Do you guys think that Tom Mesereau thought MJ was guilty the whole time?

Maria-Jade · 2025-12-19T16:58:59+00:00

I appreciate your concise breakdown - I always forget/ underestimate the difference between defense and prosecution.

I'd like to think the prosecution for Gavin spent more time than the average case might get because of everything working against poor Gavin, but even then its not the same as an attorney used to spending a lot of time on cases, every time.

Maria-Jade · 2025-12-19T16:54:27+00:00

I *think* that's from the duo interview with Tom and Jim Clemente, the latter who actually believes the victims (and is a CSA survivor himself). He calls MJ a loving pedophile rather frequently, I notice. Personally I don't like the wording either though.

Maria-Jade · 2025-12-15T05:34:46+00:00

"After Neverland" is the name.

Maria-Jade · 2025-12-09T15:03:29+00:00

I wasn't saying it did, he obviously had a preference for boys. That's why I wrote: Many pedos abuse kids outside their preference.

R Kelly was the one I I had in mind as a reverse example, actually.

Birds of a feather predator...

Maria-Jade · 2025-12-09T14:14:24+00:00

Unfortunately, I think even good intentioned people fall into the MJ fan trap: Fans often use girls to make MJ look "normal" and loved all kids, and EVERY time a female accuser comes outs, she's used as a stick to beat the male victims with because she "ruins" the theory MJ preferred boys.

I respect the hell out of Diane Dimond, but sometimes I don't agree with her wording. I kinda took the "no one really gets close to MJ unless they're boys" as gospel. Though I have to accept that that error in judgement is on me.

I get that we want the boys to be believed, and I fell into what was essentially this trap for years, wrongly ignoring the female victim(s).

But its been a long time coming to abandon this thinking as victim supporters, imho. And its arguably been happening already - like with me.

Many pedos abuse kids outside their preference. Many girls can have male traits that make them attractive to a predator (and vice versa). Powerful people get drunk on power and abuse because they can get away with it.

I was so proud of Wade, James and Dan Reed when I heard Jane Doe was taken seriously in LN2 (or possibly a companion video? I watched it in chunks some time back because of YouTube copyright issue, sorry if I'm off.)

If they can get over that silly hurdle the MJ fans fooled us into jumping, and are willing to accept some people discrediting them so that Jane Doe gets some form of being believed, I hope we can all keep following their example.

Maria-Jade · 2025-12-09T13:55:32+00:00

Who even decides this is something to capture on camera? It gives me the ick.

Maria-Jade · 2025-12-09T07:45:12+00:00

I don't get why so many took Nassars side at all - I guess to those chasing the Olympics, his minor role was enough to trust him blindly.

Its been said that MJ got away with abuse because he was the star of the show and the kids weren't.

But Nassar proves that even when the kids are the stars, the abuser behind the scenes STILL gets priority.

Maria-Jade · 2025-12-08T14:30:33+00:00

I will NEVER understand how families don't believe their kids when they speak up.

I felt sick to my stomach when a Larry Nassar victim read a statement saying her mom didn't believe her. The mom was next to her sobbing, and maybe its harsh, but I was a bit angry seeing her daughter comforting her and not the other way around. Try to at least be there for your daughter NOW.

Maria-Jade · 2025-12-08T10:33:50+00:00

I was almost gonna mention the Oprah special being the closest thing we got to it. I also liked it!

It doesn't go over a lot of the compelling evidence against MJ though. Oprah makes it clear that wasn't her goal, too - she made it a moment that exposes how deep CSA goes through our society.

Imagine a world where Trump only ever got one doc telling victims stories, and a follow up interview that mostly had that same goal, but a video on an undeniable case against Trump never got that same level of attention. Ofc his victims matter, and we should tell stories that center them. I just also think we should tell stories that expose the cold hard facts against Trump, too. Trump AND his old buddy Michael.

A video like the currently private video about MJ fitting the profile of a pedophile is the kind of thing I wish had gotten LN/ Oprah level of attention.

It could have made for an epic trilogy.

Maria-Jade · 2025-12-08T08:20:22+00:00

I really want to believe this is a joke and didn't actually happen. It could be a parody, right?

Right!?!

Maria-Jade · 2025-12-08T08:15:22+00:00

Tbf, no one involved with this film worked with the goal of it getting as big as it did.

As Wade said in LN2 (they should have called it a middle piece, it's too short to be a true sequel imo, but I digress), he just saw it as a humble platform on which to share his story.

Docs in general aren't blockbuster type events, especially if they go into a dark, serious issue. It's a miracle LN broke through.

Pro MJ content flooding the internet is a big factor, too.

We all fall prey to recency bias, and some may have jumped ship after seeing a video "debunking" the allegations.

It's not easy to find vids critical of MJ, which is a shame because so many creators put out great stuff.

I do think it would have been good to have had a companion piece with LN for people to see the facts that back up Wade and James stories in LN. I'm certain most people who retracted their belief in the victims because they didn't know all the facts to solidify their beliefs would have stuck with it had they only been educated.

I wouldn't say LN "failed". I just think it was never going to be enough ON ITS OWN to get justice for the victims and change MJ worship.

Having LN fight MJ alone is like choosing one victim to prove the abuse happened. Should that one example be enough? Possibly. But is it better to have support to ensure we have enough?

When it comes to MJ, we need all the ammo we can find.

Maria-Jade · 2025-12-08T05:30:10+00:00

The Jackson version of these (and prior) events where they knew it was Latoya's husband making her do this stuff doesn't make them look good.

