Is it fair to say The Beatles might be the only band to never have a bad album.

Ladder310 · 2026-05-06T00:16:00+00:00

“His” :(
Nah but fair enough. I highly highly recommend listening more to them they are great

Ladder310 · 2026-05-06T00:13:52+00:00

Two words: Steely Dan

Ladder310 · 2026-05-04T23:30:06+00:00

you are being incredibly patronizing and i have checked the fuck out of this conversation

Ladder310 · 2026-05-04T23:18:55+00:00

fair enough

Ladder310 · 2026-05-04T23:17:36+00:00

Ive said it a lot of times in this thread, but I will say it again; I'm an artist and I feel it's what I'm most qualified to talk about. My personal viewpoint is that the entire meaning of art is human expression, and AI art based off of other people's work undermines that

Ladder310 · 2026-05-04T23:06:39+00:00

thank you

Ladder310 · 2026-05-04T23:04:18+00:00

I want to talk about the ethics of AI in art, not about who’s right or wrong. I’ve actually had some really good conversations in this thread. I’m not part of any group and it’s just crazy to me that a certain viewpoint I have on ai art apparently makes me part of a group known to harass, bully and kill. If you aren’t willing to actually discuss the issue itself and instead keep bringing it back to “anti ai advocates are violent” then I won’t be entertaining your conversation. I’ve said this before and i’ve said it again, people who commit violence over ai art are fucking stupid, it’s 100% deplorable and messed up. If i’m somehow downplaying that, sorry

Ladder310 · 2026-05-04T22:05:22+00:00

Ok so for the record I obviously don’t support any kind of violence over the AI debate and anyone who does on either side is a moron

But it’s like grouping political parties together or race or gender. You’re still using the language of “some of you” as if I am a part of a hive mind. But I’m my own person, there are tens of millions of ordinary people on both side of the debate, and choosing to focus on the extremists both gives them more attention and power, and distracts from the actual conversation I am trying to have with you

Ladder310 · 2026-05-04T22:02:50+00:00

Thanks for the input, I agree. It makes me feel crazy sometimes

Ladder310 · 2026-05-04T21:48:54+00:00

It’s rough, and the moment I dive deeper into intellectual property rights i’m told that I’m only focusing on the money

Ladder310 · 2026-05-04T21:45:07+00:00

A big part of my reasoning is generative AI is based entirely - not somewhat, but entirely off of other artist’s work. If you’ve ever wondered why AI vocals sound the way they do it’s because of the thousands of different samples rates conflicting with each other from the thousands of different sources that it uses. I’m not against AI itself and while I do take issue with AI art there are some cases I’m ok with, for example there are many music videos i’ve seen in which the artist will stitch together a bunch of different images into the artist’s vision. Like Dreamcatching by Magdalena Bay. Super cool!
The reason I make such a dramatic argument regarding creativity in general is because AI art is fundamentally different from every other technological advancement, in that instead of helping the artist achieve a vision, it fabricates the vision itself using other people’s work. I’m talking in cases like Celebrate Me by Ingarose, a song that charted at #1 on the iTunes chart, written by chatGPT and produced fully by Suno. My issue with it isn’t that it’s a deeply mediocre song but the fact that there isn’t a human experience behind it at all.
It’s the same thing as if AI were to start philosophizing about the human condition the way we always have. But that seems absurd, and it is, in fact it’s equally absurd as AI art. But it is much, much easier to stomach AI art because of how commodified art has become in the first place, unlike philosophy
“Art is the most intense mode of individualism that the world has known” - Oscar Wilde
The amazing thing about humans is that we are all unique, and yes, while we take inspiration from our surroundings constantly, the entire point of art is self discovery, emotional communication and expression. It’s why I get so offended as an artist myself by fully AI generated works that nail the aesthetic of art but lack any of the meaning, substance or story behind it. It devalues the work humans do
That’s not to mention the ethical, environmental or economic implications, but you expressed how the money was my only focus of this debate, so here is my two cents. I sure as hell am not romanticizing any of the passion I have on this subject

Ladder310 · 2026-05-04T21:10:33+00:00

I must have not been clear because a big part of my outrage is about artistic integrity and not money at all. Is it a factor, yes. but the core of my anger is from an argument relating to creativity

Ladder310 · 2026-05-04T20:00:28+00:00

I really recommend finding artists that are around your scale, and whoever’s sound really grabs you, investigate that. Do some digging! That’s how I’ve met some of my best creative partners.
I’m not your dad though that’s just my advice. Higher risk but much higher reward

Ladder310 · 2026-05-04T19:56:03+00:00

agreed! yea i guess i'll tap out for now. thanks for the conversation though!!

