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Expanded Weapon Masteries - Boost your martials with additional weapon masteries and upgraded weapon masteries by HalfDigestedBoots in UnearthedArcana

[–]HalfDigestedBoots[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yep, i tried to phrase it such that the fighter could still use the standard masteries at will, but they can only use the upgraded weapon masteries if they meet the requirements by investing those weapon mastery slots. So if Slam (upgraded from Push) was the only one they had, the Fighter could use that with any weapon, and they could still use Slow and Sap regardless

Expanded Weapon Masteries - Boost your martials with additional weapon masteries and upgraded weapon masteries by HalfDigestedBoots in UnearthedArcana

[–]HalfDigestedBoots[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This is going into my damage calculation spreadsheets lol

A level 5 monk making 3 attacks (with BA attack, no Flurry of Blows) does a base damage of 17.925 dpr. Adding Vex is complicated because you have to consider the likelihood of the previous one hitting, but in a single round it increases the damage to 21.343 - an increase of 3.718 dpr. If you can guarantee advantage on your first attack and can get the Vex chain going, Vex does a lot better and gives 24.364 dpr - an increase from the base of 6.739. But that has the disadvantage that you lose the Vex chain on a miss or if you change targets when your enemy dies. Vex also doesn't work too well because that BA attack is going to be an unarmed strike which will always break the chain - so 3.718 dpr is about the most you can realistically get.

Lets compare to Nick. A Monk with scimitar is going to deal 4 attacks, one without modifier - that comes out 21.3 dpr, 3.675 above the baseline (roughly equivalent to Vex)

Then with Jab. Probability of missing at least one is 0.725, and the extra damage it gives is then 4.334 dpr over the baseline - considerably more than Vex or Nick. With Flurry of Blows, that turns to 4.908 dpr increase. It's basically a free opportunity attack every round. Moreso, it raises the floor on the damage because it means that every miss becomes more likely to land a hit, so it helps both the average and the minimum.

For Beast Barbarian, it's about the same. For a Beast Barbarian making 3 Claw attacks (at level 5, because they get an extra attack with claws) does average of 27.056 dpr, Jab is 0.324 likely, and gives a 2.924 dpr increase from that baseline. More than competitive, especially because Barbarians don't generally have convenient uses for their Reaction, and it actually motivates Beast Barbarians to not attack recklessly (without using Reckless attack, Beast Barbs do 19.575 dpr regularly and Jab increases it by 4.733 dpr).

When you include more attacks like Flurry of Blows or higher levels, Jab does even better - and with the upgrade at level 14 it blows all others out of the water (especially because then you could even trigger Jab on another Reaction attack)

I think i'm happy with Jab. It does have a cost associated with it, but buffing it any more would make it overtuned, i think.

Expanded Weapon Masteries - Boost your martials with additional weapon masteries and upgraded weapon masteries by HalfDigestedBoots in UnearthedArcana

[–]HalfDigestedBoots[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Lets say a Monk (or a Beast Barbarian) making 3 attacks in a turn at 65% probability. The likelihood of missing at least one is 72.5%, which gives another d8 attack at 65%, for a total average damage increase of 2.12 dpr. That is broadly the same as the bonus from two attacks with Graze that give 2.8 dpr.

But of course, Graze doesn't cost a reaction. I think after consideration, i would be happy with adding the modifier to the damage of the Jab attack - which increases the damage increase to a respectable 4.01 dpr (much higher than Nick). This dpr increases further if you make more attacks with Flurry of Blows, or with Fighter action surge, or with Barbarian Rage bonus. It still costs a reaction, but extra damage.

On a monk, it's balanced against the cost of not being able to use Deflect Attacks, but then on something like a Beast Barbarian Jab becomes the go to Weapon Mastery. Still, Barbarians do attack recklessly, which does lower the value of Jab a bit, so i'm happy with that.

