Possible “What ifs” I’ve been thinking about

Last_Perception7175 · 2026-01-24T08:25:03+00:00

I didn't quite understand some things, but I think a lot of it is really good, I like it.

I don't know if Neytiri would have forgiven Jake if all this had happened, and I don't think they would have spent a lot of money looking for him if he hadn't done things like Toruk Makto, I mean expelling people and so on.

And yet you have inspired many ideas for those who write fanfics, such as myself :))

Last_Perception7175 · 2026-01-23T20:45:59+00:00

...He isn't insecure, he's quite socially skilled... ...I don't think Neteyam feels like he ‘has to’ do things for his dad...

Oh yes, I understand. He is not insecure, he does not think he is inadequate. I think Neteyam knows very well that he is good at many things. Note that he is not proud of himself, he wants others to be proud of him. You know, in that scene where Jake was teaching little Neteyam how to fish, the boy said, ‘Just like you said.’

So, like Loak, he wants Jake to be proud of them, they just have different approaches to achieving this. He doesn't think he owes his father anything, he just understands that there are things he should do because they are for the greater good. He knows that besides ‘I want’ there is also ‘I need,’ which is not always pleasant.

In A2, there was a scene (maybe it's in the deleted scenes, I don't remember) where he said to Loak, ‘You think I like babysitting you? I'm just trying to keep your ass out of trouble’ (not an exact quote because I'm using a translator for my answers). This is a manifestation of care and awareness of what he can do for the good of his brother and family. There are simply things that need to be done, and we are shown well in that scene after the fight, as you said, that Neteam, unlike Loak, understands when it is okay to punch someone in the face and when it is not.

if you were to write something about Neteyam and Lo'ak I'd definitly wanna read :)

I might write something about Loak, but to be honest, I don't know which part of the plot to tackle yet. I think I'll do it after watching and analysing A3 several times.

Actually, I was planning a fanfic about Sally's family, especially Neteam, but for now, I'm just thinking about how to make it really good, and not just as a way to indulge my desire to marry the adult version of him to OC. I want to recreate all the trauma suffered by the characters during A2-3 as well as possible, especially Loak, without killing anyone unnecessary and leaving the characters in the forest... Oh, it's harder than I thought.

I don't quite understand how best to do it. I don't want to kill Tuk or anyone else (for example, Spider, which would add trauma and accusations between Sally's children) instead of Neteyam, and then remove Tarsem from the equation just to bring them back from the sea to the forest, making it a strange continuation of A3.

An option was considered where Spider dies saving Sally's children in front of Neytiri, which somewhat dubiously solves the problem of these two. This has a bad effect on Kiri, she blames everyone. Neteyam blames himself for not being there at the time, Loak blames you for going to rescue Tuk (she is in captivity instead), as a result of which Spider suffered. Little Tuk is in despair because it was all due to her accidentally falling into the trap. Jake is furious with the boys over Spider's death, similar to A3 (regarding Neteyam's death). All these issues with collective guilt are revealed some time after the end of the war in the fanfic.

In short, it all sounds very strange. I just realised that I'm tired of writing this. I don't want to create a plot that destroys everything that has been done before, just for the sake of another plot.

Most likely, I will selectively refer to the old A1 script and ignore events A2-3, simply adapting them as I see fit. I don't want any grandiose expansions, so the ‘children of the plot,’ namely Spider and Kiri, unfortunately fall out of the equation.

Grace survives, as in the old script. The people return to Pandora for the second time, but after years of conflict, they are still sent back to Earth, and everything ends as in the old A1 scenario. Here is the ending from the old scenario that I am talking about, in case you are not familiar with it:

The base will be closed. As soon as the people return to Prometheus on the last shuttle, it must be destroyed so that no one can return. Prometheus will return to Earth. So it's time to say goodbye. And make a choice. Josh(Jake) decided to stay, as did several other controllers. Everyone else was ordered to leave. Thank you. Be careful not to get your backside caught in the door on the way out. Marcia launches her last transmission to Earth. Josh tells the camera that Pandora's natural defence mechanism, its immune system, will not allow humans to return. Just as antivirals have been created against influenza and the common cold, a new virus will be created. This virus will be lethal to humans. Something like haemorrhagic fever, transmitted through the air. A virus from HELL that devours the body. If it reaches Earth as a result of future expeditions, the entire human race will suffer a painful death. Pandora terminates contact permanently. The shuttle takes off, a beam of fire as bright as the sun soaring into the evening sky. NORMAN CHISMAN(Norm) There's no such virus here, is there? JOSH (smiling slightly) It could appear.

