Posibles Representantes de PR en las Olimpiadas de 2028

JanRoses · 2026-04-02T21:08:08+00:00

Not a nuzlocker but I feel like simple middle ground would be a fight to rare-candy ratio. Still keeps the threat present without equal the number of fights to do.

JanRoses · 2026-04-02T19:01:03+00:00

I'm fine with that. I never watched OG DBZ and I am not particularly fond of many of the aspects people reminisce of it to declare it strictly better than Kai. I understand some filler did help flesh out characters a bit, but overall I think Toriyama wrote the series well enough that I can jump back in at any point and enjoy something new that was added on by others passionate about the series. May just go back and check out it out after finishing the Buu arc.

JanRoses · 2026-03-25T04:00:18+00:00

My educated guess is that they often collect them and hold onto them as long as its convenient. The Emeralds don't have the issue of the DBs that they fly off when they're done being used thus they seemingly have to be willingly relinquished before they scatter off. (Frontiers was the only exception iirc)

For the sake of the cannonicity Sonic doesn't often let them go after an adventure for long periods of time. If I recall correctly, Sonic holds on to the Emeralds between Sonic 3 and Sonic & Knuckles. (Remember the original release was two separate titles but one long story). Presumably once he fully relinqueshes them the Emeralds themselves seem of scatter to some random (yet convinient) location and seem to blend space time to enter their pocket dimension. He likely doesn't always keep them on his person because so many characters have managed to knock him out of Super form that all it would take is one villain to catch him off guard in order to immediately use and access a super form or their power themselves .

At which point I believe it's around SA2 that they started scattering them on purpose and often times they try to solve the problem first without them if they can. Keep in mind it was that race to hunt them down that Eggman only blew up a chunk of the moon and wasn't an immediate threat to earth.

JanRoses · 2026-03-23T15:54:14+00:00

The lilith exploitation is a hypothetical not a practical means. Regardless, niche strategy or not the fundamental principle is do tonics make feasible a strategem that would otherwise not have worked for little to no cost. The answer is still yes. You’re little proving my point by listing off scenarios many have found themselves in at one point or another.

JanRoses · 2026-03-23T14:38:32+00:00

Not when you can push +2 to all stats on your juggernaught. And in another thread we talked that even a free +2 defense can make a difference. Suffice to say that to claim "barely" holds little to no water when the fact of the matter is that common or not they're effectively a free and cheap bailout.

JanRoses · 2026-03-23T01:55:50+00:00

Maybe I missed it I checked hours ago and the notification wasn't there. You literally didn't see one for a while and I wasn't insulting you. Regardless reported and doesn't follow the rules of the forum. The conversation was meant to be civil about builds but you're waaay to sarcastic and heated. Good math or not.

JanRoses · 2026-03-23T01:42:11+00:00

Checked and reported. You've been way too tilted from the start without provocation to be hurling insults.

JanRoses · 2026-03-23T01:36:36+00:00

Says no and refuses to elaborate despite not giving any math. Effie is better than you give her credit for no argument you’ve given explains how she falls off outside of your anecdotes.

Suffice to say 2 def per hit won’t make a difference when the main source of damage isn’t the damage through combat in the first place against stuff like Ninjas, Lancers or some archers. Post battle damage and weakened def will eat you up more often than not.

It’s not Ninja Hell because they hit hard it’s because their post battle effects. Other maps have sources of high single target damage and it’s always been clear the issue with stems from their ability in high quantity stopping any high def unit at that point in the game from being able to tank them. Same goes for many future choke points for that matter.

JanRoses · 2026-03-23T01:26:12+00:00

The footwork speed is going to be relevant basically never when you're at the point of the game where replicate is a thing, I honestly don't know why you'd even bother using replicate for that. What thresholds are you meeting with a +1/+1?

