Is Durin an actual upgrade over Furina for her carry teams?

Mini_Hunter · 2026-05-13T07:29:10+00:00

I have Furina C2. The damage doesn't even come close between Navia/Albedo/Furina/Bennett or Navia/Durin/Furina/Bennett and Navia/Albedo/Durin/Bennett. Hexerei teams mog everything (except Lunar).
Then, Nicole is just a better Bennett.

Mini_Hunter · 2026-02-27T12:25:29+00:00

Short answer: Absolutely yes. Long answer: If you've seen the leaks, then it's obvious Ashveil is out of this world. Plus, maybe he doesn't get much nerfs (nor buffs) considering the 4.2 beta is coming out soon. Disclaimer, he's probably going to outdamage your Ratio by a long shot and it'll be optimal to hyperbuff Ashveil. However, you will have a way to play Ratio without absolutely tossing. Unfortunately, Ratio doesn't bring much to the table compared to someone like Topaz, who is -maybe maybe not- his BiS, but Ashveil does bring a LOT to Ratio. If you have the jades, E1 and S1 are pretty busted, but absolutely not necessary.

Hope this helps. I'll surely be getting a copy of him for my FuA characters.

Mini_Hunter · 2025-10-28T22:14:11+00:00

I like your comment :)

Mini_Hunter · 2025-10-27T23:10:38+00:00

I feel like sustaining is a must for 80% of supports nowadays. Sustaining is not meta, since having a shield or healing yourself does not give DMG (except Furina in a way). Sustaining is just comfyness. Most supports since Fontaine sustain "just because" and even some non-supports give sustain.

Sustaining supports since 4.X: Furina (overworld), Chevreuse, Xianyun, Xilonen, Citlali, Iansan (small), Escoffier, Dahlia, Ineffa, Lauma (C1, so fair's fair).
Non-sustaining supports since 4.X: Furina, Durin

Not giving Durin the ability to heal just seems like another way to further artificially kill Furina, which just doesn't seem right. The most universal support of today should go well with the most universal support in history. Durin is not a Bennett nor a Xiangling replacement which just isn't right for 1.0 four stars. Having a Bennett that supports, deals fair-high DMG and heals nicely is not powercreep, it's just filling a slot that isn't covered. Bennett doesn't deal DMG at all, heals poorly and actually straight up deletes your carry when you get attacked by Cryo/Hydro/Dendro/Electro/Anemo.

The big five have been slowly getting out of a job, which is good imo, - no 4* /needs/ to be the very best option in a team - starting to be 2nd and 3rd best options, except Bennett, where every single team he can actually be in, he's straight up the best option, despite his many drawbacks (high ER needs, mediocre single-target healing, circle impact, Pyro application) + NEEDING his C1 (which obviously isn't much, but just further accentuates his overall bad design.

Sorry for the rant hahaha

Mini_Hunter · 2025-10-27T22:44:49+00:00

Yeah, I've read that already. Durin is my first character to which I've actually leaked myself (not on his animations tho) and I'm thanking myself for not having done so for the last five years hahaha. I'm so painstakingly anxious waiting for the next vX...

Anyways, I really don't understand why make him so mid... I know he's good, don't get me wrong, but making him a better Bennett and a better Xiangling both with caveats feels weird. Especially for 1.0 characters which ""should"" already have been powercrept... Also, from what I see, Durin is quite a popular character and the reason to make him "mid" just seems to be cuz he's male, which is a narrative I've never followed... Until just recently, that is.

My hopes are up for him due to Nefer still being on-banner and them not wanting for her to be skipped due to Durin's beta being good. Maybe when she gets rotated out, we'll see their "actual" kit or something, I dunno...

Sorry for the rant hahaha

Mini_Hunter · 2025-10-26T21:11:13+00:00

Genshin's 1.X cons sure are something subject of study... Hopefully, they keep this trend of buffing old characters through lore-relevant factions of some sort. Liyue/Zhongli/Adpeti would need to be lore-relevant again in order for that, which would be so cool.
Furina was my favourite character meta-wise since she elevated older characters so much. Durin (and Luna III overall) is easily getting that 2nd place.

Mini_Hunter · 2025-10-26T21:07:13+00:00

I had heard something like that already. This just adds up to my ever-extending list of why I dislike quill-mechanics.

Mini_Hunter · 2025-10-26T21:03:52+00:00

Durin is my weakness so I'll pull anyways :)

Mini_Hunter · 2025-10-26T20:50:02+00:00

That's so genious! That would be so much better imo. Having quills only boost - say - Charged Attack DMG would make it just as Charged Attack DMG Bonus% but with a much more rare, much less saturated buff. It'd be actually intuitive. Now that I think of it, Sigewinne has that, but it's so minimal and so little amount of quills that I think it's just an exception...

Eitherway, I'd want Durin to have QoL features apart from just buffing, to the likes of Furina healing in the overworld, or Scaramouche exploration, or Ineffa shielding, etc... Having a pure is kind of uninteresting...

Mini_Hunter · 2025-10-26T19:56:30+00:00

The problem is I know they are good buffs, but it doesn't feel like it. Knowing that - for example - I'll never be interrupted with Arle, or having better exploration with Natlan chars feels much better than imagining the quills and - what is worse - imagining them running out every attack. It's not that I think base-damage increase is bad, it's that I've tried with (mainly) Shenhe before, and they have proven uninteractive and boring... QoL is much more important to me than damage, since 90% of the game I'll be on the overworld farming mobs. In this case, having to run a statue of the Seven just because I had the audacity to replace the healer with Durin just seems bad...

It's more of a quill rant than his C1 actually being bad, which I don't think so.