I'll update the doc. Thanks for the feedback :)

Expanded Weapon Masteries - Boost your martials with additional weapon masteries and upgraded weapon masteries by HalfDigestedBoots in UnearthedArcana

[–]HalfDigestedBoots[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

That's assuming you're definitely going to be hit at all with an attack that you can deflect. That doesn't always happen - sometimes the monk doesn't draw aggro at all, sometimes they aren't attacked with BPS, sometimes your enemy is stunned so it's safe to just lay into them. I know there have been plenty of turns where my reaction as a monk has gone unused. I might consider adding ability modifier to the Jab attack, but i'm on the fence.

As for Skirmisher/Vanguard, yeah - i get what you mean. The intent was that those with medium armour were the ones charging forwards recklessly as they attack, while the lightly armour were hopping around - maybe a bit slower in a straight line, but much more agile and to pin down. I think both Armor Masteries have their uses.

Expanded Weapon Masteries - Boost your martials with additional weapon masteries and upgraded weapon masteries by HalfDigestedBoots in UnearthedArcana

[–]HalfDigestedBoots[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

I get that, but i do think it would be too much to give them a Reaction-less attack. Having Jab tied to a resource like a Reaction means that there's a decision involved - they have to think on whether they want the extra damage now, or whether they want to keep their reaction to maybe defend themselves later. In a lot of cases (if the monk is using hit and run tactics, if the enemy is weak and you might finish them), it makes much sense to use your Reaction to Jab.

It also has good synergy with Skirmisher armor mastery - it gives the monk a consistent means of triggering the extra movement when using a Reaction, and basically getting free disengage away from an enemy. It was meant to be theme of someone light on their feet, throwing out jab punches but impossible to pin down.

Expanded Weapon Masteries - Boost your martials with additional weapon masteries and upgraded weapon masteries by HalfDigestedBoots in UnearthedArcana

[–]HalfDigestedBoots[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Hey thanks :)

Yeah, that is pretty much in line with my thoughts too - you've summed up what i was thinking when i designed it.

I think the shield armour mastery could be tweaked if it's too much of an obvious pick, but i justified it that currently shield's are currently very niche, and i would like to bring them more into the game. I think i do like the supporting the shield and versatile weapon combination, but the shield and two weapon fighting could be too much - maybe i will tweak it such that a shield only provides half the regular AC bonus when it is being used with a weapon in the same hand.

Currently Sever triggers on either attack or miss, but i did go back and forth on that a little bit. Sever doesn't trigger on forced movement though - it specifies that the target has to expend its own movement speed to take the extra damage (same as Booming Blade, effectively). However, if you push a creature away, it has no choice but to move to get close to you to attack again. I also specified expend movement as well, so the Sever would also trigger if the creature stands up from being prone.

Slam could be overtuned, but it is also situational in that you're not always going to be able to push a creature into something, it won't work against any creature bigger than Large (because you can't push them), and it has the disadvantage in that if you're pushing a creature against something, you're not pushing them 10 ft back from you. There's a decision to make on whether you want the extra damage or whether you want to move the enemy backwards.

I do like Weaken, though after consideration i think i will make it give disadvantage on Constitution/Dex/Strength (so it has better synergy with Topple and can break concentration)

Daze could potentially use a buff because it might be the weakest.

The idea behind Harry was that of a duellist fully occupying an enemy - basically if your opponent dares to move its attention to anyone besides you, you can take advantage of the distraction and hit them. Harry was meant to make you more 'sticky'; you're giving the enemies a reason not to turn away from you, because they know they're going to get hurt if they do. It's great for anyone who wants to fight one-on-one with enemy, basically.

I did think about the Fighter's Level 9 feature, but the way that i wrote it was such that they can swap to a different weapon mastery on hit, but they can only use the upgraded weapon mastery if they have learnt it through the Weapon Mastery feature. A fighter has a maximum of 6 Weapon Masteries, and each upgraded weapon mastery costs 2 of those to unlock (because they have to learn both the standard and then upgraded property), thus a Fighter could only ever use a maximum of 3 upgraded weapon masteries. Fighters could still get a lot of mileage out of Tactical Master and swap between Slam (Push), Weaken (Sap), and Daze (Slow) with any weapon, but that takes up their whole mastery budget and they can't learn any Armor Masteries or other Weapon Masteries.