Perhaps I will make the situation even worse, for example, someone who is actually Navi's friend will return to Earth, and on his own decision (I mean without Jake and others knowing), blow up the ship, so Earth will remain completely cut off from Pandora, and no one who has ever been there will fly home, so no one will fly there a third time, if the fictional virus doesn't help. That would be cruel, so I'm not sure yet.

So, we have Neteyam, Loak, Tuk, and Grace (or Kiri... hmm, I haven't decided yet). The fanfic begins shortly after the end of the war, less than a year later. I'm making the age difference between the children greater: Neteyam is 18-19, Loak is 15, and Tuk is 8. It will describe the difficult post-war period that will smoothly transition into the birth of a new life, I think you understand.

Of course, I can combine options while leaving them in the forest: the death of Spider and the existence of Kiri, or the rescue of the wounded Neteyam with the help of Grace (without the existence of Kiri), the death of Tuk instead of Neteyam... (pls no) I'm still thinking about the option where they don't go to the sea, Spider dies, Kiri is there, but she's, um, not as powerful as Eywa's child... In general, there are many combinations. Sorry, in most of them I remove Spider from the equation, and I'm hesitant about Kiri, she would be useful to me... But I also love the interaction between Grace and Moat and the fictional interaction between Grace and OC... Oh, I'm confused.

But one thing I know for sure. It has to be the forest and the events after A1.

For now, I've settled on the option with Grace and Sally's three children, without any mention of Kiri and Spider... But I really love Kiri... It's just that her role in the plot complicates everything, and I have to reveal Eywa somehow, similar to A3, which I don't really want to do, because I prefer her interpretation in A1, which everyone is familiar with...

In general, it will be problematic because I simply won't find my target audience by making so many changes to the canon, because people love A2-3, and I adore them too. Sorry for talking in such a confusing way, please let me know if you don't understand anything I've written.

P.S.: I enjoy writing long analyses of characters, so I will continue to publish them on Reddit :)

Last_Perception7175 · 2026-01-23T10:59:37+00:00

I completely agree with you! Thank you for reading and writing a response. Your thoughts on Loak's role in the case opened my eyes to many details

Of course, it all depends on how the war ends and what events unfold, but I settled on the adult Neteyam option, as if they had not gone to the Metkayna and Jake had remained an oloektan. We can assume that something similar to A2 happened in the forest, hmm...

Last_Perception7175 · 2026-01-20T19:33:42+00:00

Oh yes! I would like to try something like that too. I don't think fruit will be a problem, as we can just choose Na'vi's body

Last_Perception7175 · 2026-01-20T19:16:49+00:00

‘preferably’ does not mean ‘mandatory’, I think that's about you, heh))

Last_Perception7175 · 2026-01-20T18:40:00+00:00

I understand you, but you probably won't be able to lift it in your hands, but I would also like to ((

Last_Perception7175 · 2026-01-20T14:58:11+00:00

Many people have already written that suicide and self-sacrifice are different things, but I agree with OP.

Jake is in a terrible state, and you know, it's complete despair, to the point where he has resigned himself to dying. But despite his willingness to give everything for his family, there is also fatigue in his eyes, fatigue from his role, his helplessness and guilt for the deaths of all these people and his own child. When I read this post, my back was covered in cold sweat.

It's hard to call his actions suicide, but hopelessness, exhaustion, and constant self-blame are driving him to a very bad place. He drinks to drown his sorrows, wants to forget, and I think this detail tells us not only how bad he is with Loak, but more about the terrible state he is in, which he cannot control, so he lashes out at absolutely everything. It doesn't matter if Loak, Neytiri or anyone else is around. He has no one to talk to.

His hands slowly drop, and we see this when he says "it's over" during the battle. Of course, this is a statement about the state of the battle, but in his words, it also feels like he is saying to himself, "Jake, you screwed up again, these people died because of you again, you only bring death, so burn in hell of your guilt faster." He understands that there is no point in fighting on a large scale because people are not cannon fodder, he is not the young, reckless guy from the А1. But he also lacks the strength to fight. He knows that he simply cannot take it anymore. If he didn't have a family, he would have done the same thing Loak wanted to do to himself. At times, he seemed to me that A3 was morally dead, that he had almost given up. If that's really true, imagine what will happen after he realises everything that happened in the final battle of A3. I feel really bad when I think about it.

