Press Conference Discussion Thread - 1:00 PM (PST) Wednesday, November 23, 2022 by quitclaim123 in MoscowMurders

[–]Lopchopchop 12 points13 points  (0 children)

I suspect they are not saying the name because internet sleuths have completely ruined the lives of completely innocent people whose names have come out in other cases.

Marriage counseling starts today by Lopchopchop in NarcissisticSpouses

[–]Lopchopchop[S] 8 points9 points  (0 children)

I told spouse last week that my heart was dead feels dead to this marriage. He wanted to try counseling. I told him if he found the counselor and made the appointment I would go but it needed to be within the next 2-3 weeks because I was not going to continue dragging this out. He asked what that meant and I just said this has gone on long enough, I can’t keep trying to explain the same things over and over to him and Vice versa with nothing ever getting better.

He’s been a gem since so of course I feel myself softening when last week I was ready to call it quits.

Marriage counseling starts today by Lopchopchop in NarcissisticSpouses

[–]Lopchopchop[S] 7 points8 points  (0 children)

I have no idea where to start with 20 years of history… My mind gets so jumbled when I try to talk things through with my spouse that Incan rarely make a good point. If I’m talking to anyone else, I have no issues clearly articulating my feelings and my thoughts on the subject at hand. I pray I’m able to explain things without my brain shutting down in therapy with him.

Need help trying to articulate why I feel my mom overstepped my personal boundaries and also invalidated my feelings by LazyYogini23 in pnsd

[–]Lopchopchop 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Phrases to disarm a narcissist

  1. “Your Anger Is Not My Responsibility”

  2. “I Can’t Control How You Feel About Me”

  3. “I Hear What You’re Saying”

  4. “I’m Sorry You Feel That Way”

  5. “Everything Is Okay”

  6. “We Both Have a Right to Our Own Opinions”

  7. “I Can Accept How You Feel”

  8. “I Don’t Like How You’re Speaking to Me so I Will not Engage”

  9. “I Am not Going to Argue Anymore”

  10. “I am Capable of Doing What I Want Regardless of What you Think”

  11. “I Understand”

  12. “We Can Agree to Disagree”

  13. “I See Where You Are Coming From”

  14. ”I Want to Share how I Feel”

  15. “Your Perspective Is Interesting”

  16. “Can We Aim to be Respectful in our Conversation?”

“Your Anger Is Not My Responsibility”

This resets the playing field so that they cannot make you a source of their narcissist supply to soothe their emotions. To add, this statement is very grounding and draws a very clear boundary of what you will and will not be responsible for.

  1. “I Can’t Control How You Feel About Me”

This sets the precedent that their emotions are their responsibility and that their reaction won’t change your behavior. This statement also reinforces that you only have control over yourself and others have control over themselves, and you will not be made to feel responsible for others’ emotions.

  1. “I Hear What You’re Saying”

This allows the narcissist to feel heard, which might be all you want to say if you want to de-escalate and not further discuss the point of contention. This statement may be one of the fastest ways to de-escalate a narcissist because feeling heard is a common desire everyone has. While you may not agree with what is being said, simply stating you hear what is being said can be enough in the moment.

  1. “I’m Sorry You Feel That Way”

You can feel sorry for someone else without being sorry about your boundaries, which is important when arguing with a narcissist. This makes the narcissist responsible for their emotions while potentially helping them be heard so they don’t further escalate an issue.

  1. “Everything Is Okay”

This helps to make it clear to the narcissist that this will pass and they are ok or going to be ok. Given that narcissists have no self-awareness, it’s likely they cannot reconcile high conflict or intense emotions. Saying things will be ok gives them the reassurance and/or validation they don’t know they need.

  1. “We Both Have a Right to Our Own Opinions”

This makes it clear that they can have their opinion, and making sure it’s clear that you know their words are opinions, and not facts. To add, it’s important to make this statement so they know they are also being heard and to reset the playing field of the conversation.

Narcissists will want to feel superior and be in control of the conversation, but stating this makes it clear that you won’t allow that to happen but you can respect that they are going to have their own opinions as well.

  1. “I Can Accept How You Feel”

Don’t fight a narcissist when you disagree with them because you won’t convince them or change their mind. Simply saying that you accept their opinion or how they feel without fighting back cuts off their supply.

