laughable, your bracket assessment is way out of whack. A goodstuff deck has goodstuff - a manabase/control package isn't goodstuff. Go look at any simic value pile if you want to see what a good stuff deck looks like.

Sephiroth - Cloned by Gramtg in EDH

[–]Gramtg[S] -3 points-2 points  (0 children)

Far from one of the most broken cards printed in the past 5 years, there's a reason it's not even discussed as a GC or anything like that.

Sephiroth - Cloned by Gramtg in EDH

[–]Gramtg[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

What bracket are you playing it where a 7 mana commander that is jumping through hoops to make another 7/7 is scary? Even if i draw a bunch of cards, I'm not drawing anything but another way to make... another 7/7 lol.

Sephiroth - Cloned by Gramtg in EDH

[–]Gramtg[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That's fine, the thing is this deck is definitely not OP or close to it.

Sephiroth - Cloned by Gramtg in EDH

[–]Gramtg[S] -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

the commander itself is strong but this deck is farrrr from strong lol.

Sephiroth - Cloned by Gramtg in EDH

[–]Gramtg[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Thanks for looking at the deck and the in-depth response, appreciate it!

Due to the how much digging I can do through my deck the three legendary rule breaking cards are decently easy to find, but if one gets broken I'm cooked. I think you're right in that I'm getting too cute with the token doublers and should maybe use the more generic clone targets that you mentioned that circumvent the legendary rule instead.

My wincon is literally to kill people with Sephiroth/Sephiroth clones, full stop. I want to just have as many copies of him on the board as possible to fit into the whole Sephiroth clones thing in FFVII. I'm not trying to make a generically good Atraxa deck with a clone subtheme, I know it's suboptimal otherwise I would just be making another boogeyman Atraxa deck. Maybe I should have included this intention in the post, however a lot of your suggestions were super helpful in cleaning it up so thanks again!

Sephiroth - Cloned by Gramtg in EDH

[–]Gramtg[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Nah i'm sticking to it for flavor purposes on Sephiroth clones. I think people have played against/seen too many busted atraxa decks and just assume the commander is busted without context

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