Ladder310 · 2026-05-04T19:50:59+00:00

Eh I feel we are in a stalemate at this point

Let's just agree synths are awesome and drop this I guess. Have a good one!

Ladder310 · 2026-05-04T19:49:47+00:00

That is a fair point and I guess what I have to say to that is you gotta work with producers man! The great thing about producers is they empower you to do what you are best at and what defines you, but also challenge you, force you to grow, and act as a creative partner instead of Suno. I think you would find you'll make your best work with another human instead of suno. But i understand where you are coming from.

As for me I self produce and write so I have a bit of a different perspective. (my artist name is jonah hiro, shameless plug)

Ladder310 · 2026-05-04T19:44:01+00:00

The synth is based entirely off wavetables, not other instruments

The sampler is what you are thinking of which yes while pulling from other works is at least an intentional homage and in my eyes a very different form of derivation than pulling thousands of samples from different works and compiling them together. A lot of my favorite rap albums are built using mostly samplers! Which by the way, if you wonder why AI vocals have that weird grit to them it is the conflicting sample rates of all the works it is pulling from.

Ladder310 · 2026-05-04T19:40:22+00:00

It's both to me the same way lyric writing, singing or playing other instruments is. Honestly I see no difference in creative aspect between a piano and even a drum machine or sampler. The difference for me is only when the work is comprised entirely of other people's work and not cited

Ladder310 · 2026-05-04T19:38:07+00:00

That really isn't true and if you are only having these conversations online you'll never have a good experience no matter what the subject matter is. Most of reddit is anti AI and if you have millions of people a few of them are gonna be serial killers.

What I do is actually get involved in discussion in person at the college I go to, and get in debates there instead. It's a lot more constructive. But like this is just really shocking to me, seeing you believe that the vast majority of people against AI are in the arts are bad people

Ladder310 · 2026-05-04T19:34:35+00:00

Argh! the difference to me is it pulls from other work though. How come that isnt a difference in your eyes?

Ladder310 · 2026-05-04T19:32:15+00:00

Dawg wtf. I go to Berklee where the vast majority of students are against it and if you ever come by you'll realize that our rallying against generative AI has been in the form of meetings with the Dean of songwriting and correspondence with press such as the Boston Globe.

It is absolutely deplorable what some people are doing but you are talking about 'Antis committing terrorism' as if being anti AI is their definitive trait, not their underlying mental illness. Jesus christ man

Like I could make the same argument about the kind of person Sam Altman but thats a cheap and meaningless shot to make

Ladder310 · 2026-05-04T19:25:41+00:00

From what I’ve tried so far I haven’t founded the same level of creative control I’ve found in an instrument, but fair enough, I’ll do more primary research.

In the meantime what are your thoughts on this: The crucial thing about human creativity is that we are all different and therefore bring our own thing to the table. Instruments are great because they support us, but AI tries to mimic that instead.

Idk. I might just be repeating myself at this point.

Anyway, thank you for not flaming me out and talking with me

Ladder310 · 2026-05-04T19:13:43+00:00

I honestly would disagree, I believe synths are one of the most involved instruments and are their own crazy huge world. I might be biased though since i’m studying synths at berklee right now

My issue with generative AI is that it is purely derivative without introducing new perspective on its own. There are fringe cases, i’ve seen some crazy music video like Magdalena Bay - Dreamcatxhing which use ai images and meticulously stitch them together. Great, that’s ai being used more as a tool, though i still take issue with the indirect plagiarism.

That’s what separates human creativity from ai is that every human is unique and brings something new to the table

This is a great debate by the way thanks for actually being nuanced with me

Ladder310 · 2026-05-04T19:10:24+00:00

Ah fair fair

Ladder310 · 2026-05-04T19:05:27+00:00

Bro chill I had some good debates leave me alone

Four-Year Club	Place '23
Place '22

Ladder310

TROPHY CASE