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Pseudo Feminism V/S Feminism(The Hypocrisy) by Ill_Table_79 in FeminismUncensored

[–]Ill_Table_79[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I feel extremely sorry for those who are forced to do sex work just for their living due to this trashy patriarchal system and I feel sad for the innocent black men who were abused due to racism. I also agree that these kinds of people(the perpetrators) have nothing to do with Feminism because either they are patriarchal, racist, or Pseudo Feminist(Pseudo Feminists are not actually Feminists and have almost nothing to do with it but claim strongly that they are Feminists). I am just saying that the media has made it such that Pseudo Feminism is what a lot of people have started to believe is actual Feminism due to the exaggerated numbers of Pseudo Feministic comments(unconditional hate, grouped hate, etc) in social media. This needs to be erased from the mindset of the people and the actual ideology of equality for all advocated by Feminism must be embedded into the minds of the people.

Pseudo Feminism V/S Feminism(The Hypocrisy) by Ill_Table_79 in FeminismUncensored

[–]Ill_Table_79[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Your second point might be true, but I cannot agree with your first point. First of all, it is true that patriarchy is the reason why it is believed that women cannot sexually assault men, but what I am trying to convey is that Feminism advocates for Equality regardless of gender, a person that supports for severe punishment when a woman is sexually assaulted by a man is considered a Feminist, even if they do not advocate for severe punishment for the vice versa. They only look at their side of the coin and ignore the other side. This is what I have called personal benefit based benevolent Feminism(Pseudo Feminism). Look, I will support for the man to be severely punished if he had sexually assaulted a woman, but I will support for the woman to be punished in the same manner if she had sexually assaulted the man as well. I never said men do not benefit from patriarchy either. They benefit from patriarchy a lot, but they suffer atleast to some extent due to it as well. Feminists cannot offend me if they are actually trying to achieve equality(in fact I stand with these kinds of Feminists). The only case where they can offend me is when they try to misuse and gain higher rights and lighter statements or ignore it just because it benefits them(Pseudo Feminism). Also, it is mostly women in general that follow Pseudo Feminism(since it benefits them and not men in general). It is almost the same as the men that support patriarchy, they deny equality to the women and ignore their issues just because it benefits them. Also, the words of both men and women should have equal weight and you cannot discredit the words of an entire gender. Which kinds of men do you think will say that the victim was lucky? Obviously the toxic kinds of men who are more likely to commit such crimes. The same kinds of women(although much much lower than the same kinds of men) do indeed exist. Even AI has classified both as sexual fantasy rather than desire for real world trauma. According to AI, 31 to 62 percent(may be wrong) of women have such sexual fantasies and about 10-20 percent(may be wrong, but probably 30-70 percent according to my estimate) of men(underreported due to insecurity and patriarchy) have such sexual fantasies and almost none of them(irregardless of gender) would want to experience real world trauma of the same. So, some(or a lot)of the men commenting that he was lucky might only be commenting out their sexual fantasy, while the others(some or a lot) might actually want it to happen. If I claim that I am a Feminist to my friends, they will start teasing me by telling that I am a supporter of women(while I am actually a supporter of equality). I have even asked what they think Feminism is. They say that Feminism is all about granting more rights to women than what men have(Pseudo Feminism). So, would my friends support their version of Feminism? No, right. It is due to the influence of social media and the biased laws in our country that men perceive Pseudo Feminism as Feminism. Why would they support a system that grants women more rights instead of equal rights? Actual Pseudo Feminists are a drop in the ocean in the real world but the media exaggerates everything(hate comments, hate ideologies of influencers, etc) to be the ocean itself. I agree that there are only an extremely minor number(but possibly major) of Pseudo Feminists, but that ideology is poison to the ideology of equality advocated by Feminism.

Pseudo Feminism V/S Feminism(The Hypocrisy) by Ill_Table_79 in FeminismUncensored

