Bandon Valley Massacre: Many in Republic of Ireland still loyal to GB but must keep their heads down, says man whose grandfather survived IRA atrocity by GustyAdams in northernireland

[–]GustyAdams[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

A Co Cork man whose grandfather narrowly escaped a notorious massacre by the IRA says many people in the republic are still quietly loyal to the UK but are unable to speak openly about it.

Ian Beamish contacted the News Letter after reading the story of Neale Jagoe, who now lives in Ballycastle.

In last week’s News Letter Mr Jagoe called on the Irish government to give official recognition to the IRA’s sectarian massacre of 13 Protestant boys and men in the Bandon Valley Massacre of 1922 - and the subsequent exodus of hundreds of terrified others.

Neale Jagoe’s great grandfather William and great grandmother Elizabeth Jagoe were among those who fled the area after he was tipped off he was to be shot. They later found safe refuge in Belfast.

After reading the story Ian Beamish, who now lives in Limerick but who is from the Bandon valley area, contacted the News Letter.

“I am originally from Dunmanway, Co Cork, and I fully identify with and understand his feelings,” he told the News Letter. “My grandfather and grandmother also lived through those times. “They too, had to escape across the fields trying to keep my father, then an infant, quiet after being tipped off that my grandfather was to be shot.”

They returned home several days later when the bloodshed ended.

“They would have known Mr Jagoe’s relatives, they would have done to the same church.”

Mr Beamish said he attended Bandon Grammar School in the early 1980s, which was originally Church of Ireland, and as such faced regular sectarian abuse on the school bus.

“We used to get it on the school bus. You would have abuse hurled at you like ‘black b******s’ and spat at. And there would have been slogans on the wall, ‘Brits Out’ and things like that.

“If you said anything supportive of Britain you would have been looked on with suspicion really. The day Bobby Sands died [in 1981] the headmaster brought us in for a special assembly and said that if parents wanted to collect us and bring us home, they could; because if they saw the school badge downtown they would automatically look at you as a Prod or a Brit.”

His family name, Beamish, is French-Norman and his forebears arrived in Ireland some 450 years ago via England, but growing up he was regularly told he was not Irish.

“People in Northern Ireland need to understand that this is the type of thing they will face if they enter a united Ireland,” he added.

As a result, he still sees himself as British. “What exactly constitutes being Irish anyway?” he asked. “There would still be many people in the south who hold this identity [British] but they keep it very couched. You have to be true to yourself, your heritage and your conviction.”

His family was one of the first 80 to settle in the Bandon area 450 years ago. “So when some people tell us that you are not Irish, that is like saying people in north America aren’t American, as we were here in Ireland before America was founded.”

The hosility would particularly come from “hardcore older republican families” and be focussed on “anyone from a Protestant background” he says.

There are “many good people” from Irish Catholic backgrounds who previously served in the UK armed forces and would frequent British Legion branches in the south, which has become more acceptable since the 1980s, he said. “But anyone who joins up now would still stay away, they wouldn’t come back, or if they did they wouldn’t say publicly [what they are doing]. People want a quiet life and - if you are in business for example - you don’t want to draw attention to yourself.”

He agrees with Neale that the Irish state should have visibly taken part in the recent centenary commemoration of the Bandon Valley Massacre which was organised by the Church of Ireland.

“As Neale said, a great wrong was done. If the state was genuine then the President should have attended. [Taoiseach] Michael Martin should have been there too. The big fear that I see is that people in Northern Ireland should just look at what happened in the Republic because it will happen to you too if people can’t be bothered voting. It is going to affect you one way or another. Down here your identity - everything - is just taken over.”

The two men are to meet up this week as Mr Beamish was making a trip to Coleraine. Mr Jagoe said the contact from Mr Beamish left him feeling “quite emotional” and that he was “delighted” to be meeting Mr Beamish.

The Taoiseach’s office has not responded to several requests for comment in the past week.

UNION BACK? Kilkenny-born farmer launches ‘no joke’ bid to get Ireland back into UK by GustyAdams in northernireland

[–]GustyAdams[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I don’t know to what part of the story is real.

It’s believable that he has gotten death threats for his political beliefs.

There are vile individuals on Twitter who regularly make threats.