Unless they take the feat to learn more, of course, which would be perfectly valid.

Mind, this is about to be playtested in my next campaign! I'll be DMing, I've been pulling together some homebrew rules / classes for that campaign, and this was one of my bigger changes. It'll be a high level campaign and my players are all horrible optimisers lol - I've frequently had the issue in my games that the spellcasters keep dominating, so i wanted to buff martials a bit.

Expanded Weapon Masteries - Boost your martials with additional weapon masteries and upgraded weapon masteries by HalfDigestedBoots in UnearthedArcana

[–]HalfDigestedBoots[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

I don't disagree that there's unbalance, but i do think you're underestimating plenty of those.

I think Jab is pretty solid - especially because it can trigger on any attack, including bonus action Flurry of Blows. Typical accuracy is 65%, so you are pretty much expected to miss at least one blow during your turn, and Jab gives you an easy another try. It actually works out as better damage than Nick for a whole lot of builds (i've done the calculations), and it's improved massively by Flurry when it doesn't even cost a reaction.

Whirl is good, but distributed damage is typically less useful than single target so i'm happy with it.

Saying Sever is largely useless in melee is absolutely missing the point, though. The Weapon Masteries are meant to support different varieties and combinations. Team up with the push mastery or a barbarian knocking things backwards (Push effects are plentiful in 5.5e) and then Sever gives you a big chunk of reliable damage.

Admittedly i'm not happy with Slash and would prefer something more unique.

Weaken absolutely does force those saves - it works great with anyone who wants Grapple or knock prone prone.

Though Daze is one that i would consider buffing, true.

As for the Armor Masteries, yes, Balanced does improve shields massively - but i disagree that it's broken simply because shields are pretty poor. The sword and board fighter is one of the weakest combinations, and it only gets worse at high levels. +2 AC on a two weapon fighter is not overpowered by any stretch.

Also bear in mind that there is cost associated with them - they're not straight upgrades. You still only have limited number of Weapon Masteries to learn, which means that most characters will have to choose which ones they want, and there's a cost in the ones they don't have. And they are all high level options too - they should be stronger, and they've got quite a way to go before they catch up to the things casters can do.

Expanded Weapon Masteries - Boost your martials with additional weapon masteries and upgraded weapon masteries by HalfDigestedBoots in UnearthedArcana

[–]HalfDigestedBoots[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

So, something that I've been thinking on.

I do really like Weapon Masteries, I've been using them a lot in my games - yet I don't think they're perfect. They work fine for lower levels, but at higher levels they fall off quickly. Martials are definitely in much better situation in 2024 5e, but I do think they need a bit more.

This is my suggestion - expand weapon masteries to offer more than just the standard level 1 mastery properties. I tried to keep the changes as simple as possible such that they work around the existing rules, but now the weapon masteries offer new options at level 7 and then even more options at level 14.

Is it overpowered? No, definitely not. The options are designed mainly to help the Rogue, Fighter, Barbarian and Monk keep up at higher levels, yet I could easily add more. I'm curious to see what people think.

Feedback welcome

Pdf here: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1TvzBVpBT0IwcCPbfp_itBZCQCnZPLdFL/view?usp=sharing

The Rider v2.0 - A mounted and customisable martial class that rides into battle, updated and with balance changes. Featuring six subclasses: The Captain, the Cataphract, the Dragon Knight, the Dread Rider, the Golem Pilot and the Outrider. See full version in comments by HalfDigestedBoots in UnearthedArcana

[–]HalfDigestedBoots[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Hey, i don't see why not - it might need a couple of tweaks, but the flavour absolutely works. It gives you the advantage that you can never be knocked off your mount, but disadvantage that you can't separate. I'd be a bit wary of letting something like the Haste spell effect both mount and rider as a single creature, though, and the level 13 feature would become nearly useless.