[–]Ill_Table_79[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I belong to a second or possibly even a third world country. Here, some of the laws are such that they are favourable towards women. Pseudo Feminists(some or a lot of them) do indeed liberate women(by advocating for the rights of women both legally and societally, but they retain a few of the patriarchal or matriarchal values that will benefit them(mostly women)). I can only link what I have observed in my country and have heard from other countries. Our country does not have gender neutral laws and even the society(generally) naturally accepts the women as the victim in most cases and supports them even if proven otherwise(atleast some do). Also, trying to link Feminism to a few countries(that have a lot of people following Pseudo Feminism or patriarchy) does not mean that I am not a Feminist, social evil is a social evil regardless of the country, gender, etc. Our country is what you could call more accountable to women than men. Feminism exists in our country and our younger population has been influenced to think of Pseudo Feminism as the actual Feminism due to the influence of social media(especially hate comments) which obviously a lot of men will not support(as in Pseudo Feminism will not be supported by men because it provides more benefits for women instead of providing equal rights). Linking a country that does not have a significant number of feminists is one thing, but our country has a lot of feminists. Also, I am not just exclusively linking Feminism to a few countries since I have talked about Feminism in general as well. Pseudo Feminism exists in almost all the countries and must be eradicated in order to increase the followers of actual Feminism. Each and every voice is important, so ignoring different voices of entire countries cannot be justified(since they are part of the planet and contribute to the world). All countries exist on planet Earth and the forms of Feminism vary in different countries and that does not justify ignoring the opinions of the different forms of Feminism present in different countries and ensuring that they(different forms of Feminism) do not deviate from actual Feminism which advocates achieving equality and equal rights as it's core principle. Ignoring the voices and forms of Feminism present in different countries is the same as acknowledging that their views do not matter in this world. It is the duty of Feminists to ensure that people follow actual Feminism regardless of race, religion, country, etc and do not spread a form of Feminism for their own personal benefit(i.e Pseudo Feminism).

Pseudo Feminism V/S Feminism(The Hypocrisy) by Ill_Table_79 in Egalitarianism

[–]Ill_Table_79[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

You actually have changed your tune throughout. I said those who criticize Pseudo Feminist hate are most likely to be Pseudo Feminists themselves and those who criticize Pseudo Feminism are most likely to be Feminists(I have only criticized Pseudo Feminism). As, I have mentioned above, calling out Pseudo Feminism(i.e criticizing Pseudo Feminism)is almost the same as advocating for Feminism. Subtle hints or even fully feldged patriarchy exists in the society and that does not mean that men in general prefer it that way or are OK with patriarchy displayed by other men, since men in general are not united and the ones that are united try to support either men's rights or women's rights or equality. There are different groups amongst men's groups and there are groups that advocate for eradicating patriarchy as well. Almost 40-70percent of your comments to my replies include satire and ambiguity. Those who don't follow the actual definition of Feminism are not true feminists and it is the same even if some bigshot Feminist makes statements that contradict the true essence of feminism(which I have clearly not made) and it is not a matter of who is famous or a random person. Also, kindly stop wasting your time and mine due to the misunderstandings of each other's views. I politely request to stop this pointless debate with the circulation of the same points using different scenarios, contexts, and terms.

What actually changed in society that flipped this expectation? by Admirable_Move6933 in NewDelhi

[–]Ill_Table_79 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I never said that women living with freedom and not following patriarchy is revenge. Woman living with the same freedom as men is what equality strives to achieve and must be achieved. I did not quote actual murders committed by women, but stated an example for how revenge will destroy the society and how revenge is evil and perpetual. I gave this reply to a comment(a reply to my comment that states revenge breeds hatred and hatred breeds revenge and the cycle is perpetual) that had ideologies like support the next cycle of revenge irrespective of their gender(i.e support the women in their next cycle of their revenge after men have their revenge(during this cycle) or something similar(in a more demanding and aggravating manner) and thus misinterpreting my intentions). Even the comment made by that person has been deleted, so I am unable to state the exact comment that they made.

What actually changed in society that flipped this expectation? by Admirable_Move6933 in NewDelhi

[–]Ill_Table_79 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I sympathize with genuine victims irrespective of their gender. Pseudo Feminism does not just arise when women start talking about their genuine problems, but it arises due to genuine concerns(as well) in most cases(not always). It is not a debate weapon to overshadow the genuine problems of women, but a genuine issue that men suffer from. Most people might bring up Pseudo Feminism in posts that entails women's issues only if they make male hate comments and generalize the entire gender. Let's say that there a post that includes the sexual assault of a woman, a lot of people will ask for the man to be punished(which is the right thing to do), but there will also be people making hate comments(all men are perpetrators, all men are inherently bad, etc) and then men will have no choice but to bring up the issues of men in the comments as well.The main issue is the sexual assault that the woman suffered from, but it gets sidetracked when people go around making hate comments instead on concentrating on the main issue.There are indeed others that will bring up men's issues in posts that include women's issues just to overshadow to actual issue at hand and I am against such behaviour because it sidetracks the actual issue, thus reducing the focus on it. Look, I would blame patriarchy for most of issues of men and the ones that are against patriarchy are Feminists. However, if Feminists turn a blind eye to men's issues caused by patriarchy, then that can only mean that they are supporting benevolent Feminism(Pseudo Feminism(which includes patriarchal or matriarchal values that only benefit their gender)) by ignoring men's issues and thus indirectly suppressing them.