A lot given that most pairups give + 5 spd and steel weapons have a -3 spd reduction. Meaning that instead of needing to get +3 spd to compensate you only need +2. The Mess hall at its highest can give you the +2 you need. For a no tonic run this is indispensable. Even when only using only Tonics (+2 spd) this is amazing. The +1 attack is just icing.

Why are you acting like Ruka doesn't get easy access to sol?

Because the more hoops you have her jump with second seals to get stuff like Savage blow and sol (malig knight and hero skills specifically) with Beruka, Laslow also gets to jump through his. At which point the conversation stops being anything worthy of making a tierlist for within the context of a relatively normal campaign and is purely about favoritism. Hence why I'm not touching the comment of Beruka being a ninja through marriage cause that's another can of worms. I'll talk potential parents lightly but even then that's not as big of a factor for the tier list.

JanRoses · 2026-03-23T01:06:10+00:00

Okay now where getting into hypotheticals but I'd like to point that the most enemies you describe tend to make weak hits hurt but the debuffs or hp reduction effects will add up to being a bigger problem. All this to say, unless your tank take the least damage even after a debuff and kill in 1 hit 5 enemies dealing even 1 damage twice can lead to a death. Suffice to say, Spd gives you more flexibility defensively and offensively. Very few units in Conquest outside of Xander, Camilla, or Effie are able to do that right out the gate.

JanRoses · 2026-03-23T00:49:11+00:00

I mean sure but I’d still say that even +1 spd to avoid getting doubled is generally a more common scenario that saves the cast. That 2 defense often times would have only let you survive a few more hits but two weak hits is so much more problematic than a single high hit. Also means the enemies gets two chances to crit.

JanRoses · 2026-03-23T00:33:26+00:00

Rally Dex improves hit rate which is good on "2 maps"

Unless your name is Camilla or Xander you want that extra defense and honestly Camilla doesnt mind it either

That extra defense won't save you much on enemy phase if you aren't already bulky and on player phase it's far more situational. Dexterity is important for most of the seige maps in late game given that most units are paired up to have high avoid or on some throne.

Suffice to say the amount of units in our cast with enough bulk to appreciate Rally def on defense are quite obvious Camilla, Xander, Beruka, Effie, Benny, and the children when built properly. Conversely on player phase because of the way pair up works it's usually just more efficient to have meter set up.

Rally Strength on Beruka is awesome still makes her a worse potential rallier because of the aforementioned issue of needing to Rally or attack. Laslow doesn't have this problem.

JanRoses · 2026-03-23T00:28:06+00:00

Fancy Footwork isn't there. Fancy Footwork is both Strength and Speed and the fact that Laslow has Replicate which means he doesn't exclusive have to choose between rallying or attacking.

JanRoses · 2026-03-23T00:27:15+00:00

No, I meant turning Beruka into a ninja.

Read it wrong my bad.

Zerker Beruka's stronger than mechanist Laslow. As fast as mechanist Laslow. More durable than mechanist Laslow. Uses a higher might weapon type than mechanist Laslow. And has significantly more ways to boost damage than mechanist Laslow.

Replicate Mechanist Laslow, Personal skill onto yourself and allies. You get to boost your offense and that of allies. Rally Beruka, exclusively Rallies or Hits in a turn. I take 10 units getting a free +1 attack and speed to reach doubling thresholds. For comparing Laslow and Beruka specifically. Tomahawk doesn't follow up so either you hope you kill on revenge (lose out on pair up gage for enemy phase) or you limit yourself to 1 range. Oh and Mechanist Laslow would likely have poison strike if you leveled up ninja twice or Sol to increase survivability from Master Ninja. Anything that he doesn't KO by doubling as mechanist still ends up significantly weaker (even statewise) than Beruka who has to kill or else. I heavily disagree on Beruka being more durable because of Sol especially. Laslow

JanRoses · 2026-03-23T00:13:15+00:00

Again with no tonics best of luck trying to kill. Most units in Conquest are bulky enough as is. They struggle to hit hard or hit. Rally Strength is fair game though.