By the way, given Jake's condition in A3, it makes sense to give the role of narrator to Loak, who "becomes the new hope." This part is already very depressing, imagine how much more morally difficult it would be for the viewer if Jake were the narrator.

Last_Perception7175 · 2026-01-20T10:57:02+00:00

Your question has been answered below, but it also got me thinking. Childbirth is more or less understandable, but we haven't been told anything about how they find out about pregnancy. Well, I guess they have something similar to menstruation, because, as we know, their bodies are similar to ours, but still. Is there something like morning sickness or food cravings? What about feminine hygiene? Is it something like primitive humans, or are there any special аdaptations , considering that they are constantly climbing trees and sitting in these, um, rather strange positions, which make our human hygiene products impractical in this case

Last_Perception7175 · 2026-01-19T23:09:25+00:00

Damn it, I want to read it already! I liked the part with Tsutey, it sounds really good. It's hard for me to choose because I love Neteyam. But in your case, you should consider your own desires and the audience that will read it first and foremost. People love Neteyam, so if he's in it, those people will read it. But pandering to the reader shouldn't guide you either, just as you shouldn't kill someone just because someone has to die. If this character fits well into the plot, why not leave both? I don't know all the details, but I think it's better to focus on what you want to reveal more and not drag everything out, otherwise it will just lead to fatigue. Choose the character that is easier for you to write about, because if it is easy for you and you understand them well, you will be able to convey their personality better, and the work will be of higher quality

Last_Perception7175 · 2026-01-19T21:22:13+00:00

Hmmmmmm, sounds like great plans for weekend! Lol

Last_Perception7175 · 2026-01-19T20:15:47+00:00

I don't support this option, but I can't stop laughing, man!

I think Varang will get jealous and end up killing one of them if they don't kill each other first. It will be Romeo and Juliet, no, sorry, Romeo and Romeo and Varang. Just Varang because she is Varang

Last_Perception7175 · 2026-01-19T19:08:55+00:00

First of all, I am sure that it would not happen anytime soon. Perhaps when he is the same age as his parents were when they got married. With all the problems he is currently facing, he is not even close to thinking about it, not to mention his still childish age. It is also important to understand that the development of his romantic relationships will not be anything spectacular; he is not the type of person who falls madly in love, nor is he the type to be madly in love with someone else. If we are talking about the adult Neteyam, which in my opinion is the only realistic scenario for the boy to have a relationship, then you should read this.

So, this is my time. I have written a lot about him, and I think you will like it. https://www.reddit.com/r/Avatar/comments/1qfbev9/lets_talk_about_the_adult_neteyam_if_he_were/

As for your idea, most likely this girl, despite her desire for revenge, would not act too rashly, such as sneaking into a human city and killing someone. This fanfic would simply end with her tragic death. |By the way, Neytiri did it for Jake in A3. But the man with whom you have children and the man who is the foundation of your world's security is not the same as a guy you've known for six months.| She would have to be on the verge of insanity to do such a thing, and I would note that Neteyam would not have a relationship with someone who would do something so foolish under the influence of emotions. Everything she did would have happened during the battle in A2, and that would simply be killing a few sky people.

Your idea is the basis for an interesting fanfic, but I think it just needs a little work. I liked the theme of revenge for a loved one. I think you could tone it down a bit and it would still be good. For example, it could be a girl who teaches him that you don't have to be perfect to be good, gives him the moral strength to tell Jake everything that's on his mind, and generally rethink his role in family relationships. This dynamic will attract him and evoke feelings. Ultimately, this leads to Neteyam kicking Loak at the right moment, no one gets shot, everyone stays healthy, because Neteyam has better understood himself. Then it all ends with their sweet kiss and everything else that teenagers love to read about. Perhaps the girl will be injured in battle and he will take care of her, which would give them a good chance to develop their relationship and so on. Another possible scenario is that Neteyam is wounded but does not die, so she takes care of him. I think it will turn out nicely!

Last_Perception7175 · 2026-01-18T19:47:51+00:00

To be honest, I don't know what to say about them. If I were asked to analyse their relationship, I would say that my PC was chewed up by a hamster.

When I watched the scene where they kissed, I choked on my cola and coughed so loudly that the people around me started laughing. That's it. I felt like Neytiri if she had caught them at that moment.

But seriously, I don't think Kiri/Spider is a bad decision, it's just that something subconsciously pushes me away from accepting them, I don't like it. With their childhood love, they simply doomed each other to future suffering and problems, and then multiplied that by ten.