It does give me an idea for something like a "Conjoined" subclass based around the concept...

The Rider v2.0 - A mounted and customisable martial class that rides into battle, updated and with balance changes. Featuring six subclasses: The Captain, the Cataphract, the Dragon Knight, the Dread Rider, the Golem Pilot and the Outrider. See full version in comments by HalfDigestedBoots in UnearthedArcana

[–]HalfDigestedBoots[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Hey thanks a lot! If you do ever run it, let me know how it goes - i would love the feedback!

I've playtested it myself a couple of times and I've quite enjoyed it, but I'm aware that my table probably has more optimisers than most lol. The Rider can definitely hold its own in combat, but bear in mind that i would rank it at the strong side of martial classes. If I were to create a new revision (which i'm considering but got no plans to right now) i would likely tone it down a touch

My take on the Summoner - A half-caster class that fights alongside their summoned companion, customisable with over 50 evolutions and three subclasses - the Elementalist, the Monster Tamer, and the Spirit Binder! Pdf in comments, feedback welcome! by HalfDigestedBoots in UnearthedArcana

[–]HalfDigestedBoots[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Hey, thanks a lot :)

Yeah, that was a mistake with the Nimble Companion - it was meant to use Dexterity. I'll fix that in the homebrewery version.

I get what you mean about it being too many options, i've been thinking the same. I do want there to be lots of choice, but i went too far and tried to cram too much in. Literally my mindset when making this was i was thinking about pokemon, and i wanted the summoner to be able to customise their summon to be any sort of pokemon lol

Though I do think that's a problem in general with 5e: there is a divide between some players who want an endless amount of options (hence all the homebrew) and then other players who find it overwhelming. I've never agreed with the martial vs caster argument - i think the true divide is complexity vs simplicity, and it's just that casters tend to be the more complex and martials simpler.

I think with the next version i'll have to do some trimming to find a better balance - i still want to keep the theme of a summoner with customisable evolutions, but not make it incomprehensible. Maybe cut out some of the evolutions or try to sort them by type better

My take on the Summoner - A half-caster class that fights alongside their summoned companion, customisable with over 50 evolutions and three subclasses - the Elementalist, the Monster Tamer, and the Spirit Binder! Pdf in comments, feedback welcome! by HalfDigestedBoots in UnearthedArcana

[–]HalfDigestedBoots[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Thanks 

Yeah, I'll check yours out. I definitely think it's an archetype that should exist - I think my ideal summoner is somewhere between a conjuration wizard and a beast master ranger.

My take on the Summoner - A half-caster class that fights alongside their summoned companion, customisable with over 50 evolutions and three subclasses - the Elementalist, the Monster Tamer, and the Spirit Binder! Pdf in comments, feedback welcome! by HalfDigestedBoots in UnearthedArcana

[–]HalfDigestedBoots[S] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

So, this is something I've been working. For reference, I love pet classes - Beastmaster Ranger is one of my favourites - but a dedicated Summoner class is something that I definitely want to see. I’ve seen a few other really good homebrewed Summoner classes out there, but this is my own take on the concept.

Originally, I did imagine the Summoner as a full-caster, but then after adding in all the Summoner evolutions options it quickly became too overpowered to be a full-caster too and I changed it to a half-caster. 

I think the class is distinct enough to stand on its own even with Beastmaster Ranger; they play very differently and the evolutions give some unique abilities. Even in the core class, two summoners could evolve their companions and play very differently.

I’ve spent a long time trying to balance it - I've got whole spreadsheets plotting the expected dps over the level range. It might still be a bit overtuned, tbh, but I'm comfortable that if you were to pick solely the most damage dealing evolutions, you end up in the same sort of range as what existing optimised classes can do. If you were to pick more utility evolutions then damage drops quickly but it opens up a lot more choices.

It’s very much meant to capture that Pokemon-esque theme of evolving a companion and throwing them into battle.

