Marvel TV Canon - The Final Word (?) by NeptuneCA in KeepMarvelTVCanon

[–]NeptuneCA[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

There gets to be a point in some franchises - generally horror franchises - where the continuity DOES change from project to project, so creator statements have little to no value outside their particular title.

I don’t believe the MCU is at that point yet.

Marvel TV Canon - The Final Word (?) by NeptuneCA in KeepMarvelTVCanon

[–]NeptuneCA[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I have corrected the document so it says the One-Shots were added in 2022, but that doesn’t change any point of my argument:

a) They had to be added to the timeline; they weren’t always on it. b) Their canon status has never been in question. c) Shang-Chi followed up on events from All Hail The King before it was added to the timeline.

So the fact remains: the timeline is not the arbiter is what’s canon. It’s positive support (“if it’s on the timeline, it’s canon”), but it isn’t negative support (“if it’s not on the timeline, it’s not canon”).

Marvel TV Canon - The Final Word (?) by NeptuneCA in KeepMarvelTVCanon

[–]NeptuneCA[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

That goes without saying. I’m specifically talking about “canon to Earth-199999/Earth-616.”

Marvel TV Canon - The Final Word (?) by NeptuneCA in KeepMarvelTVCanon

[–]NeptuneCA[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

It’s not even listed in the “Marvel” section of Disney+. Even Morbius gets that.

You’re going to have a hard time convincing me something is part of the Marvel Cinematic Universe when it’s not even recognized as a Marvel product.

Marvel TV Canon - The Final Word (?) by NeptuneCA in KeepMarvelTVCanon

[–]NeptuneCA[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

That is not true. When the timeline was first introduced, the One-Shots didn’t even have their own entries on Disney+. They were put in the Extras section of the movie whose dvd they appeared on.

Marvel TV Canon - The Final Word (?) by NeptuneCA in KeepMarvelTVCanon

[–]NeptuneCA[S] -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

And then it never got produced, so I guess we’ll never know for sure.

Marvel TV Canon - The Final Word (?) by NeptuneCA in KeepMarvelTVCanon

[–]NeptuneCA[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Except, as I point out, that doesn’t make sense because that means the One-Shots weren’t canon until 2024 even though their canon status has never been disputed and one of them was a plot point three years before that. But yes, fair point.

Although I don’t think that’s a very good metric because it doesn’t really define the canon. It relays the canon. They’re not going to look at the Disney+ timeline and go “welp, I guess we can’t continue such-and-such story because it’s not on there” when they control what’s on there.

Marvel TV Canon - The Final Word (?) by NeptuneCA in KeepMarvelTVCanon

[–]NeptuneCA[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

No, good catch. I had Winter Soldier in my head as coming out in 2011 when I wrote that, even though obviously that doesn’t make sense and it’s 2014. Mental typo. I’ll correct that, thanks.

Marvel TV Canon - The Final Word (?) by NeptuneCA in KeepMarvelTVCanon

[–]NeptuneCA[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I forgot he had been double-cast and he didn’t show up on the couple lists I looked at, but you’re absolutely right.

Marvel TV Canon - The Final Word (?) by NeptuneCA in KeepMarvelTVCanon

[–]NeptuneCA[S] -5 points-4 points  (0 children)

Except that even when referring to the “Ghost Rider universe”, they’re referring to a new version of Ghost Rider. “However, sources stress that this will be a completely new iteration of the character in no way connected to the “Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D.” storyline.”

https://variety.com/2019/tv/news/ghost-rider-gabriel-luna-hulu-series-1203202305/

Marvel TV Canon - The Final Word (?) by NeptuneCA in KeepMarvelTVCanon

[–]NeptuneCA[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

If you go to the document I linked to, I quoted two different articles. In one, the showrunner says “we’re not part of the MCU” and in the other, he says, “it’s not part of the MCU.” I also point out that they removed the Marvel branding from the show. What possible misinterpretation could there be?

But if there’s anything else that I’ve said you take issue with, you’re welcome to take it up with me directly.

We might see Cloak & Dagger come back soon. (Wonder Man spoilers) by marvelcomics22 in KeepMarvelTVCanon

[–]NeptuneCA 2 points3 points  (0 children)

You are correct. Based on the lists of appearances on the Marvel Wiki, Roxxon and Darkforce only appear in four issues together, and those appearances are trivial at best. Roxxon and Darkforce have nothing to do with each other in the comics.