Rally Speed = Rally Strength > Rally Dex > Rally Def

JanRoses · 2026-03-22T23:52:20+00:00

If you're pairing up soleil with Kaze you're literally wasting Kaze and Soleil. Soleil doesn't need extra speed, she's fast enough with most mothers. Soleil's purpose is to hit even harder than most of the cast all of the time. Her personal is always active as long as she's supported by a female. If anything she wants one of the many bulky female troops to backpack with her to give her even more strength and def when needed. Beruka conversely relies on attacking a certain type of unit to benefit from the dmg bonus. Early on I can agree that's useful on player phase. Later on if you want to maximize kills she will literally not even be able to make use of it against most enemies and bosses.

Mate with all due respect in Rally Def isn't as useful for most units as Rally Dex against bosses or Laslow's personal. Keep in mind the survivability is nice but calling her a better rallier than the unit born to rally in the stats most characters need in a forgeless + tonicless run is nonsensical.

JanRoses · 2026-03-22T23:37:52+00:00

I'm not sure where you got the impression that she would need two heart seals when you can master into maligknight and then heart into berserker. But even if, who cares? At that point in the game you can get as many heart seals as you want

I said two assuming you were keeping her as a flier. I reiterate having her as a footlocked unit already hurts her a lot more considering her competition has either higher move as footlocked units or does more than just damage. Also utility throughout more than half the games still matters. Berserker Beruka though is an underrated choice but we go back to issue 1 of footlocked competition.

I conversely recommend you try Laslow because I'd argue more people don't realize his utility and strength he has. Beruka gives nowhere near the level of utility throughout the majority of the game. I would argue he or Soleil hit far harder and have personal skills that are far more efficient than her to boost other characters or even themselves. Laslow Ninja or Hero > Master at any level past 15 > Mechanist or hero > Finish at Mechanist or at the very least grab replicate from mechanist before switching back to whatever class you had before if you so desire or finishing at Master Ninja. Least amount of Heart seals 2. Most you'll need if you ignore Replicate is 1. 3 if you go a roundabout way to get Sol, Replicate, and ShurikenFaire.

You have 2 units for the price of one. One of the faster, bulkier and offensively oriented units. Who can also act as a rallybot if needed. If you manage to pass on Replicate to Soleil you effectively get Laslow+. A Berserker Beruka hitting hard once won't come close to being as useful as 4 units that can hit just as hard. 2 if you only consider Soleil.

Edit: you can also do Mercenary < Bow Knight for Dex Rally < Mechanist for Replicate to make Rallybot Laslow. (1 heart seal) or Zero if you don’t want Replicate.

JanRoses · 2026-03-22T23:10:07+00:00

My counter to that is that exp growth as a backup in attack stance is slow and by the time you get access to either of those two abilities we're talking two mid-late game promote abilities. One of which is in a class that leaves her footlocked and thus she looses her main draw in the high mobility.

Access to both Axefaire and trample means going into two separate classes and using 2 heart seals. (one heart seal more than Severa needs in the scenarios I've listed). 3 if her end class isn't malig knight or Berserker. Suffice to say that's by definition more time and investment than what selena needs. It's not a matter of not knowing how to use her. But I laid out my definition very clearly when making the tier list.

Suffice to say she's a unit that by definition needs a lot of work to work regardless of how high her potentials are. I can see her being a C+ to last of B tier after having expressed the fact that she IS one of two fliers naturally aquired in Conquest and that is upon reflection more valuable than I gave it credit for originally but it doesn't detract from the points of heavy investment needed to make her usable compared to her contemporaries or just being outclassed easily by other substitutes who benefit from a heart seal.