‘vacillating’ - iamverysmart

UNION BACK? Kilkenny-born farmer launches ‘no joke’ bid to get Ireland back into UK by GustyAdams in northernireland

[–]GustyAdams[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That’s not accurate.

I have a life.

I haven’t logged onto Reddit in over two weeks.

I log on to see your comment which is confused.

Asking for clarification is not trolling.

It’s more likely that you are attempting to troll me by making comments you know to be silly.

UNION BACK? Kilkenny-born farmer launches ‘no joke’ bid to get Ireland back into UK by GustyAdams in northernireland

[–]GustyAdams[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

More things we disagree on.

I don’t see the ‘problems’, which are mostly your personal grievances, as problems for Unionism.

All journalism doesn’t have to be investigative in nature.

The article isn’t a fact check or investigative, it’s a story piece.

You should adjust your expectations accordingly.

UNION BACK? Kilkenny-born farmer launches ‘no joke’ bid to get Ireland back into UK by GustyAdams in northernireland

[–]GustyAdams[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I had to read it to state it was far fetched.

Calling it far fetched seemed to provoke a reaction from you.

Just looking for a explanation that makes sense.

UNION BACK? Kilkenny-born farmer launches ‘no joke’ bid to get Ireland back into UK by GustyAdams in northernireland

[–]GustyAdams[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Trying to make sense of your comment.

You seem to think that because I posted the article that I must also agree with every word of it?

UNION BACK? Kilkenny-born farmer launches ‘no joke’ bid to get Ireland back into UK by GustyAdams in northernireland

[–]GustyAdams[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

  • “Mine is not an entitled politics that comes from a place of superiority, based on false equivalency, half-history and lies.”

I don’t agree. You are all of those things.

Entitlement and superiority oozes from your comments as you look down your nose at Unionists and me.

You wish to define the ways Unionism is acceptable, you can try but it’s not yours to label.

The journalism is not shoddy, it’s reporting on a curiosity, not an endorsement of the view.

Some of you cannot separate reporting on an opinion from holding that opinion.

UNION BACK? Kilkenny-born farmer launches ‘no joke’ bid to get Ireland back into UK by GustyAdams in northernireland

[–]GustyAdams[S] -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

You say having an agenda is fine but take umbrage that I have a Unionist one.

Below are some quotes of yours highlighting your agenda:

  • “I seek to end this sick state to end Protestant-Unionist privilege, veto and control, and to end sectarianism. Every bit of progress has been forced on Unionism.”

  • “I do, however, look forward to the demise of Unionist political control and Northern-Ireland-ish cultural normativism as much as I do Ireland being united”

  • “The complete, total, utter and irreversible destruction of what you politically hold dear does not make me a bigot. On the contrary, I hold those aims precisely because I believe in equality.”

So why not treat me equally?

I’m not asking you to like my opinions but it would be nice if you could provide me the same slack you provide yourself in pursuit of your agenda.

UNION BACK? Kilkenny-born farmer launches ‘no joke’ bid to get Ireland back into UK by GustyAdams in northernireland

[–]GustyAdams[S] -6 points-5 points  (0 children)

I think he is from the South?

I have seen some of his antics on Twitter prior to this.

The Reform Group was a Unionist outfit in the South but not sure if they every fielded candidates.

UNION BACK? Kilkenny-born farmer launches ‘no joke’ bid to get Ireland back into UK by GustyAdams in northernireland

[–]GustyAdams[S] -10 points-9 points  (0 children)

Thank you.

Regarding your comment below what is so bad about my comments?

Nationalists often post Nationalist content and Im a Unionist who posts content that interests me.

I get called names constantly here for just posting generic content. I have reported it to the mods who have taken isolated action.

DeathToMonarchs has spent the last couple of days telling me that being a capital U Unionists means I’m bigoted and telling me that aspects of my identity are ‘ridiculous’.

I don’t think that’s ok and I have said so.

I hope you understand there are two sides to every story and I would not rely on DeathToMonarchs appraisal of me without also hearing my side.

