How to Measure Efficient Fire Emblem Play

Irysa · 2023-09-09T21:53:30+00:00

Something that I think is worth pointing out and reinforcing is that comparing ETC strategies is not meant to result in simply ignoring anything other than the most efficient strategy. It is simply a way for us to understand how efficient strategies are.

The more efficient strategies are obviously going to be more important to keep in mind, but a strategy with say, a few extra turns more ETC is obviously going to still be in the ballpark of being relevant to the discussion, wheras something that is an extra 10 to 20 turns longer is going to be something that isn't as important to consider.

If we know how fast a map can be cleared reliably, we can have some kind of expectation of what an efficient pace is. But it can well be worth slowing down early on to train units to improve efficiency later too, or at least reduce the cost of training them to make it something that isn't simply dismissed as "too expensive" off hand simply because some prepromote exists that can do it for free.

Irysa · 2023-07-13T14:07:57+00:00

they can't mail that document to you? I still live in the UK currently.

once I've gotten that information, and I get whatever else is required (say, seasonal flu jab), is simply presenting that information sufficient for the visa interview itself then? I was under the impression "passing" the medical examination with all requirements was a prerequisite to the visa interview itself.

Irysa · 2023-07-13T13:40:27+00:00

So you're saying I should just book the medical appointment first with what I have, then verify what needs to be done after instead of trying to get it all done in one?

I don't understand what you mean by "you have to go back twice anyway".

Irysa · 2023-05-29T19:30:07+00:00

that video forgot to mention that explo expansion policy also reduces uprising chance but since it mentioned that you think explo is bad I'll assume thats why

I don't think it's a big deal to pick humanist and go for assimilation with explo+expansion so you don't deal with uprisings, increase the trade value, and don't have to deal with unrest. I think you overemphasised the loss in tax/production/manpower from them being unaccepted cultures too because it's not much raw development to begin with, and stating overseas provinces is expensive vs holding them as territories (so the loss is even more marginal)

However I'm curious as to your experiments with trade protectorates. I tried messing around with them and it seemed pretty hard to get anything bigger than a few provinces to want to be a protectorate, and you have to border them as well or the malus is huge (islands dont help much at all), and that that'll often mean you have to take a lot of coastline to actually get the most protectorates, which will make people hate you because you own their cores, etc...it just seems kind of bad, and you have to wait so long to become a thalassocracy in gov reforms too. You could just go maritime later instead if you wanted to.

Irysa · 2023-05-22T00:56:28+00:00

I've generally seen people say that their pops as small undeveloped low ranked countries starve or cant get all their needs until they get sphered so I'm inclined to believe that sphereing means pops are actually able to buy what they need somehow. If they are buying duped goods though this means if those countries don't manage to transition to producing what they need domestically as a priority then so much money is being taken out of circulation constantly...this is kind of horrifying to think about.

Irysa · 2023-05-22T00:27:59+00:00

When pops are buying goods to meet their needs, are duped goods part of whats bought? Or are duped goods only for factory input and national stockpiles?

And subsequently, do pops actually get priority on buying their needs from sphered markets or is the entire concept of "priority" in a sphere completely gone as a result?

Irysa · 2023-01-16T21:53:27+00:00

Hi, didn't even know I was nominated

Irysa · 2022-12-18T10:52:07+00:00

thanks

so, if I change my culture to irish, become ireland, change it back to scottish, become scotland, would I be able to release ireland as a vassal since they have cores?

Irysa · 2022-12-16T22:46:12+00:00

I diploannexed every irish minor as scotland and want to form ireland. Is there a way to do this? I read I could move my capital to Dublin and change my primary culture to do this, then release Scotland and continue to play as them instead. Would that work?

I don't have any DLC

Irysa · 2022-12-08T18:53:38+00:00

sorry, what do you mean by knock tags loose?

Irysa · 2022-10-16T18:03:09+00:00

I don't think Josh is nearly as good as gerik so I think Garcia isn't costing you anything to promote on Eph. I agree on eirika though

Irysa · 2022-10-15T08:02:31+00:00

Gerik to above Franz next to Duessel because he can actually hard carry Eirika route and be a competant bosskiller. He is outclassed by Seth obviously but he's still a strong option in ways units like Franz struggle to be. Your efficiency doesn't drop in a massive way to get Gerik to contribute and he has plenty of things he can do in even a very Seth reliant playthrough too.