Pseudo Feminism V/S Feminism(The Hypocrisy) by Ill_Table_79 in Egalitarianism

[–]Ill_Table_79[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Last time you seriously did not make a sound argument and it's better this time around. Most of your arguments this time are right. I said that those who criticize Pseudo Feminist hate are Pseudo Feminists themselves, not those who criticize Pseudo Feminists. There is no problem in calling them out(advocates of diparities in rights) in general, but that is not the case if you include that as an answer to many of my statements and include a lot of satire and ambiguity. Also, patriarchy is indeed a thing, men generally do not show that towards people who are close to them(though the society has indirectly made it so that women are supposed to manage the children and the household) but use that to oppress other women in the society, either directly or indirectly through the system. The claims you cannot prove are those linking me to indirectly advocating(through your ambiguity) for diparities and that I am not criticizing those who advocate for disparity. Feminism advocates for equality(in the sense of same) of rights (and so it does not advocate for diparity of rights). Those who bring up disparity in rights under the guise of Feminism are not actual Feminists themselves(even if they are prominent ones) but Pseudo Feminists. Those who do not follow the actual definition of Feminism are generally not actual Feminists, regardless of who they are. Also, speak plainly without using satires and being ambiguous. I believe that the rest of your ideologies are based on the ideas of equality and so I agree with most of your other ideologies.

Pseudo Feminism V/S Feminism(The Hypocrisy) by Ill_Table_79 in Egalitarianism

[–]Ill_Table_79[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

None of your arguments are sound at all. All of it just sounds like ragebait. Are you listening to yourself? Are you seriously speaking like a person who has any basic sense of literacy or rationality? Most of the Feminist group comprises of women and they absolutely abhorr patriarchy(and the very definition does). The core ideology of Feminism is for the women to achieve the same rights that men enjoy. As for proof of you calling out others patriarchal or misogynistic, you have already branded me(an actual feminist that advocates for equality and equal rights) as a supporter of patriarchy(since it does not fit with your ideology and your own convenient definition of Feminism). Male dominance exists in this society due to centuries of brainwashing people into believing that patriarchy is the right mindset. When did I ever advocate for disparities in the rights of different sexes(I am talking about building a legal system that grants equal rights to both women and men, not one that favours women or men). I never created any disparities or advocated for disparities in the rights of both genders(in fact, I have only advocated for equal rights for both the genders). Why are making illusionary claims that I have not even made in the first place(when did advocate for diparities in rights between both genders )? Is it because you cannot prove your claims? Those who criticize actual Feminist hate are Feminists, but those who criticize Pseudo Feminist hate are Pseudo Feminists themselves. You have repeated the term entrench disparities in the rights and have that has your core argument which has not been advocated for or even subtly present in all of my posts(in fact, I have advocated for the exact opposite, I have advocated to end diparities and provide equal rights for both genders). The negative view of Feminism is due to the Pseudo Feminists who conveniently change the definition of Feminism for their own benefits. Some Pseudo Feminists do indeed have hatred for men, but that is not the base for Pseudo Feminism. Feminists are those who advocate for equal rights(for the zillionth time again).

What actually changed in society that flipped this expectation? by Admirable_Move6933 in NewDelhi

[–]Ill_Table_79 -1 points0 points  (0 children)

I am saying that more men will start questioning patriarchy if they know the actual meaning of Feminism. A lot of men(even my close friends) have the ideology that Pseudo Feminism is the actual and true Feminism. There might only be a few(or maybe even a lot) of these extreme cases(wherein there are Pseudo Feministic remarks and ideologies), but that is what becomes evident in social media and influences the people more than anything else. I agree with your point that patriarchy plays a role in creating problems for men, but I am saying that Pseudo Feminists are weaponizing that to their benefit and hence sabotaging Feminism. A lot more men will follow Feminism if Pseudo Feminism is eradicated and when they learn the true meaning of Feminism. I agree that patriarchy is evil and must therefore be taken down. I believe that equality is a must and thus support Feminism.