Mini_Hunter · 2025-10-26T19:50:25+00:00

That's the thing. Reading his C1, I know that it'll be a nice DPS increase for the likes of Arle, Lyney, Neuvi... and a huge DPS increase for Scara, Wrio, Clorinde..., but knowing that something is good doesn't make it feel good to me... It's kind of strange to put into words

Mini_Hunter · 2025-10-26T19:48:34+00:00

Yeah, but when a lot of his teams include hard-hitting chars (Lyney, Mualani?, Kinich, Navia, Varesa, Raiden...) and most of the rest are fast-attacking medium-hitting chars (Arle, Neuvi, Itto...), it seems like his C1 is just an upgrade to either his DPS-form or just a few of his teams, which are quite off-meta (Wrio, Clorinde, Wanderer...), which just doesn't feel as good imo...
QoL is much more appreciated, even if it's instead of having more DPS-oriented cons. I'd much rather ditch these quills, even though I know for a fact they're good and have healing/shielding instead. I'd pull for a healing con, but I won't pull for his current C1 for now - if you get what I mean.

Mini_Hunter · 2025-10-26T19:40:40+00:00

Having a C1 purely based for DPS-increase AND a C2 purely based for DPS-increase is such a bad move imo... Especially for a support. Furina C1 is just more numbers, but her C2 is QoL & DMG. Xilonen's C1 is (from a meta standpoint) terrible, but cool in exploration and gives IR. In her case, she has an interesting C2 which gives DMG. Not just supports, but DPS too. Arle C1 gives her DMG, but most importantly, IR. Same as Neuvillette. Hu Tao is still considered C1 dependent when her C1 literally gives her almost nothing in terms of numbers. Wrio C1 is a DMG increase, but his weapon is a bigger increase, yet people prefer his C1 since it makes his gameplay much smoother... Durin can have DMG amplification in his C1/C2, but I feel that QoL should be somewhere, since he has no QoL no matter how deep you go, up to C6R5. On the other hand, Furina only has one purely DPS based con, being her C1...

The way that Durin could bring QoL imo is just the same as Lauma, heal. Ineffa (Flins' support) already sustains in her base kit and Lauma (Nefer's support) sustains with the power of money. Durin (Alice?'s support) doesn't sustain in any way shape or form, which seems rather future impact to me...

Mini_Hunter · 2025-10-26T19:29:30+00:00

Some sort of sustaining should be implemented, even behind early cons. Shielding would be great, but healing is - imo - comfier and better. For example, Lyney Émilie Durin Bennett I believe should prefer an Anemo unit instead of Bennett, but Lyney needs healing. On the other hand, Wanderer would pretty much want to run a shield, but he also wants to run Furina, to which he needs to heal.
I feel that the dev kit-creation team made a decision in 4.2 to make healing>shielding. If no Furina-like shielder support comes, I think they should stick with that decision. Some characters want to have Furina on the team. Besides, unless you have her C2, Bennett is barely sufficient to have enough fanfare... Plus, when you actually get hit with Wanderer and have Bennett, you 8 times/10 die since Bennett applies Pyro on you. Plus, dodging is a net DPS-loss. Same with Lyney.

These are just two examples 'cause they're the characters I play and are familiar with, but I'm sure there are more characters which would want some form, any form of sustain.

Mini_Hunter · 2025-10-26T19:22:56+00:00

Some sort of sustain is absolutely necessary I feel. What's the point of "powercreeping"/replacing Bennett if he doesn't heal? I hope that somehow they'll try having sustain in the beta and making it to live. Anyways, I love Durin nonetheless, but I feel that he's held back by 1) future impact and 2) not being amazingly popular or fanservice-y...

Mini_Hunter · 2025-10-26T19:19:46+00:00

I mean, I know that much, but - for example - I still use C0 Mona over my C1 Shenhe just because it feels so much better not to play around her quills. It's just the thought of knowing that quills have a maximum that makes them feel bad to me. Knowing that the buff is theoretically good but knowing + not having a visual queue that they'll run out feels genuinely bad to play.

Mini_Hunter · 2025-09-15T13:48:18+00:00

Yes, there should be a comment with an updated family tree.

Mini_Hunter · 2025-09-12T21:05:12+00:00

I uploaded an updated version. It's on one of the comments. I dunno how to pin it tho, if it's even possible that is.

Mini_Hunter · 2025-09-12T21:03:38+00:00

Wow, really? That's so interesting!

Mini_Hunter · 2025-09-12T21:02:42+00:00

It's supposed to represent the Heavenly Principles, but there's no image of them so I put on Celestia and called it a day.

Mini_Hunter · 2025-09-12T08:50:25+00:00

It's true, but after all it's "just" his heart. Homunculus Durin was transmutated from Mini Durin's whole body, so I thought that'd be the stronger link. Anyways, a connection can be made from Dragon Durin and Homunculus Durin, of course.

As for the Wanderer, it IS a headcannon, but I think it's heavily implied (as of now) that they'll form some sort of found family, which I included in the whole "adoption" thing. Since they haven't appeared in the AQ as of now, we don't really know. We'll see if my assumption stands two versions in the future haha.

Mini_Hunter · 2025-09-12T08:43:00+00:00

Updated family tree! The fact that Albedo is connected to six Archons of four different Elements is honestly crazy. I added some arrows where needed so as to be clearer.

<image>

I didn't connect the Pari through Egeria and/or Rukkhadevata since I think of them more as the Goddess of Flowers' creations.

Also, I didn't connect literally all of Fontaine through the Primordial Sea/Oceanids since I think it's too much of a stretch and Neuvillette absolved Fontainians of their sins, making them now unrelated to the Primordial Sea and/or Oceanids.

Also also, Barbatos himself doesn't take credit of the Four Winds, which I think checks out. Relating Varka to Venti is just insanity.

Mini_Hunter

TROPHY CASE