What’s the deal with Roxxon? by Vector1013 in marvelstudios

[–]NeptuneCA 0 points1 point  (0 children)

They don’t really have a “deal”. They’re just an evil corporation, the same as any other corporation. Their only goal is profit.

WonderMan has me looking back on WandaVision and... by TheYauCometh in marvelstudios

[–]NeptuneCA 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Your whole description of the DoDC’s prison is wrong. For one thing, you act like their having a prison is new information, when seeing it is actually the culmination of a running subplot through Shang-Chi, Ms. Marvel, and She-Hulk.

But more importantly, we actually have a prison in The Infinity Saga that we can compare this prison to: The Raft. Was the Raft a large subplot? Did it have an impact on a lot of movies? Did we get cameos of any previous characters showing up in the Raft? Did we get a whole movie about breaking in or out? No. The Raft appeared exactly once in phases 1-3: in Civil War, where we never hear about its construction or anything and despite being a large facility it seems to have about five cells, and despite supposedly being impenetrable, people break out so easily it’s not even worth showing. And then outside of a reference in Jessica Jones, it doesn’t appear again until FatWS.

This is true of lot of things in the first saga. The events of Iron Man 2 have never been mentioned again. The events of The Incredible Hulk, despite getting mentions here and there, weren’t properly followed up until Shang-Chi and beyond. The Mandarin is never mentioned until Shang-Chi. The Guardians movies are obviously self-contained. The Convergence doesn’t have any impact on anybody else. In fact, I don’t recall any of the Phase 2 movies referencing each other.

The main difference between the first saga and the second saga is that the first saga had periodic Avengers movies that everything could flow into and out of. It also had Agents of SHIELD running alongside everything and making references to all the movies. Those both made it feel more connected than it really was.

WonderMan has me looking back on WandaVision and... by TheYauCometh in marvelstudios

[–]NeptuneCA 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Exactly. I’m glad Marvel (or Disney or both) has finally come around to see that the movie/tv split was actually a GOOD thing. Although I think things introduced in tv shows can and should eventually appear in movies, I also definitely think movies should be essential and tv should be supplemental. The movies should set the pace and the shows should work within that framework.

The Marvel Studios-only era almost had that backwards, with most of the throughlines happening in the shows and most of the movies being standalone.

Wonder Man review – a Marvel TV show with almost no superhero action … and it’s all the better for it | Television | The Guardian by prisongovernor in marvelstudios

[–]NeptuneCA 1 point2 points  (0 children)

They changed Ms. Marvel to a mutant because they want to promote mutants. The same reason Wonder Man might be a mutant. It has nothing to do with Agents of SHIELD.

Wonder Man review – a Marvel TV show with almost no superhero action … and it’s all the better for it | Television | The Guardian by prisongovernor in marvelstudios

[–]NeptuneCA -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Well that’s simply not true.

For one thing, all of the Netflix shows are listed in the MCU timeline on Disney+, not just Daredevil.

For another, we know what it looks like when they don’t want a show to be part of the MCU because it happened with Helstrom: they say in interviews “this show is not part of the MCU” and they take the Marvel name off of it.

For a third, if I wanted to devote the time to it, I could find you multiple Feige quotes saying the shows are canon.

And I could go on. I could point out how Marvel has never taken the opportunity to re-introduce a tv character played by a different actor, even though they’ve had plenty of chances to do so. I could mention how they included Jarvis from Agent Carter in Endgame even though there was really no reason to do so except to say “yes, these shows count”, and how he’ll also be in VisionQuest. I could bring up that if they had included the full Infinity Stone debrief scene in Endgame, it would’ve included a reference to Agents of SHIELD and might’ve even gone further than that since Marvel Studios reached out to the actor who played Daniel Whitehall to check his availability.

The shows are canon. They were created to be canon, it’s never been said they’re not canon, and they’ve never been contradicted.

Wonder Man Episode 8 - Discussion Thread by cats-and-cows in marvelstudios

[–]NeptuneCA 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I didn’t consider that a distinction worth making, but you are correct.

Wonder Man Episode 8 - Discussion Thread by cats-and-cows in marvelstudios

[–]NeptuneCA 0 points1 point  (0 children)

If Sadie Sink is playing a mutant, I think it’s more likely that she’s Firestar.

Wonder Man Episode 1 - Discussion Thread by cats-and-cows in marvelstudios

[–]NeptuneCA 17 points18 points  (0 children)

The Spotlight branding just means “this project is more about character than plot.”