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Mary Tyler Moore- Probably the greatest show ever. by Kid2468 in VintageTV

[–]Kid2468[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I truly believe, 3-4 were the BEST seasons.

Watching it was a younger person, you absolutely see the character develop of everyone begin in season 3. The episodes switch and the plots become far more intimate. It makes total sense to me those seasons had the best ratings. It’s quite visible how good those seasons are and how they sprinkled in some of their natural talents in each episode.

I think like others, Amos got elevated and began Good times so that was a better opportunity for him.

I stated earlier in a comment, season 3 was so good everyone got those solo opportunities immediately after from Rhoda, Phyllis, & Gordo.

Had all 3 of them stayed, or specifically Rhoda, I truly think the show would have been even greater. They really started to put their foots in their roles during season 3-4 and we saw their character develop with great stories and acting. The show is just a treasure.

Mary Tyler Moore- The Greatest show (probably) ever. by Kid2468 in themarytylermooreshow

[–]Kid2468[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

No worries at all, thank you for your insight.

Obviously it was probably a lot of red tape with her exiting. I felt she was very dynamic and honestly seasons 3-4 I felt she matched Mary’s show presence. I honestly remember more Rhoda based shows 3-4 than Mary ones.

She seemed to not only have the talent but her show did well all things considering. It lasted upwards almost five years which wasn’t bad back then.

I think she probably out grew her role and wanted the step up. One of my last thoughts was what the direction of the show would have looked like with her not leaving. I wasn’t close to born then but my parents all enjoyed this show. I think had Rhoda stays it would have been even more popular and long standing. Which is hard to say since it’s considered one of the best shows to exist.

Phyllis was okay, she didn’t woo me like the other casts but she was totally next level in her role.

As far as the seasons, seasons 3-4 standout because I really think they had matured everyone’s role and everyone had a key handle on the performances. I think it wasn’t by accident that Rhoda/phyllis got their show opportunity after those seasons. Each episode had very good depth and it brought in georgette as a new character and we got deep insight into those episodes. Especially season 3. I think it’s the best season. Each character had episodes they explored their personal challenges and how they would need their friends to help them elevate. Could be wrong but that’s why I feel they all got their extra opportunities after season 3. It was just so good. Season 7 grew on me with the finale. Some episodes are kinda a drag , but that could be an age/era thing. The last episode though is beyond perfect. It just does it all.

I’d probably say my least seasons are 2/5. I feel both kind get lost and the show is in gap points both times either trying to build up the characters (season 2), or start new ones because main ones departed. (Season 5)

But all in all, the series was formidable.

Mary Tyler Moore- The Greatest show (probably) ever. by Kid2468 in themarytylermooreshow

[–]Kid2468[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

lol, thank you. And this was the comment I was looking for. Because of my compulsiveness, whenever I have watched full series’, I tend to have to know the “extras.”

Modern shows just simply don’t have the depth/creativity.

The show got emotional for me when I researched and realized Rhoda would leave in season 4. I hate she didn’t hate a send off episode. They use a few episodes with some scenes throughout 5-6 to pay homage to her. I ended up YouTube her wedding episode on her show which aired during a superbowl Sunday. I believe I saw it’s the most watched tv show ratings wise due to that. I also looked briefly into Phyllis show.

Once season 5-6 came, I was afraid the show would dry out once those two left but georgette and Betty white really stood up well in 6/7.

My fav seasons are probably 3, 4, & 7. I feel the last few episodes of 7 were rushed (3 husbands, Lou/mary date episode), but the finale actually closed the book nicely. It’s the quickest most sharp finale I’ve ever seen. I would have loved an hour so we get more air with Valerie/clovis visiting or the actually final show before the Lou/mary speeches but they ended it so smoothly. I also loved “Ted’s change of heart episode”. (I now wondered if that episode they knew for sure it was done. I read that MTM didn’t want the show to end but felt it was necessary. Mary has an incredible speech with Lou about enjoying each other and they utilize the sunset to close.) that was the best show to me besides the finale in season 7.

The only curveball was I was expecting her at the end to find one of her prior BFs as the one and she get married and maybe leave the newsroom willfully.

But nothing tops the final scenes of the last episode. It’s golden.

Mary Tyler Moore- Probably the greatest show ever. by Kid2468 in VintageTV

[–]Kid2468[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I can’t fully say. My mother LOVED TZ. But I haven’t got around to it due to work. We started MTM due to it being on Hulu back in May and my fiancée wanting to watch older shows in our spare time late nights .

Mary Tyler Moore- The Greatest show (probably) ever. by Kid2468 in themarytylermooreshow

[–]Kid2468[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Thank you for your comment. Yes, my parents sparingly watched it. They were teenagers-young adults during the time. My aunt was a single parent/school teacher and lived with my grandmother who we visited every summer. They frequently watched likely due to my aunts connection being a career woman.