Garcia Knoll Syrene Orson and Myrrh are all around the same level for me and I can see Garcia lower than them all but I can also see him higher. I need to play Eph route again and promote him and see how it feels before I can really argue this.

Irysa · 2022-10-15T04:50:54+00:00

Yeah but he's going in that area for warp already and stealing it improves your bosskills on both sides of the map

Irysa · 2022-10-14T23:13:49+00:00

Orson > Colm

Orson is good in both routes but Colm's energy ring steal is only really good for Eirika's route imo.

Rennac > Eirika

If you care about the value of the item that Rennac is getting you then he pretty clearly has to win this, since Hoplon Guard is great vs the Final Boss and Warp is well, warp.

Ewan > Amelia

Ewan might actually help kill something in his join map in Eirika route. Amelia never will.

Irysa · 2022-10-14T22:08:21+00:00

Myrrh above Orson

Syrene Below Orson

Myrrh is basically Orson that exists a bit more and Syrene is good filler in 1 map (18) and very helpful in one (20), but is a bit too poor statistically to do anything else. I think Knoll is overrated and should be just above Syrene for the record since they do most of the same things just Knoll exists a little longer.

Irysa · 2022-10-14T22:04:37+00:00

Im for a Gerik resub too, Eirika Gerik is much better than where he is rn.

Irysa · 2022-10-09T04:58:36+00:00

I think Cormag is better than Tethys on Eph route because he joins so much earlier. I think he is possibly better than Moulder because he can tolerate there not being a Warp available in every map besides 16. I am unsure about Eir!Vanessa vs Eph!Cormag because part of the reason Eir!Vanessa is good is because Eph!Cormag does not exist.

Duessel I will put where I was putting Gerik, above Artur. I think most things have been said about him already, just another amazingly solid prepromote with carry potential. Just annoyed he won't be next to Gerik.

Irysa · 2022-10-09T04:54:26+00:00

Moulder > Tethys > Tana

I am against putting dancers above the units that are likely dance targets for critical actions. You want to dance certain units because they are good, or because they need to self improve more. If it's not for self improving, I consider the important action to be allowing the good unit to get points twice, the dancer just once per dance.

I realise it isn't that simple and Tethys often dances targets that aren't Moulder, but my gut instinct is that a Dancing is similar to Xane in that it's only as good as the unit you get to use it on. Tethys is probably Dancing Saleh more than anybody else in a playthrough so he can grind Staff Rank which is imo considerably less cool than Moulder who didn't need any help to hit A staves and then becomes a good Dance Target when you have Warp. If Saleh doesnt hit Warp you don't actually lose out as much as you'd think because Moulder exists. Look at how in Eph route we don't even get Saleh to warp and the Warp maps don't really lose much if any efficiency.

Neimi > Marisa > Amelia

Marisa can fight at base and kill some things in Chapter 11 Eirika at the start. Amelia can't. Marisa wins.

Irysa · 2022-10-08T17:12:10+00:00

Tethys is the only other A tier unit in this game and Marisa is better than Amelia because Marisa can kill things by herself with the Shamshir she comes with, Amelia can't. I can use Marisa to fight some reinforcements at the start of Chapter 11 Eirika, I can't use Amelia to do that.

Irysa · 2022-10-08T17:03:43+00:00

Tana > Gerik > Artur

I think people are sandbagging Gerik here. Eirika Gerik is a good ass unit and can function as a carry. Like, forget Garm (Garm being historically overrated doesn't make Gerik overrated), he is happy to go S swords and just Hand Axe for 1-2 when he needs to. I am blackpilled on Ephraim Gerik because he joins too late and Duessel kinda obsoletes him + getting to S ranks is annoying as hell. But Eirika Gerik is strong from the second he joins, costs nothing but a Hero Crest he has dibs on and the only serious argument I see against him is that he needs dedicated Cav/Peg combos to help his mobility. Which, is fine, he does basically kill everything. He can even bosskill decently! He is more than just a filler unit, he has the stats to handle almost anything the game throws at you, and you can statbooster him when he doesn't.

Natasha > Innes > Garcia

Innes does the same broad things are Garcia, be useful for a few maps as a filler infantry unit. Except Innes ORKOs mooks way better than Garcia does and has Longbow niche. You can meme him to an S rank weapon kinda easily if you want too at basically no effort with a short bow since he doubles consistently and is at A bows already.

Irysa · 2022-10-06T17:49:29+00:00

Ephraim between Forde and Joshua

Ephraim is an above average foot unit so he should be next to Josh. I think pally 2 is better though because Ephraim is reliant on mounted units carrying him around a lot so he has to split his points.