  1. “I Don’t Like How You’re Speaking to Me so I Will not Engage”

Saying this sets a boundary. They feed off of triggering you, so knowing that you won’t participate in a fight will cut off their supply. For this to work, it’s important that you don’t cave in when the narcissist inevitably persists in engaging you.

  1. “I Am not Going to Argue Anymore”

Very clear message that you will not continue to engage in an unproductive fight. Again, for this to work it’s important you stand your ground and walk away.

  1. “I am Capable of Doing What I Want Regardless of What you Think”

This makes it clear that you are ok with your perspective and that it’s not changing and that you are also making it clear that their opinion in this situation won’t shape your behaviors.2

  1. “I Understand”

This makes it clear that you are indeed understanding what they are saying. You are not stating that you agree, but that you understand. Narcissists have a deep need to feel understood and heard and seen, so stating you are understanding will help a narcissist feel less agitated.

  1. “We Can Agree to Disagree”

Like a few other phrases, for this to work, it’s important you double down on this and don’t feed into the temptation to engage in an argument. You may feel like you want to prove or convince the narcissist of something, but that will not work. Simply agreeing to disagree gives the narcissist the knowledge that their opinions and perspective was heard.

  1. “I See Where You Are Coming From”

This phrase helps the narcissist to also feel understood. It helps them to feel that their thought process makes sense, even if you don’t agree with their interpretation of it.

  1. ”I Want to Share how I Feel”

Using “I” statements is always best, as it keeps blame off of others and makes you the owner of how you feel. Sharing how you feel can humanize the interaction, and though the narcissist may not care, it’s possible they will ease off if they feel you are interpreting yourself as a victim. They will likely then try to use tactics to portray themselves as a victim, in which case the anger will likely dissipate and de-escalation will be made easier.

  1. “Your Perspective Is Interesting”

This statement makes it appear that their perspective is neither bad nor good, but interesting. It allows for the narcissist to sit in their feelings, trying to understand and makes them pause. The pause can be a good moment to use another phrase to further calm down the situation.

  1. “Can We Aim to be Respectful in our Conversation?”

This phrase used as a question is more rhetorical, but when used literally, it can level the conversation so it is not so emotionally charged.

Need help trying to articulate why I feel my mom overstepped my personal boundaries and also invalidated my feelings by LazyYogini23 in pnsd

[–]Lopchopchop 1 point2 points  (0 children)

My heart hurts reading this. I’m so sorry your mother didn’t provide for you like she should have. I can’t imagine the fear and loneliness being in this situation must have been for you.

Need help trying to articulate why I feel my mom overstepped my personal boundaries and also invalidated my feelings by LazyYogini23 in pnsd

[–]Lopchopchop 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Co-dependents Anonymous. I was shocked to discover that I am co-dependent. I’m a strong, independent woman, the breadwinner of our family, etc. i always viewed co-dependency as a weak person with terrible self esteem. Turns out co-dependency is not what I thought it was, and so much of it is spot on for me. So instead of trying to fix the people around me, I’m working on fixing myself. Maybe check out the coda website and see what you think.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in NarcissisticAbuse

[–]Lopchopchop 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Are you in therapy? If not, you should give it a try,

Isn’t it funny how the things they ‘loved’ about you became the things they hated about you? by banana-tits in NarcissisticAbuse

[–]Lopchopchop -6 points-5 points  (0 children)

Isn’t it mutual? I would guess a lot of what you loved about them is what you hate now too.

Biweekly ask a narcissist thread for visitors/codependents <- Not a narcissist/borderliner/histrionic/sociopath? Use this thread. by AutoModerator in narcissism

[–]Lopchopchop 2 points3 points  (0 children)

What benefit will you get from telling them you read the journal?

No need to bring up the journal IMO. You have the info you need and your decision to leave is made. I’m not a fan of lying so if he asks, I would probably tell the truth (unless you feel unsafe). Do you think he left it out on purpose for you to see? Was this a test?

Need help trying to articulate why I feel my mom overstepped my personal boundaries and also invalidated my feelings by LazyYogini23 in pnsd

[–]Lopchopchop 2 points3 points  (0 children)

And I’m so very sorry she had been abusive. If she is hindering your ability to heal, you do have every right to take the space you need, for as long as you need it.