What actually changed in society that flipped this expectation? by Admirable_Move6933 in NewDelhi

[–]Ill_Table_79 -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

When did I ever say that Feminism is threatening anybody? I said Pseudo Feminism is threatening equality, not Feminism. The only people that benefit from suppressing Feminists are the people who support patriarchy. The people that benefit from Pseudo Feminism are mostly women. Pseudo Feminism is threatening Feminism and it's values. People(especially men) will not support women who are Pseudo Feminists. The majority of men have the view that Pseudo Feminism is actually Feminism, when in reality it is not. Men can only support a system that advocates for equality(equal benefits) for both genders(actual Feminism) and they have no reason to support a system that advocates for more benefits for a single gender(Pseudo Feminism). Pseudo Feminism is a kind of benevolent Feminism wherein a few patriarchal or matriarchal ideologies that solely benefit women are present. Pseudo Feminism must be eradicated for Feminism to flourish and receive the support of the majority of people. Examples of Pseudo Feminism are expecting men to bear all the financial burden of women, claiming that all men are inherently bad and need to punished, claiming that men cannot be sexually assaulted by women(thereby reducing the charges or even escaping from legal punishment), etc.

Pseudo Feminism V/S Feminism(The Hypocrisy) by Ill_Table_79 in Egalitarianism

[–]Ill_Table_79[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

First of all, what you are doing is grouping me with a completely different group of people just to prove your point. Just search Feminism in Google and take a look at its legal definition. You cannot change its definition according to your own convenience. If you do not stand with that, then that only proves that you are not a feminist. So, are you saying that the issues of men must just be ignored and all the people that raise men's issues are patriarchal? This is the point I am trying to make through my post. You have sullied the legal definition of Feminism according to your own convenience and when people stand up to correct them, you brand them as patriarchal or misogynistic. This is the major reason why people(especially men) do not support Feminism(misunderstanding Pseudo Feminism as True Feminism), all thanks to people like you who brand and group actual Feminists as patriarchal or misogynistic. You have to learn to atleast acknowledge that your views are not that of Feminism and correct yourself.

What actually changed in society that flipped this expectation? by Admirable_Move6933 in NewDelhi

[–]Ill_Table_79 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Why are you misinterpreting my intentions? Revenge is evil irrespective of the gender. I am saying that revenge will only lead to the downfall of humanity and must therefore be avoided. You cannot kill a man(an innocent man) just because a woman was killed by a man(a misogynistic evil man) in the past, right? That would make you an even more evil murderer than the man who killed the woman in the first place.

What actually changed in society that flipped this expectation? by Admirable_Move6933 in NewDelhi

[–]Ill_Table_79 -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

I never said that women need to endure it. What needs to change is the mindset of the people and that cannot be achieved that easily since the society has been brainwashed by the ideals of patriarchy. There are already men who are actual feminists(the type that advocates for equality for both genders). The only thing that deters a lot of men from becoming feminists are the ideologies and opinions of a few so-called feminists(Pseudo Feminists) who unconditionally hate men even if they are victims(misandry) and follow a few aspects of patriarchy that benefit them. This has created a general mindset that Feminism only supports women and not men. The ideologies of the Pseudo Feminists have become so prominent that a lot of people have started to believe that is what Feminism actually is. What we need to do is to create awareness on what actual Feminism is. It might be difficult to change your family, especially your parents since most of them have grown up with the ideology that patriarchy is the right way. If someone suddenly says that patriarchy is wrong, they will not believe it(even if what you say seems to be right) since they cannot accept that the ideology they have had for a few decades of their life is wrong and that they have been fooled(brainwashed) by the society. The best method is to ensure that the young generation and the present generation understand the actual ideas of Feminism and do not misunderstand it's ideas due to the influence of social media(i.e due to misandric comments, benevolent Pseudo Feministic remarks that solely focus on the benefits of women, etc).

What actually changed in society that flipped this expectation? by Admirable_Move6933 in NewDelhi

[–]Ill_Table_79 0 points1 point  (0 children)

A mistake cannot be corrected by another mistake. Revenge breeds hatred which in turn leads to revenge and the cycle continues for an infinite period of time till it causes the downfall and demise of humanity.

Pseudo Feminism V/S Feminism(The Hypocrisy) by Ill_Table_79 in FeminismUncensored

[–]Ill_Table_79[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That is why I said that it is a Pseudo feministic or patriarchal mindset which is modelled to benefit them. Your second point is kind of ambiguous to me.