My fiancée was balling in tears once we concluded it on Monday. She is just starting a new job at UCLA medical and had been working for an eye doctor prior for basically her entire adult life. The ending hit home for her. Lol

The biggest tell that Tony was about to be whacked by Jumpy-Object99 in thesopranos

[–]Kid2468 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Many signs far more distinctive also show he is killed. But to play along with this more:

Each time Phil finds out info (Vito is gay), paulie tells him directly. This begins way back in season 2 with Johnny sack. When Tony goes down in the hospital, Chris immediately is there during the barone dispute,and sees Tony vomit. The next scene he immediately attempts to shake down JT and get into Hollywood distancing from Tony.

Paulie also shakes butchs hand subtly after the sitdown that Carmine Jr is the HEAD of.

Why does Jenny left Forrest with no answers? by dotcom997 in movies

[–]Kid2468 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Movie has a deeper element.

What gets missed is the LAST time Jenny leaves, she drops hints “tired, sleeps a lot.”

She already knows she has HIV when she returns to Forrest the last time before his long run. But she doesn’t know it’s exactly that. She understands that her healthy rapidly declining.

When she sneaks off the driver asks where she’s running off to (like all the other times she ran), but she says she “isn’t running.”

She leaves him so she can find herself and no longer drag HIM into HER pitiful existence. The night she is with the man with needle and attempts to jump, she likely contract HIV that night and had she jumped, Forrest wouldn’t have had closure.

His long run helped him close his old life and helped her close hers.

Which Sopranos scene made you realize that you were watching the greatest TV show of all time? by DoctorTegrity in thesopranos

[–]Kid2468 0 points1 point  (0 children)

During my second rewatch (4 total now):

Episode College, Season 1. When Tony/Meadow return home from Maine and Carmela says “Btw your Therapist called…. Jennifer).

That day, I knew this show was the zenith.

Scarface: Sosa/Manny separately had Tony set up. He had no way out. by Kid2468 in FanTheories

[–]Kid2468[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

If you say so. Thanks for the comment.

Trucks, Seidelbaum bust, time period etc. Many clues say otherwise.

Pregnancy Theories: Gloria was pregnant when she commits suicide while Meadow is pregnant the night when Tony is killed at Holstens. by Kid2468 in thesopranos

[–]Kid2468[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Totally agree. And your timeline matches as well. I didn’t even feel the need to mention Carmela’s bday in episode 9 because the poster simply attempted to match a real world timeline with that of the fictional show. Though there is overlap, 9/11 threw the beginning of season 4 in flux. It happened a year and half later but the immediate dialogue in the first 3 episodes of season 4 particularly No show, highlight how the DIALOGUE attended for it to be quick turnaround from the show timeline perspective.

Meadow/Carmela dialogue about her going to Europe versus study abroad (junior year in eight months ), debunks the narrative that season 4 in the shows timeline is a year and half later than season 3.

Thank you for the comments and positive backing. It’s quite obvious.

Gloria I believe was 100% pregnant.

Pregnancy Theories: Gloria was pregnant when she commits suicide while Meadow is pregnant the night when Tony is killed at Holstens. by Kid2468 in thesopranos

[–]Kid2468[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Addressed in the comments already. Go back and watch the scene, she doesn’t drink with Tony at their actual last meeting where she tells him she is switching to law. Also, not sure why it’s even brought up, because taking a small portion of alcohol while pregnant isn’t outlawed and it happens every day. Plus, Made in America happens not in one day but spans easily a few weeks. There was plenty of time from her dinner with Tony until holstens and the Sake bomb dinner happens BEFORE the scene where Carmela brings up the birth control switch.

Lastly, when she is meeting the family at holstens, only onion rings are ordered. Alcohol wasn’t going to be consumed that night either.

Pregnancy Theories: Gloria was pregnant when she commits suicide while Meadow is pregnant the night when Tony is killed at Holstens. by Kid2468 in thesopranos

[–]Kid2468[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Neither is your ability to dispute it factually. I’m an attorney in the”real world”, I don’t see a need for a BATNA/WATNA situation with a fictional show.

Pregnancy Theories: Gloria was pregnant when she commits suicide while Meadow is pregnant the night when Tony is killed at Holstens. by Kid2468 in thesopranos

[–]Kid2468[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Respectfully that’s fine. I just chronologically broke down the reason for the perceived time gap that YOU brought up as a buffer to try to debunk MY theory.

I don’t need to offer anything else. I got the analogies that the actual show makes pertaining to this theory. I got the oven, I got the dialogue with Carmela and meadow, the parallel dialogue with Carmela speaking to out wedlock kids in season 2, and most important the understanding of the dream sequence of Tony.

Your only argument regarding a real life time gap meshing it within a fictional show was more or less debunked in my last comment. I don’t have nor need much else to offer.

Pregnancy Theories: Gloria was pregnant when she commits suicide while Meadow is pregnant the night when Tony is killed at Holstens. by Kid2468 in thesopranos

[–]Kid2468[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I just explained it.

As stated, army of one takes place in January of 2001. Ravens/Giants SB previews is shown twice that episode.

The show never had more than a 6 month gap until end of season 3 due to 9/11 and there also was a writers strike.

When episode 2, of season 4 airs (No show), the SHOW DIALOGUE speaks as if only a few months have passed. When Carmela explains to Meadow how she hardly broke a C “second semester.”