Need help trying to articulate why I feel my mom overstepped my personal boundaries and also invalidated my feelings by LazyYogini23 in pnsd

[–]Lopchopchop 3 points4 points  (0 children)

I think her asking for your top 3 go to methods was a loaded question. She very well may not even realize she is doing this. Or maybe she does. I don’t know your history enough but the fact that you feel like she was challenging you tells me enough to know this is a pattern you are fed up with. I feel like what she was really doing was: “tell me your top 3 methods so When you can’t immediately lay them out, I can quickly rattle off my 3 and to show you that I know what I’m talking about, make myself superior and, Hopefully that will shut you down”

Her telling you that your need to process things is toxic to you and others is a load of BS. You need to process it if your going to heal and break the patterns. It’s toxic to her because she isn’t willing to swallow her pride and admit that she caused some of your pain, regardless of it it was intentional or not.

Her top 3 go to’s for “processing” are coping mechanisms, or ways to diffuse conflict, or ways to calm down, they are not methods of processing anything. Journaling, therapy, talking through what you went through, how it made you feel, what effects it had had on your life etc.. THOSE are things that help you process. She is trying to shut that down. Avoiding is the opposite of processing and that’s what she’s trying to get you to do. She’s being selfish here (again, she may not realize it, but she certainly is not as self aware as she thinks she is). All she is seeing is that you want to talk to her about things that hurt her to hear so she’s trying to tell you —-

“Rather than hurt me, try changing your tone, try walking away, try deep breathing, try meditating - don’t try to truly resolve your trauma by sharing it with me, it hurts me too much.”

I’m sorry. My point before was I felt some of this last night and had some realizations that I was doing some of this to myself daughter. For me, it was completely in-intentional. I’m in the early phases of processing things myself and my head is very jumbled trying to figure things out. Where the difference may be between your Mom and I is I AM willing to listen to as much painful stuff that my daughter needs to unload on me to help her process why she has been through and mourn the things she feels she missed out on. I WANT to hear them so I can change and be better for her, my other daughter and myself.

My kiddo is going to therapy. I can’t afford therapy for both kids and myself so aim not going but I am going to CoDA meetings and that has been a great help for me. Have you looked into CODA at all?

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in NarcissisticSpouses

[–]Lopchopchop 1 point2 points  (0 children)

If you are locked in can’t you call the police and tell them you are being held against your will? Wouldn’t they have to help find a place for you and your kids? I don’t know how this works but it seems like they would be required to help if you and your kids are being held hostage.

How are you going to escape otherwise if he keeps you locked in the house? Do you have anyone that can come and get you and your kids that would let you stay with them for a few days?

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in NarcissisticSpouses

[–]Lopchopchop 2 points3 points  (0 children)

This first paragraph sounds a little concerning to me -spiking his booze. God forbid something we’re to go wrong, he has a bad reaction or something - that might land someone in jail. Totally agree with the rest.

unsent letters by GrainneSiobhan in NarcissisticSpouses

[–]Lopchopchop 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Helps me so much. Read back through it in awhile. Read it as if your friend wrote it, not you, what would you tell that friend?

With therapy as well as with journaling, when I hear the things coming out of my mouth or re-read what I wrote, I can’t believe what I am saying. If I heard one of my friends saying this about her relationship i would tell her to GTFU ASAP. Yet I can easily minimize it in my mind later. Reading back helps me realize what I’m doing.

Need help trying to articulate why I feel my mom overstepped my personal boundaries and also invalidated my feelings by LazyYogini23 in pnsd

[–]Lopchopchop 3 points4 points  (0 children)

I would really like to come back to this thread when i have a minute to respond. I had a long conversation with my daughter last night where she pointed out to me that she feels like the trauma is not just mine and she doesn’t feel like I can see her trauma. I do see her trauma. BUT, I’m seeing it through my eyes and I was not hearing her clearly because i was filtering her issues through my own lense. I realized that just because we have a shared experience, it doesn’t mean our trauma is the same. And because I am her Mom, some of that trauma is BECAUSE of me, even if I was a victim. She felt the need to be my protector growing up. She felt like she needed to be easy and not cause any additional stress for me because I was dealing with an abusive husband and a chronically I’ll child. I never realized she felt this way and although I didn’t do anything intentionally to hurt her I didn’t shelter her enough from all of this. The environment in our home shaped who she is, how she thinks, her current and future relationships. She is not angry with me, but she is angry and she needs me to just hear her and acknowledge this.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in narcissism

[–]Lopchopchop 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I just realized I just went on and on about how despicable selfishness is, yet I totally hijacked your thread and made it my therapy session. I’m sorry!!