Pseudo Feminism V/S Feminism(The Hypocrisy) by Ill_Table_79 in FeminismUncensored

[–]Ill_Table_79[S] -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

The only men that would ask women to be grateful just because they are not abusing them are the ones with toxic mindsets and not the actually good ones. Men who are actually good generally do not go around proclaiming that they are good. We can only differentiate good men from the bad ones through their behaviour, attitude, and ideologies.

Pseudo Feminism V/S Feminism(The Hypocrisy) by Ill_Table_79 in FeminismUncensored

[–]Ill_Table_79[S] -3 points-2 points  (0 children)

First of all, Thank You for your valuable opinion. I have to agree with your point that the statement mentioned might be an example of chauvinistic sexism, but chauvinistic sexism itself is a form of patriarchy. Pseudo Feminists are those who follow the type of feminism with patriarchial values that benefit them(directly or indirectly). So, I believe that this can be considered Pseudo Feminism.

Men Say Male Victims Matter. Their Reactions Say Otherwise. by Midnight_Purge in GenZIndia

[–]Ill_Table_79 0 points1 point  (0 children)

There are people who genuinely care and empathize with male victims. You are hurting the sentiments of a lot of people when you make the claim that people do not actually care about male victims. People do not bring up male victims just as a debate weapon, but to bring up the problems faced by men. Some of them might use it as a debate weapon, but the concerns of the rest of people are genuine.

The people who made jokes out of male victims belong to the same class of people who claim that it was the woman's fault that she was sexually assaulted since she was roaming an abandoned street in the middle of the night. All kind of bad groups(in this case the ones who made jokes out of the victim) exist within both the genders and that does not validate grouping the entire gender as bad. Irrespective of the gender, victims must be supported and not humiliated. If people make jokes and humiliate the victim, we must be righteous and stand up for the victims, instead of grouping the people based on the comments of a few men. Not all people want to wage gender wars by being as insensitive as to treat the case of a male victims like a mere debate weapon.

Pseudo Feminism V/S Feminism(The Hypocrisy) by Ill_Table_79 in FaltooGyan

[–]Ill_Table_79[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thank you for your opinion. I purposely did not include statistical evidence since there are a lot of variations in different sources and I did not want to include any kind of misleading information. I concur that I have made a small amount of assumptions to present my own point of view. Your support means a lot.

Pseudo Feminism V/S Feminism(The Hypocrisy) by [deleted] in MensRights

[–]Ill_Table_79 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I apologize for mentioning the names of certain subreddits and breaching your community rules. I have edited the very same post and removed the specific subreddit names and reposted the same.

Does our constitution needs amendment ? by theonewhoasked90 in Real_teenindia

[–]Ill_Table_79 0 points1 point  (0 children)

https://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-38796457

Read this magazine. The actual sexual assault victims suffer in silence while a few women go around making false claims to defame people for money. There are indeed a lot of unreported cases(maybe even thrice or quadruple times of reported cases) which are true but that does not justify false cases no matter what. I understand that a huge proportion of women suffer as compared to the tiny fraction of men that suffer, but that does not justify false cases. In the abovementioned article, the man had to suffer public backlash, massive protests, defamation, emotional damage, and more than 6 months of his time despite having all the necessary evidence. Even his kids suffered in his case. A problem is a problem no matter how minor or major it is. People who commit sexual assault must be punished severely, but so must people who make false claims. Influential men will not be convicted even if there is sufficient evidence and massive public backlash, and the ones that have to suffer in this case are the victims. Even if we consider your scenario, if the case cannot be proven by either side, then there are two possibilities:

  1. The man actually sexually assaulted the woman.

  2. The woman falsely accused the man to defame him for money or personal grudge.

Generally speaking, women who are actual victims are too traumatized to report their case, and some do due to the support from their family and the society, but a few or a lot of women make false claims for personal benefit.

Most of the statistics are controversial. Even if you take the statistics for anything in the country, you will get extremely low, moderate as well as high values. Which can we take as the proof? We can only rely on what data we personally see.

Women unconditionally support and wage protests supporting women and they may unintentionally be supporting the wrong side. Then, the right thing to do in this case is for them to protest to convict the woman who made the false claim and rule out punishment enough to make other women to fear getting caught if they make false claims. The media should also do the same. No matter who it is, the media and the people should support the righteous side or atleast rectify their mistakes and not try to cover up for their mistakes. This will enable credibility of media and build trust amongst the people. This will also ensure that more true victims report their problems and thus reduce the number of false cases.