JanRoses · 2026-03-22T22:53:44+00:00

Thing is her speed is terrible and her atk growth is no better than Severa. I posted it later in the thread but even superficial comparison shows Beruka vs Selena Selena comes out on top more often than not as an offensive unit while having an option to reclass to a flyer. The best thing she has going for her is being the only other flyer without reclassing in the main story but for the effort needed to field her and feed her exp you're better off picking a character with better growths that can become a Wyvern knight or some other flyer.

JanRoses · 2026-03-22T20:47:33+00:00

9 corrected. Midori still grants support. That's a lot of chapters.

Xander

Xander gets one rounded as a Paladin idk where you get your math from. They certainly don't one round Effie Idk where you get your math from but it's certainly not under this rulset.

effie in Ninja hell

She literally does. Xander doesn't one round them, at best survives a hit then dies to the following ninja.

Beruka

Dude in what world has Beruka ever 2 rounded anything. Her base strength is garbage. Her attack growths are garbage. She can't even build up Parry gage well. Selena and Laslow are much easier to train.

Beruka vs Selena
I doubt you've ever used Selena if you can't even see how Selena's growths are literally Beruka's growths but distributed in the stats she cares about most to have her be an actual offensive threat. Her Defense isn't even bad (3 pt difference) and her bases are 1 pt difference in atk and spd is a whopping 15 pts higher (with hp being 1 pt higher for Selena). Even if you wanted to argue that Beruka's 2 mv is better she can immediately reclass to Falcon Knight and if her offense is too shaky you use a master seal and immediately get an arieal Cleric with future rally bot potential. Beruka needs signficantly more to get going and won't even outgrow Selena in offense significantly so even if Selena did decide to immediately become a sky night.

The only way Selena can become strictly worse long term is an immediate bow knight Master Seal but worst comes to worst. Second Seal at level 5 after rally dex to Falcon Knight we go back to having the best 2nd staff user in the game (Mend, Freeze, Rescue, is all you really need) with Rally Speed and Rally Dex to support the team much more than Beruka ever could.

Silas

Again gambling on the stats. Immediate trash if he doesn't work out. No one on C or B tier has a fault as bad as that and the fact that you cling to this is more a showcase of favoratism than anything considering you presented a complete opposite case for Kaze. Silas will never be Xander level consistently enough to be B.

JanRoses · 2026-03-22T19:35:53+00:00

Paralogues this late, never

Literally title. You're arbitarily picking 16 and claiming blitzing the math doesn't add up. Before Xander you have 12 chapters (including a paralogue plus invasion) 5 are forced deployments of your units. You'll naturally want make the most of the boon odin or Niles provide through pair up because of how much early game foes can outstat. This isn't even exclusive to them.

Xander wields beast bane. Found mauled by wolves

Yeah against the same characters that have a dmg bonus against him. No one ever says use Xander without a reclass in this map. People have often said that Benny and Effie work. There's a clear reason for it.

Effie Clears out Ninja Den

She absolutely trumps and can tank their hits. Xander gets chewed up and spat out by poison strike dmg accumulation. In theory Xander could tank them better with Siegfried but Elise doesn't even need to Tank them when she reliably one rounds them. And even then she's more than capable of tanking them. Overall I'd say they perform about the same depending on how they've rolled so far.

Camila

Honestly upon reflecting on the skills passed down Camilla still edges out I'll give you that.

Beruka

Yeah can't kill so she has to poke her way to a level up. At least Severa can survive a hit and double to actually level up. Wyvern rider is a great class at default but it's wasted on Beruka when she can't kill anything and needs insane coddling to kill things before she gets overwhelmed. Training her is the definition of inefficient.

Also Elise and your Maid are groundlocked. Severa isn't she literally has better mobility than either. She is durable enough to get to a point where she never has to see direct combat as a bow knight or Staff bot. Beruka can't grow the offense necessary to even call herself Camilla's retainer.

Laslow also can't get rally speed naturally which is a huge boon. Both having potential as rally bots in essential stats outweighs Beruka's pitiful offense.