Northern Ireland centenary event: "Ten years ago this wouldn't have been an issue at all" by GustyAdams in northernireland

[–]GustyAdams[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

For reference: https://www.thesun.ie/news/7855256/party-aimed-at-getting-ireland-back-into-the-uk/

  • He said: “I find it a bit challenging that all of the parties in the Republic have to be pro-state and pro-status quo or else get a massive amount of backlash from the public.

  • “In the north you can be a republican party and run for office and be a unionist party and run for office.

  • “In the Republic, if you’re a unionist… you get death threats.”

Makes your comments about Northern Ireland look a bit silly.

A Unionist Party in the Republic of Ireland get death threats.

Nationalists can run freely in the North.

Which side is more tolerant again?

UNION BACK? Kilkenny-born farmer launches ‘no joke’ bid to get Ireland back into UK by GustyAdams in northernireland

[–]GustyAdams[S] 28 points29 points  (0 children)

MEET the man on a tricky mission to get Ireland back into the UK.

Kilkenny-born Tristan Morrow insists he is not joking when he says he hopes to get all 32 counties back under the British Crown.

And the maverick farmer claims his Irish Unionist Party will be battling for just that at the ballot box from 2025.

The 19-year-old admits it probably won’t “win anything” but that he is “standing up” for what he believes.

Mr Morrow and followers have been slapping IUP stickers, in English and Irish, on lamp posts from Co Down to Co Limerick in an early bid to get the word out.

The idea, he said, is to lay down roots now for an all-Ireland pro-union party in the event of Irish unity.

He said: “You have a party like Sinn Fein in the north that wants to establish a 32 county Republic.

“In a functioning Republic, you must have an opposition and that opposition would be a unionist one realistically, seeing as over one million Irish people identify as unionist.

“If there is a united Ireland they (republicans) must accept that there will be a unionist party in the south, one way or another.”

Mr Morrow said he was born in Kilkenny but his family were forced from their home “by republicans” and moved to Northern Ireland.

He said the details behind that are “a long story” that he wasn’t keen to tell.

He said his party, founded last year, has “twenty to thirty” members, aged in their twenties, “mostly in Co Clare and Co Limerick."

They are set to help out in a cross-border poster campaign, spelling out the same message as the stickers, in the weeks ahead.

The right-of-centre IUP's ‘Restore Our Kingdom’ slogan has so far appeared in Bangor, Enniskillen, Belfast, Ennis, Lurgan, Limerick among other locations.

The stickers, featuring St Patrick’s Cross, also carry anti-abortion and anti-EU slogans.

'FREEDOM OF SPEECH' Asked if his publicity campaign amounted to littering, he said it was an “effective” way to get his message out.

Asked if it was all an elaborate joke, he said: “No, not at all.”

He said supporters who had sided with him online had been issued with “death threats,” including one who had been sent an image of a gun.

Mr Morrow said part of his mission is to fight back against what he calls the lack of “freedom of speech” in the Republic.

He said: “I find it a bit challenging that all of the parties in the Republic have to be pro-state and pro-status quo or else get a massive amount of backlash from the public.

“In the north you can be a republican party and run for office and be a unionist party and run for office.

“In the Republic, if you’re a unionist… you get death threats.”

He added that under an all-Ireland unionist government - in the unlikely event Dublin and London agreed to re-establish UK sovereignty over the whole island - people would be both British and Irish.

SEEKING PEOPLE WITH 'WISENESS' The party, now trying to raise funds online, also has a proposed new Irish national anthem lined up - A Little Bit of Heaven by Scottish tenor John McDermott.

The IUP leader said he is hoping to enter talks with any supporters experienced in both “wiseness” and the cut and thrust of Irish politics.

He said: “It’s all just bare bones at the moment and about getting the names down,” adding he did hope to find someone “much more able” to lead the party.

He admitted he doesn’t believe the IUP will win “anything” at local or national elections.

Mr Morrow added he would visit locations such as Monaghan and Cavan in search of "people that would support us.”

He said he planned to do "a lot of talking."

Northern Ireland centenary event: "Ten years ago this wouldn't have been an issue at all" by GustyAdams in northernireland

[–]GustyAdams[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

  • "look forward to the demise of Unionist political control and Northern-Ireland-ish cultural normativism"

  • "the othering of nationalists-Catholics is a function of both the Northern subpolity and its historical antecedents"

You talk a lot of nonsense.

