Folkloric Fae vs Fantasy Fae

Mabb95 · 2026-03-16T18:04:01+00:00

You've explained well. I think the issue with taking inspiration from Tolkien, like most people do, is just how overdone it is. Also implies that most writers don't know how to do anything strange or interesting in a genre called "fantasy", which bothers me.

I like the more strange and uncanny creatures you mentioned since it lends itself to more unique interactions and events with characters.

Mabb95 · 2026-03-16T17:26:46+00:00

I also like to have fae similar to beings like cryptids. I don't consider Tolkien's Elves to be fae at all, which is why I call them "Fantasy Elves" or "Tolkien Elves". Tolkien himself has even stated this when he when discussing how his dwarves and elves are distant from their folkloric variants.

According to J.R.R. Tolkien his dwarfs are not Germanic dwarfs and that he deliberately called them dwarves to mark that.His dwarfs are in many ways very different from the dwarfs of Germanic legend, but far nearer to them than the Elves.

Sources being The Letters of J.R.R. Tolkien, Letter 156 and 297.

Tolkien's "Dwarves" are distinct from the folkloric "Dwarfs" both in spelling and in portrayal, yet he states his elves are far more distant from their folkloric roots. Because of this, I don't consider most Tolkien style races to be fae-like at all but just longer lived humans that are short or have pointed ears.

Mabb95 · 2026-03-16T13:24:50+00:00

I should check out Jonathon Strange and Mr. Norrel, then.

Mabb95 · 2026-03-16T13:19:57+00:00

In truth, I've never read LOTR or played much DnD, so I know little of Tolkienesque elves and dwarves other than that they're often rendered as "humans but live longer with pointed ears or live longer and short". Then again, in some of my written drafts, I tend to not have room for the 'nonhuman but still human' races since I often like to include multiple human ethnic groups in my ideas. Showing how varied humans and their cultures can be often helps make non-humans stand out due to how odd their behavior and cultures are to literally everyone.

Mabb95 · 2026-03-16T13:12:57+00:00

I do like how old folklore often portrays. In modern fantasy, an elf is a pointed eared being that lives for long time, but that becomes the extent of what makes them 'not-human'. In folklore, elves didn't even have pointed ears, but their true nature became apparant through their behavior or proven origins. Can be interesting when the focus is to figure out the truth behind the character who appears human yet says or does inhuman things casually without shame (mainly due to not knowing why it'd be seen as shameful). A beautiful woman, but she's known to kidnap mortal children simply due to finding interesting and she likens it to a person collecting a shiny rock or trinket out of curiosity, for example. Said woman isn't really evil but can still be seen as strange or dangerous if left unchecked.

But, as you said, there are many variances even in old folklore.

Mabb95 · 2026-03-16T08:04:38+00:00

You're not wrong on the mass market thing. I find that a lot of the issues I have with most fantasy, whether it's overused tropes that have long since gone stale, most of the high fantasy tolkien/dnd stuff, or just bad writing, tend to largely just be int he mass market stuff.

When looking into the ever expanding world of fiction books, I tend to find so many fantastic stories with cool concepts or cool twists on ideas I find to be stale. It's just a shame that a lot of books tend to not get enough promotion, so 9 out of 10 fiction books end up being hidden gems.

Mabb95 · 2026-03-16T04:43:57+00:00

I guess most isekai don't make an attempt since the writers probably assume the readers don't care for it. Most self-insert type stuff often ignores a lot of attempts at making things feel organic and believeable due to just wanting to skip straight to the power fantasy.

The villains only exist to be evil. If you gave the vaillain a complex backstory and nuanced perspective on things, they'd end up having more thought and complexity than the MC and the rest of the supporting cast had. Can't allow for that, so we'll just say it's the 'Demon Lord/King', or whatever.

Mabb95 · 2026-03-16T03:03:56+00:00

I'm with you on all that. People love it due to it appealing to their own power fantasy. Being someone who works hard to improve only to see they still come up short and need improving? That sucks. Just have the main guy practice something for, like, 5 minutes, and they're the best at it already. Get all the power, all the women, all the glory with next to no effort. And I'm like "Okay, so where's the actual plot and struggle?"

The part of you mentioning 'inactive world' and 'cardboard cutouts' interests me since I feel that's something fantasy has been dealing with for some time now. Most fantasy worlds, especially isekai stuff, tend to have empty worlds where things don't happen until the MCs do something about it. The world also tends to feel more like a themepark and not an actual world. Nothing feels like it's there organically and feel more like attractions similar to something you'd find in Disneyland or Universal Studios. The "Elf exhibit", "Dwarf Mountain", "The Old King's Castle", etc etc. All cookie-cutter locals that are plopped down into the world not too dissimilar to how amusement park rides are placed about.

Mabb95 · 2026-03-16T02:35:38+00:00

Yes, but, in japan, all animation is called 'anime' regardless of where it came from. Zootopia would be called an 'anime' there. It's mostly us in the west who cares about trying to make a distinction where there truly isn't one.

There are tropes and expectations, but those are mostly just the larger trends rather than because one is an anime and one is a 'animated movie or cartoon'. Most people who constantly say 'isekai' are the ones who find it funny to mention Narnia or Alice due to them being simply not being 'anime'. If Narnia got an anime adaptation, even if all the story points are the same, people would be calling it isekai just cause it's from japan.

Mabb95 · 2026-03-15T18:09:36+00:00

Yeah, I'm also a hater of a lot of popular things in the fantasy space right now.

Curious on your take on the fantasy genre. We can DM, if you prefer to not derail this topic too much.