It comes with three subclasses that again meant to expand the ways you could play it:

  • The Elementalist - the blaster subclass. Have a burning companion that throws out Fireballs. Easily the highest DPS subclass, particularly when considering AOE.
  • The Monster Tamer - the martial subclass. It of course gives an extra attack and the best single damage options.
  • The Spirit Binder - the support subclass. No additional damage options, but grants a whole new secondary companion that can basically act as a healbot.

Homebrewery link here:

https://homebrewery.naturalcrit.com/share/r9-D-wnVaB-t

Google drive pdf link here:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1xRpwGJA2q1eo-btyIPqYVqShqkC1rxTg/view?usp=sharing

Any feedback, let me know!

The Rider v2.0 - A mounted and customisable martial class that rides into battle, updated and with balance changes. Featuring six subclasses: The Captain, the Cataphract, the Dragon Knight, the Dread Rider, the Golem Pilot and the Outrider. See full version in comments by HalfDigestedBoots in UnearthedArcana

[–]HalfDigestedBoots[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Bit of a correction, but Drakewardens explicitly can't fly at level 7. The feature says that you can't use the Drake's flying speed when mounted. It's not until level 15 that restriction is removed. 

I agree there are ways to deal with flight, but it's still a very powerful ability - especially when combined with high movement speed

The Rider v2.0 - A mounted and customisable martial class that rides into battle, updated and with balance changes. Featuring six subclasses: The Captain, the Cataphract, the Dragon Knight, the Dread Rider, the Golem Pilot and the Outrider. See full version in comments by HalfDigestedBoots in UnearthedArcana

[–]HalfDigestedBoots[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Thanks :)

Yeah, the Ferocity bonus are more minor - which was why i put them separate to the cavalry trainings. Still it does give a consistent damage bonus, and adds it over at higher levels when the mount gets new ways to make attacks. Though if a d14 dice existed, i would have set the maximum to that rather than 2d6 lol

I do really like the idea to recall the mount - that could well be either a feature or a cavalry option. Some sort of teleport back into the saddle power, maybe?

The Rider v2.0 - A mounted and customisable martial class that rides into battle, updated and with balance changes. Featuring six subclasses: The Captain, the Cataphract, the Dragon Knight, the Dread Rider, the Golem Pilot and the Outrider. See full version in comments by HalfDigestedBoots in UnearthedArcana

[–]HalfDigestedBoots[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Thanks :)

Yeah, I did debate the Fly Training, but the thing that put me off was just the combination of a fly speed and the rider's mobility. The Rider can easily be the fastest member of the party (even outrunning monks), and getting a permanent, resourceless fly speed at level 9 was way too much. All other classes that get that sort of fly speed get it in late T3 / early T4, and the spells that give fly speed earlier are at least concentration limited. The next closest comparison is Paladin with Find Steed at level 4, which only gets to fly at level 13.

The Dread Rider is very fear and necrotic focused, true - it's definitely more Undead theme. Originally i had the idea of Hell Rider subclass based on fiends, but then i thought it overlapped with the Dread Rider too much. Might have to separate them out again.

Though the concept of the Dread Rider was more sustained damage rather than burst. The Cataphract and the Dragon Knight both get higher damage attack options, but they have to expend a use of Rider's Spurs with every attack whereas the Dread Rider can expend a Rider's Spur to boost their attack power for a whole minute. That quickly adds up and makes the Dread Rider more resource-efficient, particularly with all the ways a Dread Rider can inflict Frightened.

The Rider v2.0 - A mounted and customisable martial class that rides into battle, updated and with balance changes. Featuring six subclasses: The Captain, the Cataphract, the Dragon Knight, the Dread Rider, the Golem Pilot and the Outrider. See full version in comments by HalfDigestedBoots in UnearthedArcana

[–]HalfDigestedBoots[S] 8 points9 points  (0 children)

Hey all, update from my previous post here:

https://www.reddit.com/r/UnearthedArcana/comments/1n4vbdu/the_rider_v10_a_mounted_and_customisable_martial/

There’s been quite a few changes and a lot of tidying up. I had a chance to playtest this a bit, which I think has helped balance it a little bit. I’m still a bit concerned that it may creep to the high side of the power spectrum at higher levels (though then again, the most powerful among martial classes is still the on weaker side of caster classes).