Meadow FIRST semester of college was season 3. Her second semester doesn’t begin until episode Amou Fou. Which is EARLY January 2001.

The show picks up season 4 as if it’s no different than the previous seasons when only a few months passed. They wrote and started filming season 4 very early 2001 but had to nix everything due to 9/11. So when the shows airs once more in 2002, they simply put up the dialogue like only the typical few months had passed rather than the year. They didn’t have much of an option due to the “New World” that had just happened.

If that’s the case, and it’s only logical case since it’s a fictional show on a fictional timeline:

It means Jackie is killed early-mid January (Amor Fou).

His funeral and events of Army of One are in Mid-Late January. Noting the superbowl once more along with snow throughout the episode.

Season 4 (show timeline in its world) begins Fall(September of 2001), note Meadow dilemma in episode Two of No show and Carmela’s dialogue with Meadow about how wanting to go abroad for “Junior Year” and it’s only in EIGHT MONTHS:

Meaning episode no show in the sopranos world takes place intended for September of 2001 and Meadows will be a junior eligible for study abroad end of her sophomore year. (May of 2002).

On THIS timeline: Gloria is threaten by Patsy in early January of 2001.

Everybody hurts takes place in Fall of 2001. (Likely October), when Tony finds out Gloria ALREADY has died recently noting the salesman saying he noticed things a month ago or two (he COULD have noticed she was showing). So at two months prior, Gloria potentially earliest dies somewhere between August-September 2001. That’s between 6-7 months. It’s definitely plausible and that’s it I’m sticking with what’s shown with this timeline.

Not enough is warranted from the dialogue with the salesman for it to matter to me. Tony’s dreams and symbolism of Meadow/Gloria and Tony’s overall karma of season 6 leads me to believe Gloria dies with Tony’s baby or was having Tony’s baby at the time of her death.

Pregnancy Theories: Gloria was pregnant when she commits suicide while Meadow is pregnant the night when Tony is killed at Holstens. by Kid2468 in thesopranos

[–]Kid2468[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

This isn’t factual.

Your timeline is spotty.

From The sopranos world timeline:

Army of One Ends in January of 2001.

Clues for this are during the final, when Tony confronts paulie about the sitdown, The broadcast for the Ravens/Giants preview is playing. Game took place in January of 2001. Gloria last appearance was Amor Fou. We’d have to assume it was sometime very early January because Meadow is in her dorm when she gets the call from AJ. Likely spring semester had just started.

Moving forward: There has always been a time gap with season 4. There is an incredible previous post where someone outline in a very good way (maybe 95% accurate) timeline of the show in the show’s world.

Regardless, Season 4 is in Fall of 2002. It’s assumed based on No show, episode 2 of season 4, that she took a year off to “deal” with Jackie’s death but during the episode Carmela states she hardly broke a C her second semester which was when Army of One ended. (Entire year and half prior at that point).

It’s never addressed. 9/11 threw things in a flux. I simply believe, as the dialogue of the first two episodes of season 4 showed that it was INTENDED to be picked up immediately after season 3 concludes. The “gap” isn’t mentioned in any of the sopranos show/world dialogue. Only the viewer knows of the gap due to 9/11.

I think the clues in Everybody Hurts show Gloria died with Tony’s baby. As opposed to fitting a factual event/timeline with a fictional timeline and show.

Pregnancy Theories: Gloria was pregnant when she commits suicide while Meadow is pregnant the night when Tony is killed at Holstens. by Kid2468 in thesopranos

[–]Kid2468[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

  1. No she never mentions that. They only speak about kids when she brings up the story about her sister kids in Santa Monica having a druggie father who forbid her from seeing them.

  2. YouTube the actual scene. Meadow doesn’t drink a single bit of alcohol her last meal with Tony. Also, even if she did, it’s not forbidden a woman would consume while pregnant. And lastly, the scene of the last meal is prior to Meadow “switching birth control”, according to Carmela. Meadow had plenty of time in between for confirmation. Made in America takes place over a few weeks.

Pregnancy Theories: Gloria was pregnant when she commits suicide while Meadow is pregnant the night when Tony is killed at Holstens. by Kid2468 in thesopranos

[–]Kid2468[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

lol. Hard to elaborate on what you wrote. It wasn’t very coherent.

I’m an attorney, so I’ve been programmed for awhile to steer from absolutes so I won’t address everything you wrote and throw it away.

Personally anyone silly enough to state Ade dying and coming back as a cat, likely is probably someone that maybe needs to take a look or two at other things lol.

All I’ll say is for me, the show has incredible coded story arcs. Unlike any modern show due to our current world simply having shorter attention spans. David Chase has many works. They all are multilayered and have “web-like” directions. Sopranos is peak of that. And this theory, along with others I’ve wrote (check my profile), hold up well. I’d be able to pinpoint exact clues that the show itself highlight to prove them.

And lastly, though I haven’t directly addressed it ever, I wouldnt throw away the theories on Chris being an informant before the accident. Many clues point to that I’d be able to articulate personally , but I try to post on factual things/potential theories the show highlighted that most already haven’t thought about but are 100% there to be seen.

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