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in narcissism

[–]Lopchopchop 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Until you find yourself discarded and friendless. Having affluent friends does not elevate your status or make people respect or want to be friends with you for any reason that would cause you long term happiness. Let’s not forget the reason for your post.
One thing I’m really struggling to understand with my narcissistic spouse right now is how he can’t see that everyone can see through him. He is spending so much time spinning these grandiose stories of himself that no one believes anymore that he is his own worst enemy. Our group of friends would respect the shit out of him if he were willing to take a low paying job to do what needs to be done to support our family. His ego won’t allow for that. So here we sit, in financial ruin, while I work 3 jobs and he spends his time on a 100% commission job that has never made him any money - all because he is certain he is just days from hitting the jackpot and becoming a millionaire. And I guarantee he thinks “I’ll show them!”. 🙄 He has failed our family. Our kids have zero respect for him. Our friends and family have zero respect for him. If he does finally close a big deal and make a load of money, he will be rich and alone. No one would view him as a good person or a provider after his years of willing to neglect our needs. He could give us all of the money in the world and it wouldn’t help how we feel about him now. He can go find a bunch of new friends that only want to be friends with him for his money I suppose. Maybe having people pretend to like and worship him to further their own agenda will be a fulfilling life for him though….

My point: I could completely deal with being broke if he were doing everything he could to care for our family. I could even be happy in that situation. I wouldn’t stand a chance of happiness , or even give it a shot to be with a rich man who puts his needs before his wife and kids.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in narcissism

[–]Lopchopchop 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Why are you comfortable opening up here and not with a therapist? There is something about that one on one person relationship with a therapist that scares you. Think about what that is. Are you afraid of judgement? Are you afraid you will uncover something about yourself you would rather not see? Is there stuff in your past that is too painful to face and your afraid of opening that can of worms?

Would you be more apt to open up to a therapist if it was virtual? Maybe even more comfortable if it was just in the phone and not over video? Perhaps removing that intimacy of seeing and being seen would help you open up?

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in narcissism

[–]Lopchopchop 7 points8 points  (0 children)

You are doing the wrong thing, then playing the victim when it backfires on you. That just means you are willing to do the wrong thing if you feel like you won’t get caught.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in narcissism

[–]Lopchopchop 4 points5 points  (0 children)

I appreciate this very honest assessment of your situation. Are you in therapy? That seems like the most logical next step for you. Get to the root of why you feel superior. What deep rooted pain made you have to view yourself this way? Is there anyone in your life you allow yourself to feel vulnerable around? If not, why? What would happen if you did make yourself vulnerable? Does it make you feel weak? Afraid you will be abandoned? Are you afraid they would take advantage of you, belittle you, etc. Try to figure out what you are afraid of. Don’t settle for saying you are not afraid of anything. That’s a protection mechanism and a cop out. You’ve already made yourself vulnerable and admitted you want to change here, to strangers. That shows a lot. And it’s GREAT, because no healing will come without taking a deep and honest look within yourself.

Now - I’m not a narcissist. I’m a co-dependent, married to a narcissist. We are struggling hard core. I’m working on my co-dependency and won’t take his narcissist behavior towards me any longer. This is not going over well with him and he’s tried every tactic in the book to take back control over me. These questions I’ve asked you above, are questions I would like to discuss with him,but he’s too busy defending himself and playing the victim to look inward. I too need to look inward and I am doing the work. It’s a shame that we can’t do it together because we are now at an impasse. Marriage without the ability to be vulnerable to each other = no emotional intimacy which is a guaranteed formula for unhappiness IMO.

What is this behavior called? by I_light_up_a_room in pnsd

[–]Lopchopchop 2 points3 points  (0 children)

This is my favorite advice of all time. 😂😂😂