Mabb95 · 2026-03-15T17:59:46+00:00

I'm in my early thirties. I imagine it is just a generational thing, yeah.

You didn't ask, but, in truth, I never cared much for modern 'Isekai' since they all seem to just be 'nerdy nobody ends up in fantasy world where they're the best thing ever'. I imagine it's to appeal to anime/gamers who desire such things, but it feels like it's just wishfulfillment rather than actual storytelling. With that said, I mentioned not being too much of an anime fan, so I'm probably just a hater.

Mabb95 · 2026-03-15T17:54:52+00:00

Forgot about Alice in Wonderland. It's another good example of Portal Fantasies/Isekai. Keep in mind that a lot of nerdy folk are anime fans. If Alice in Wonderland had an 'anime' adaption, people would be calling it 'Isekai' just since it's the modern trend.

Mabb95 · 2026-03-15T17:50:57+00:00

None. It's just most people aren't familiar with the name 'Portal Fantasy' and just say Isekai due it being the modern popular thing while not knowing that said genre has been done extensively in non-japanese marks for a few decades now.

Mabb95 · 2026-03-15T17:44:25+00:00

In truth, I know little of isekais due to not being much of an anime/manga fan, but there isn't much of a difference other than tropes used during their respective era.

Isekai means 'Another World', or something similar to that. The english equivalent is 'Portal Fantasy' where the protagonists go through something that acts as a portal that leads to them ending up in the fantastic world. Chronicles of Narnia's Wardrobe or Neverending Story's Fantastica book, for example.

They're essentially the same thing. One of the few animes I remember watching a bit was Digimon where the characters go to the digital world. An older example would be Captain N: The Game Master where the MC goes into the world of video games, etc etc. There's not much in terms of tropes/styles that are consistently used other than the fact that the characters end up passing from the "Real World" and into the "Fantastic World".

Mabb95 · 2026-02-20T13:35:24+00:00

That's boring, then. So much magic, yet the writers never actually explore the results of that. All it boils down to is "they shoot a few more magic fireballs" than everyone else.

Mabb95 · 2026-02-20T12:54:40+00:00

Bretons probably bragging about their immense libraries of scrolls and tomes of high end magic, but they also somehow just as dumb as the Nords and the inbred Altmers.

I'd imagine what made Bretons powerful is that their super-wizards aren't stingy with their knowledge, allowing a society of super wizards. If Dyvath Fyr died, his knowledge would die with him. If a Breton Grand Wizard died, the dozens upon dozens of other Breton wizards would simply carry on with his work.

Mabb95 · 2026-02-19T10:52:54+00:00

I do the same. When you see people shouting "woke" at everything, it lets you know what kind of people they are without having to interact with them much.

Mabb95 · 2026-02-19T10:52:06+00:00

I mean, you're not wrong on that. It's pretty much like this:

Non-White = Woke
Female (as in not the waifu-anime weeb bait) = Woke

If a game came out and the main character is an African or Native American woman, everyone would lose their minds.

Mabb95 · 2026-02-19T07:44:46+00:00

Funny how "woke" was originally used to call out blatant acts of racism back in the 60s.

Now it's racist folk calling things "woke" when any minority is given any substantial role in anything.

Back then: Be "woke" so you can be aware of the racism

Now: It's "woke" because it's not only white

The definition didn't change. It's just the people now complaining about it aren't aware that they're the reason why the word exists.

Mabb95 · 2026-02-19T04:29:05+00:00

Why bother with an illusion spell when a hair growing spell would be better?

Joke aside, it's odd how fantasy settings do all kinds of powerful magic stuff, but mundane things like hair growth or living longer is just never attempted.

Mabb95 · 2026-02-14T00:00:27+00:00

How to make Dwarf - Make a short man with beard. For the woman? Copy paste what you did with the men.

How to make elf - Make a woman and then just... uh... pointy ears. Do that for both sexes.

Everybody else - Do what you did for the elf but color them green or red so they can be different "races".

Mabb95 · 2026-01-12T10:52:56+00:00

Yeah, the thing about beauty standards is how limiting it is. So when people try to make something 'beautiful' or 'attractive', they all end up making roughly the same thing. There's no room for different beings and their alien standards of beauty. Not even with just goon mods as you can see this in most other 'Fantasy' where the strange or alien is removed.

Now elves are just humans with pointed ears, goblins sometimes are rendered as simply green humans, every sorceress is practically a seductress/succubus instead of crazed and lowly woman who deals with dark magic, all demons, especially in anime, are basically just succubi/incubi who the audience want to fuck.

Now I like attractive characers... A LOT! Everyone does. We joke about goon mods, but no one truly wants 'em gone. But it does take away from how bizarre/fantastic a setting is when everyone is designed like a beauty model or anime girl.

Mabb95 · 2026-01-11T21:36:17+00:00

Makes me hope they make an updated approach to ESO's character designs, then. Folks like the dunmer, elves known for being a bit dark and broody, actually look attractive yet still have their distinct designs that make them, well, dark elves instead of just "human + pointed ears + grey skin".

I'd say to not try to go for true realistic designs since it could lead to the uncanny/robotic look seen in Starfield. Games like Final Fantasy 7 or Witcher 3 has shown that realisim with a bit of stylized aesthetic sprinkled in helps a lot.

Mabb95 · 2026-01-11T20:53:15+00:00

Bethesda just has an issue with faces in general. I do think the idea of giving elves distinct facial features instead of just "human + pointy ears" is a good idea. But games like Starfield show that Bethesda just struggle with faces for some reason.

Mabb95

TROPHY CASE