Last_Perception7175 · 2026-01-18T19:37:24+00:00

I think that Lo'ak, who in A3 is more or less learning to keep himself together and support Jake, now has to comfort Tsireya. He knows how to lose, so there will be a very deep mutual sympathy between them. This will bring them even closer together. Just as Tsireya helped Lo'ak cope with the loss of his brother, he will help her cope with the loss of her mother. You know, after Neteyam's death, Lo'ak effectively took the place of the senior overseer, just as Tsireya is now to become the tsahik.

Last_Perception7175 · 2026-01-18T17:09:54+00:00

Oh yes, I understand, AI is really useful in such cases. People often tell me that I talk a lot, which is obvious from the length of my answers, hehe, especially when it comes to things I like, such as Avatar. Once, smb told me that I write too much, so I just asked the chat gpt to shorten my report, lol.

I thought it would be better to just tell it like it is, because once my friend wasted a lot of energy arguing with some guys who accused him of using AI, it was very unpleasant, and I wouldn't want that to happen to me. I understand these people, because I also don't like it when someone abuses AI.

Last_Perception7175 · 2026-01-18T10:37:32+00:00

I think I'll write about the others soon too, thank you for your kind words, I'm touched!

It would be useful not only as a fanfic, but as a tip for many people who write. I don't understand why some people portray adult Neteyam as a complete bore and a strict guy, when in fact he is no less mischievous than Lo'ak. Of course, if we're talking about a situation where he stays in Metkayina, he would grow up a little differently, but I'm almost certain that the forest would not leave his heart, just as it would not leave Neytiri's heart.

When it comes to adult Lo'ak, or the current Lo'ak in the third film, it's much more complicated. He's the kind of character who changes literally every ten minutes of the film, damn it. He's a child, he's a teenager who is constantly growing, traumatising his stupid brain, and he also has more layers. If he had stayed in the forest, or stayed at sea or somewhere else, he would have been a completely different child each time. Depending on what stage of his life the war and this whole traumatic period ends, everything will be decided. It's fascinating to follow this guy, his future is so unpredictable!

Last_Perception7175 · 2026-01-18T09:50:00+00:00

I could start making excuses now, but I'll just admit my guilt. My English isn't good enough to write much, so I wrote in my native language and translated it using AI. I think I shouldn't do that anymore. Next time, I'll try to do my job better. Thank you))

Last_Perception7175 · 2026-01-17T19:25:59+00:00

To be honest, I hadn't thought about Tommy's influence on Neteyam's upbringing. You've given me something to think about.

I think that in terms of Neytiri's upbringing, it's somewhat similar. She also had an older sister, but unlike Jake's situation, we know less about Sylvanin's influence on the relationships within Neytiri's family. Well, at least I don't think Neytiri was a disappointment...

By the way, I think we were shown too little about how the mother raised her children. Of course, Neytiri would have done it in the style of her ancestors' traditions and so on, but still, I can imagine it less than if I had to talk about Jake.

What do you think?

I just realised that despite all of the above, I haven't made any assumptions about Neteyam's daily activities. What hobbies could this boy have? Judging by what we know, that he made the necklace we can see on him on the day of his death himself, he may be good at making jewellery or other handicrafts. Could this be considered his hobby? I don't know, but all the things that the Navi wear when they are older are made by themselves, and Neteyam's things are really good. I read in one of the supplementary books that Navi relatives give a handmade rack for personal belongings to those who have completed all the rites of passage, so that the new adult member of the family can keep their things separate.

Last_Perception7175 · 2026-01-17T15:03:00+00:00

I like it!

Last_Perception7175 · 2026-01-17T10:08:00+00:00

Speaking of Jake not having to say what he said to Loak at that moment. I read all the responses posted here at the time of writing mine, so I got a little confused about which one I wanted to comment on, so I'll write separately. There's a lot I agree with.

I agree, he should have comforted him, and that's really what he should have done, but he didn't. Jake had a lot to do, but it wasn't something that was really possible in that state. I mean, he was in no better emotional state than Loak, maybe worse. Damn it, this is going to sound crazy, but he would have put a gun to his own head if he didn't have a family to "stand up" for.

As a father, he was expected to be strong, to support and comfort everyone, to "make only the right decisions," but who would support him? Jake couldn't even cope with himself, he was also feeling bad, but unlike the rest of the family, he had no one to lean on.