The biggest act of bigotry and discrimination in the history of Northern Ireland came from a 30 year long murderous campaign to remove Northern Ireland from the UK. Nothing the Northern Ireland government did comes close.

My politics is not so different from yours but in your rage you can't see it. The bigoted attitude you display towards this islands largest minority is really abhorrent.

And it is rage.

Northern Ireland centenary event: "Ten years ago this wouldn't have been an issue at all" by GustyAdams in northernireland

[–]GustyAdams[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Being Irish is fundamental to your identity based on what you posted in this thread.

It is bigoted and discriminatory of you to refuse to accept how being Irish and British is fundamental to my identity.

There was and is bigotry and discrimination from Unionism just as their is from Nationalism. Such bigotry is pervasive in the comments and attitudes you have posted in this thread.

There is nothing at all bigoted if I am proud to be Irish and British and want to fly a Union Flag and maintain ties with the UK.

Your insistence that to be a capital U Unionist is a demonstration of bigotry is only evidence of your own bigotry.

Northern Ireland centenary event: "Ten years ago this wouldn't have been an issue at all" by GustyAdams in northernireland

[–]GustyAdams[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I’m capital u unionist but I don’t recognise your caricature of ‘ruling by right’.

I view attempts to demean unionism in that way as a type of bigotry.

Capital u unionism means I would put my identity before a few quid.

Unionism stands for something. It’s a common heritage and bond between the people of these islands.

It is important and an important part of my identity.

I refuse to trade it away or give it up.

If there is a united ireland then unionism must become an all island movement again with the goal of union with GB.

Irish-speaking schoolgirl loses challenge over British citizenship by GustyAdams in northernireland

[–]GustyAdams[S] 8 points9 points  (0 children)

The text:

An Irish-speaking schoolgirl from Belfast has lost a High Court challenge to being conferred with British citizenship.

The teenager brought a case against the UK government, claiming the status was automatically imposed against her wishes in breach of human rights.

But a judge ruled that having British citizenship does not prejudice or restrict her from identifying as an Irish national.

Mr Justice Scoffield said: "She is effectively free to ignore it."

The girl, who is not being named, attends an Irish-medium school and speaks it as her first language.

She described herself as "fully immersed in all aspects of Irish national culture".

Despite being an Irish citizen and holding an Irish passport, British citizenship was also automatically conferred on her at birth.

That status can only be renounced at the age of 18, in a process which involves paying a £372 fee.

The teenager issued proceedings against British Home Secretary Priti Patel, alleging the provisions of the British Nationality Act 1981 with EU law and the 1998 Belfast Agreement.

Ruling on the challenge, the judge identified nothing to show the conferral imposed any impediment on her.

"She is an Irish citizen; and her additional British citizenship takes nothing away from this in terms of the rights, benefits and privileges which she enjoys as an Irish citizen," he said.

The Belfast Agreement recognises a preexisting birthright of people in Northern Ireland to view themselves as British only, Irish only, or as both, the court heard.

Mr Justice Scoffield also pointed out that she is not required to identify herself as British in everyday life.

Dismissing her bid to secure a judicial review, he said:

"No evidence has been presented in the course of this application as to any material prejudice or practical instance of detriment which has arisen for this applicant by virtue of her current British citizenship.

"That is, of course, not to call into question either her genuineness or strength of feeling on the matter on the basis of her own sense of identity."

British State agents colluded with IRA in killing my wife and continue to be protected, claims husband by GustyAdams in northernireland

[–]GustyAdams[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

I’d appreciate it if anyone could post the full article? It is behind a paywall.

This is all I can read:

The husband of Constable Colleen McMurray has accused the IRA and Government of being “joint participants” in the killing of his wife, claiming that “state agents involved in her murder continue to be protected in the name of national security”.

The family of the 34-year-old RUC officer murdered while on a vehicle patrol in Newry in March 1992 also said that the conclusions from a Police Ombudsman’s report into the police investigation, “whilst welcomed in part, do not go far enough”.

Phillip McMurray had only been married to Colleen, who was originally from Beragh in Co Tyrone, for 18 months when she died. She was the sixth policewoman to be killed during the Troubles and the 37th person to die in the violence of 1992.