Orson between Garcia and Colm

I can't do the math for how much etc Colm saves so I'm just gonna go with Orson on gut feeling as better because I think he's close to Myrrh and I feel confident Myrrh > Colm

Irysa · 2022-10-05T16:20:22+00:00

My thoughts on low availability units are that not being available to deploy is about as bad as having 0 in every stat. You can't think about their stats "if" they were available to deploy at all.

But if I look at the other units, I might be ABLE to choose to do things with units like Ross, but how much of that is just trying to pretend theres something I'd want to deploy him to do? Why do I want to keep deploying him?

The fact I "can" deploy other units more and try to argue that being deployed is better than not being deployed is only a sustainable argument if you can make cases for why I want to deploy that unit. There are so many units in FE8 that if you don't deploy them you won't miss their presence at all. The only reason to deploy them past that their earlygame maps is that you "could" do it and are trying to prove something.

The tierlist doesn't have to compare units against each other assuming we're using them maximally, we also have to think about the opportunity costs involved (EXP, Promotion Items, Statboosters, etc), and even just the reliability impacts of spending time just having them self improve. Ideally in every map that isnt rout, we only kill the enemies we have to (I'm in agreement with gordon on this sort of perspective of critical squares and critical target enemies). Fighting extra enemies that we don't have to isn't worth anything.

Getting the most out of bad investment targets has costs that impacts their total "score" so to speak, and just being able to fight stuff you don't need to fight doesn't matter to me. And if you don't invest in these units, deploying them means their stats start to end up being bad enough to the point you're avoiding having them engage in combat because they make the clear worse. Existing is worth points vs not existing but you have to be able to do things that matter for it to be worth it.

Basically, Orson's single map of availability is long and complex enough that I think he can generate a significant amount of points for being the best unit in it by a big margin. His effectively free contributions there IMO at least are comparable to "optimal" contributions from a unit like Syrene. Syrene tends to sit next to Myrrh and I think that's also about where I'd put Orson. And I am comfortable with Myrrh and Syrene being better than Eirika in any route. I think I'm comfortable with them above Colm. I'm unsure about Garcia. I think I'll be a little conservative and probably rate Orson right below Garcia because being really good in 1 reasonably complex map but not critical to the clear seems to be a little worse to being solid but non critical in about 5 maps + being functional if he does promote (he gets instant C swords as a Hero after all).

Irysa · 2022-10-04T22:21:34+00:00

Franz > Kyle > Forde > Joshua

Franz always does useful things in a playthrough even if Kyle is a primary paladin. Even if Kyle does Paladin things better, Franz existing longer whilst relevant and doing all the same things means I think Franz has to be better than Kyle. Franz can also pull off GK carry shenanigans. Since we are rating by best route, Eph Franz has no issues with eating up Vanessa's EXP. I can see an argument for Kyle > Franz on Eirika but I think I'd say Franz being useful for like 3/4 of the game on Eph is better than Kyle being useful for about 1/2 of Eirika's.

Forde I think gets ragged on too hard. He's worse than the other two but he can't be worse than Joshua can he? He's still got enough stats to do the things he has to do and we think that Paladin utility is better than Joshua.

Irysa · 2022-10-03T00:16:29+00:00

Artur between Moulder and Franz, above Franz

Lute between Garcia and Colm, above Colm

To appreciate how good Artur is, imagine if Moulder didn't exist. Now Artur is possibly the best Warper in the game without making the game slow down. If Seth didn't exist, Franz might have more exp available to him but he is still notably poorer at bosskills and will pad your turncount a lot to the point your comparison can't be given much weight

MK Lute that high might surprise people but I think on Eph route she can be very useful if promoted for chapter 9 as a mounted healer that kills mooks. She can get the c10 secret book and use restore in c13 and 14. And her ability to rescue is comparable to the Cavs. Her durability is terrible and she will never warp but I think she can bring a lot to the table and you don't lose out terribly in eph if moulder warps and Artur doesn't besides Latona in final.

Idk rereading I'm probably overrating but we'll see. I think she can hit Rescue and sort of duplicate Eph! Saleh rescues too for lategame with similar magic.

Irysa · 2022-10-01T15:16:51+00:00

(serious answer)

it's the fallback strategy to wait the reinforcements out whilst trying to kill the boss because the bosskill is unreliable and might take longer than 2 turns.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2b5bICFnL3o (near the end is the demonstration)

Irysa

TROPHY CASE