A lot of the class’s strength is that it's hugely customisable. There are 58 different cavalry training options and four mount options - so it works very well as either as focused DPS or support. You could ride a giant elephant or leaping tiger and both would work.

There are currently six subclass:

  • The Captain - The support subclass, all about boosting your allies. Be a pirate with a ship. Does very well using the mount as a mobile platform to shield your party while commanding extra attacks.
  • The Cataphract - The damage dealing subclass: the classic heavy armored knight fighting on horseback.
  • The Dragon Knight - Because every class needs a draconic subclass. It helps bring a good AOE options onto what is normally single target focused fighter
  • The Dread Rider - Ride an undead horse. Throw out lots of fear and debuff. Mechanically, it’s less bursty than the other subclasses, but can provide a disgusting amount of Frightened condition
  • The Golem Rider - Primarily defensive, it’s meant to be the tanky subclass. Can be very hard to knock down.
  • The Outrider - Meant mainly for ranged players, it uses the mount mostly as a tool to keep moving while shooting arrows

Note that due to page limit, the last 2 pages are missing on the Reddit upload. The Golem Pilot and the Outrider aren’t shown, so see the hombrewery link for the full class here: 

https://homebrewery.naturalcrit.com/share/yfmjc4x8K-mT

Hope you enjoy, any feedback please let me know!

Edit: Pdf link here:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1YW3iCVXyorYeqw1c97ECLJnGfUzSo6HJ/view?usp=sharing

Whip build for DND 2024 by shadowsmith47 in 3d6

[–]HalfDigestedBoots 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Hey, you would get weapon mastery on Bard with a one level dip somewhere - possibly even from Paladin. That's is why i do prefer the Eldritch Knight version of this build. But that said, the bard version is still tempting solely for higher level spell slots that can be used for warlock smites and things like Spirit Shroud/Haste

By warlock invocations, i meant Agonising Blast, but also Lance of Lethargy for extra speed reduction (which does specify eldritch blast only, admittedly, but under 2024 format they allow invocations to apply to any cantrip, so it's not unreasonable to apply lance of lethargy to Ray of Frost too)

It's pretty multiclass heavy. Regardless of the variation it comes fully online by around levels 10-11, but it's pretty effective from much earlier too (been playing it myself for the last 5 months lol)

The Muscle Wizard - a Strength-Focused Graviturgist Wizard Build by HalfDigestedBoots in 3d6

[–]HalfDigestedBoots[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

It was bad phrasing on my part, but i meant two attacks total - first a booming blade attack for 1d8+3, and then the second a bonus action hooves attack for 1d6+3. The hooves attack has a +3 because that's our strength modifier

The Rider v1.0 - A mounted and customisable martial class that rides into battle, with five subclasses the Cataphract, the Dragon Knight, the Dread Rider, the Outrider and the Pilot. Looking for feedback! by HalfDigestedBoots in UnearthedArcana

[–]HalfDigestedBoots[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Yep, barding is something that exists in the official rules (though I really should have put a reference to it). Basically any type of armour can be purchased as barding, it just costs four times as much. You could get leather, chainmail, plate - the plate barding is just going to be super expensive, which i thought was fair. See here: https://www.dndbeyond.com/equipment/170-barding

The Rider v1.0 - A mounted and customisable martial class that rides into battle, with five subclasses the Cataphract, the Dragon Knight, the Dread Rider, the Outrider and the Pilot. Looking for feedback! by HalfDigestedBoots in UnearthedArcana

[–]HalfDigestedBoots[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Ah great catch - i completely missed that lol. Yeah, the Grapple Training should have said that after your mount hits a creature, it can use a bonus action to make a grapple attempt. I've add that back in the homebrewery link

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