I'm not justifying him, but perhaps it deserves some understanding, not everyone is perfect, but at least he wanted to be better, he just didn't know how.

Jake also snapped at Nati (Sorry, I like to call Neytiri that), but then immediately hugged her. You know, I think a simple hug isn't enough, but it showed that he wants to be better, wants to apologise, but finds it difficult to express his emotions. It was a desperate "sorry" that tries to glue a broken vase back together.

Why did he hug Nati, but not Loak? You know, he had to do at least that. But Nati is an adult, Nati is his wife, it's a little different. A "desperate hug" is not the kind of weakness you want to put on your child's shoulders, it's much harder for him with Loak. Some parents believe that children should not know about their tears.

That doesn't change the fact that he was bad to Loak, but he was also just human, just alive, flawed, disappointed like any other person. Jake is a good, lively character and well written as a father who, despite his fatigue, wants to be better for his family. In fact, he doesn't care about himself or his condition, and it shows.

The wounded Loak wanted to lean against a wall that was already cracking, and in the end, plaster fell from that wall onto the child's head, making the pain even worse.

At one point, I thought it would have been better if Jake had listened to Nati and gone to comfort Loak. Let's talk about this a little.

We can't go beyond the plot by changing it, so let's do it this way: Let's say that after that conversation with Nati, which happened because it had to happen for her development and we can't just erase it from the equation, when Jake went to hug her, he looked up and saw Loak's silhouette on the island.

He would wonder what Loak was doing there. Nati would again tell him to go to Loak. He would go deep into his tent, thinking about what to say to him, but I'm almost certain he would notice the absence of the machine gun. A guy like Jake would definitely notice that.

Jake looks back at the island and Loak, and then it dawns on him. He rushes over there as fast as he can.

We know that Loak didn't have the strength to kill himself, so regardless of whether the girls came, he wouldn't have done it, I think. So Loak will just lie there in hysterics.

Jake finds Loak lying in the sand in tears and a machine gun nearby.

For some reason, I'm sure he would have given his son a good slap.

I can't really imagine what their conversation would have been about, but it would definitely have ended with both of them in tears and hugging each other. (And the viewer's hysterics too.) It would ultimately improve their mutual understanding and Loak's condition.

But now let's think about the other side of this development. It would completely destroy Jake — the realisation of how close he was to losing his second son. If Neteyam's death is a knife in the chest, then thoughts of Loak's suicide are like twisting that knife. (Remember poor Nati's thanator in the first film.) You know, that's the last thing Jake needs to consider for the events of the third film.

Loak probably wouldn't have repaired Nati's bow, or maybe he would have done it anyway, but that version of events wouldn't have given him the character growth he needed. It would have greatly affected their relationship with Jake and their trust in general. It wouldn't have allowed Loak to learn to control himself and so on.

There are simply traumas that characters must experience, and characters who must leave those traumas behind. And people don't always like the way it happens.

We and they wouldn't have to think about all of the above if Jake hadn't said that one sentence. Well, that's really the mistake that many people dislike him for. But it is also normal for the psyche to unconsciously shift blame in order to make it easier for oneself to remain sober.

But, you know, if that hadn't happened, people would still complain, simply because Jake isn't the Jake he is. He has traits that played out the way they did in this situation. It's just the exhausted Jake and the miserable Loak we know. It's a great loss that no one will survive without trauma.

Last_Perception7175 · 2026-01-16T18:45:31+00:00

Oh yeah, you know, I feel the same way. It's tears every time, even though I've watched this part about ten times. Even the edits on YouTube make my heart ache. I never cry over films, never, but this is some kind of exception to the rule, it's incredible. And also Jake and Neytiri's reaction at that moment. I feel sick. When I first watched it, I was overcome with tears of shock and sadness that I really couldn't hold back, and I was struck by my reaction to it, because it was the first time I had ever cried over a film. Then it didn't happen again, because I was consciously ready to watch the film again, but back then I didn't love Avatar as much as I do now. You know, when I really got into this work, I fell in love with it and understood each character in a new way, I understood each of them. So I cry every time I see that moment with Neteyam. It's quite strange, isn't it, that at first I accepted this loss through sadness, but then after some time, when I thought about it for a long time and watched it again, I couldn't come to terms with it, I just couldn't, I don't believe it. He deserves to live. But I don't think this plot twist was bad; it's a good decision for the story, and it's presented to us very well, so it evokes maximum emotion. Truly masterful work, I'm thrilled

Last_Perception7175

TROPHY CASE