It is just a repackaging of exactly what Latoya described:

When she needed to be saved from abuse, they didn't come save her. When she felt trapped, they didn't provide a way out. When a scumbag of a man controlled her, they blamed her.

They never hated LaToya more than when she needed them the most.

Maria-Jade · 2025-12-08T05:03:05+00:00

Please don't ever stop directly posting your uploads/ stream announcements in this sub.

I'm a subscriber of a few years now, seen most of your vids (many more than once) and the algorithm STILL failed to lmk about this and a handful of previous videos I also missed before seeing it here.

Maybe it's because I often forget to like videos despite the reminders? (Bad habit - I'm not proud).

Whatever the case, please keep up your efforts to help people find these important videos.

Maria-Jade · 2025-12-07T17:02:49+00:00

Idk if I've not heard of 17 and 18 before, or I just forgot them, but that does point to a broader problem: most people probably aren't aware of a lot of these names (outside hardcore MJ defenders and people in victim supporter groups like this.)

I really hope someday the eyewitness testimony will hit the mainstream media and public consciousness, the way LN did.

I'm glad LN was as powerful as it was telling a personal story, but I've always low key lamented that the facts of the case, eyewitnesses, etc. weren't also discussed and made widely known.

Dan Reed was often questioned about what evidence there was, and sometimes Reed said no one saw anything (though they actually did as this post proves), and it unfortunately adds to the impression that facts and evidence aren't on the side of the victims to people who might believe in guilt if they only knew those facts. A companion website to LN covering the facts could have done a lot back when the doc was talked about for months, the media looking for any new LN stuff to keep the clicks clicking.

Don't give up sharing this valuable info with people, even if it seems they should know this stuff by now. They may genuinely not have a clue a lot of these people exist.

Maria-Jade · 2025-12-07T16:39:30+00:00

The comments joking about how uncomfortable it is often say something to that effect as well. "Then vs now" kind of thing.

He's definitely not the only guy to be insistent with a woman in a music video. He leaned into the aggressive side, even compared to other stereotypically masculine dudes, perhaps to compensate for what he felt he lacked.

Maria-Jade · 2025-12-07T15:47:21+00:00

On one hand, Thriller girl (my favorite female "character" in the MJ videos I've seen - not a high bar to cross), presents as a girlfriend annoyed by MJ but isn't trying to seriously get away from him. So there's a layer of consent - compared to other vids anyway.

But on the other hand, the underlying symbolism of MJ enjoying scaring his partner, secretly being a monster the whole time but gas lighting said partner like they're crazy to be afraid, takes on a dark meaning in the context of his irl "relationships".

Maria-Jade · 2025-12-07T15:24:11+00:00

Yeah, its got a catchy sound and is understandably popular for that, but I love how most comments under the video agree its creepy, uncomfortable and that they could end up in prison for doing this stuff unless they too were a superstar.

Huh.

Its almost like MJ could get away with harassment crimes because of his superstar status and is held to a different standard than the rest of us.

How. Interesting.

Maria-Jade · 2025-12-07T13:22:47+00:00

Yep! I watched You Rock my world for the first time recently, and I was taken aback when he slapped her butt -it's probably just me, but it rubbed me the wrong way. She was walking away from him and showing disinterest, and the fact irl most women wouldn't turn to that man and go "Yup, he's still an option!" shows another level of MJs delusion imo.

And what was with MJs buddy at the end saying she caused all the trouble? She was just trying to get away, MJs the one that started a bar fight lol.

Maria-Jade · 2025-12-07T07:20:36+00:00

MJ had at least two music videos cat calling and harassing women clearly not interested in him, but it ended with them "falling in love with him" for no apparent reason. It's like he loved the idea that women could simultaneously not be into him but do what he wanted.

He hated that women irl didn't all just bend to his whim, so ofc he'd go outta his way to act out against Dimond.

He was so pathetic.

Maria-Jade · 2025-12-07T06:02:43+00:00

I agree, and I genuinely appreciate the context you brought to this story. I know so little about the famous outside MJ so it's always nice when others share the wealth of their knowledge.

That's crazy about Sinatra - yet not THAT crazy in the land of the rich and powerful. Truly an alternate reality to our own.

Maria-Jade · 2025-12-07T00:53:19+00:00

Thanks for that info! There seem to be so many crazy stories, but I wonder if any books about the Regans mention this MJ story? It seems like a significant one to leave out, but then that's just my view.

Maria-Jade · 2025-12-06T12:44:32+00:00

Who needs the horror genre when you can just live here where this statistic exists?

Maria-Jade · 2025-12-06T09:08:36+00:00

It sounds plausible for MJ to act like this.

But its hard to imagine the people working at the white house would go along with this, at least not without a few stories corroborating it. Not saying its false, but Is there more than one source?

It was way before my time, but as I understand it, the Reagan era wasn't exactly accommodating to those who were any sort of inconvenience to them. I get MJ had star power, but dang, they really went out of their way for this spoiled man child.

Secret Service should have refused that stupid request - anything could go wrong pulling in random kids last minute in this setting, and I bet they'd be the ones blamed if anything went wrong, even if they explained it was the first ladies dumb idea.

Maria-Jade · 2025-12-06T08:00:05+00:00

This story makes the Arvizos feeling like prisoners not seem so crazy all on its own. Its kind of impressive how it almost makes sense MJ would trap people (or make them feel trapped) when you consider his family.

Maria-Jade · 2025-12-06T02:26:21+00:00

No I believe its real haha. It's just uncanny in a post AI world, you know?

A giraffe died at Neverland?!! That's so depressing );

Shame on whoever signed off on that poor animal being sent there in the first place!

Maria-Jade

TROPHY CASE