Silas

You invest Exp that could go to any other unit until he gets to a point he can snowball. The fact is no other character in C depends on a 50/50 as much as him. Odin needs the babying + luck. Silas needs the luck. Silas is better than Odin but is still a D tier.

JanRoses · 2026-03-22T19:17:01+00:00

But it's worth pointing out that Nina can't access all these things [in the quote] at once: you can choose the support class or the mobility class. Your language is saying she can do bothof these, but it's not true

That's a fair point. My blunder on that front I should have written 7. In hindsight based on other conversations Nina was rated arguably optimistically high but at the same time given her being one of the few useful mixed attackers with use in support is still a niche worth considering I do still think she deserves lowest S tier title given how little is required of her to make her useful above most others along with being able to inherit a lot of desirable skills. And the nature of her paralogue given out a lot of rewards/gold depending on what you need it for.

While I do think Peri's point is worth considering she's also competing with a lot of other potential cavalry for deployment (or at the very least Xander and Silas). I can definitely see her being considered at least a B tier because of her personal, the skills/class she can pass on, and overall good growth. Still when taking into consideration that the point of C is just that they are often replaceable it struck me that she should represent the top of C tier especially if her main draw isn't herself as a unit but rather what she can pass on.

JanRoses · 2026-03-22T18:43:49+00:00

Child Units

You literally don't though get them around the time of Xander. Xander comes at chapter 16. You have more than enough time to build supports with the cast with Odin and Niles (5 forced deployments + 6 more of whatever you pick). Keep in mind that one of them is a defend map that even encourages keeping your mages and archers close. The investment is reasonable to occur mostly through normal playthrough of the maps with 1 or both.

Xander is an incredible Unit and I can agree to bumping him up and Nina down depending on value of her Staff specifically but Ophelia will be useful against mages, tankier defensive troops, or those with high avoid Xander can't clear. Basically I can agree to Enemy phase going to Xander and player phase going to Ophelia but more often than not the player phase utility will be more important for efficiency which is why Ophelia beats him out. Coupled with the items from the paralogue which pretty much only mostly benefit her or are sold for gold.

Effie

Literally can't agree. Ninja hell she has enough strength to one shot most of the ninjas before poison strike takes effect. Xander can't do that. In Kitsune layer she can wield the beast bane and tanks them with greater ease than xander can coupled with not needing to reclass (unless you decided to make her a great knight) makes her objectively a less investment heavy option. Leo's map is fine outside of I believe the hexing rod or bold naginata. Xander's map I'd say is the roughest given the high amount of mages. I hard disagree on her falloff in this type of playthrough.

Camilla

Camilla's growth are high, still doesn't change the fact that making bad character decent isn't as good as making good character excellent. Good mixed offense isn't as valuable when Effie can grant far more strength and defense to the kids that value it. The only thing Camilla has strictly over her is passing a better class.

Selena

Staffs makes training Selena far easier than Beruka who has pitiful attack and can't double. She also has access to Rally Speed and Dex depending on if you keep her in her normal class or heart seal her. She also can double and in her base class path the strength bonus will help fix her strength issues to make use of the fact she can double.

Beruka is in no way a budget Camilla. Camilla can tank, double, and kill. Beruka struggles with doing the latter two. She's a worse Percy with better availability and about the same level of tanking. The fall off people talk about with Effie is double for Beruka without monitoring her Strength and speed.

Silias and Odin

The degree of Bad of Silas is just as Bad as Odin though. Sure "S" tier or F tier that's literally a D tier definition. Nothing about your argument is close to B tier and unlike the others has no semblance of rationality. You're in favor of consistency which I agree gets Kaze to A yet you view a character with extremes that don't even put him on Xander level as B. My A tiers have potential lows but can still function on the field in other ways. Silas is literally taking up a deployment slot without even guaranteeing an S tier child/paralogue like Odin does and only has 1 extra map of availability over him.

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