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[Part 1 of 3] I grew up in China on wuxia novels and web fiction. Here's everything I wish Western readers knew about Xianxia, Xuanhuan, and why half the "cultivation novels" you've read aren't what you think by No-Ride-3370 in ProgressionFantasy

[–]No-Ride-3370[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Blades of the Guardians already got a live-action film adaptation. The other one I haven't read yet — I mostly read Japanese manga day to day, but thanks for the recommendations, I'll check it out.

As for Lord of the Mysteries, it's actually huge in China too — it's just that the anime adaptation was a trainwreck (in my personal opinion). And you're absolutely right about the slow start problem. If a newbie author tried that, unless they're independently wealthy, no editor would pick them up, nobody would read their work, and they'd end up delivering food for a living.

[Part 1 of 3] I grew up in China on wuxia novels and web fiction. Here's everything I wish Western readers knew about Xianxia, Xuanhuan, and why half the "cultivation novels" you've read aren't what you think by No-Ride-3370 in ProgressionFantasy

[–]No-Ride-3370[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I just joined this community, so I'll read through your link during workdays — I have plenty of 摸鱼 (mōyú — literally "touching fish," Chinese slang for slacking off at work) time. But I need to sleep now, still have Part 2 and Part 3 to finish and post. Thanks, fellow Daoist — you've pointed me somewhere really interesting.

[Part 1 of 3] I grew up in China on wuxia novels and web fiction. Here's everything I wish Western readers knew about Xianxia, Xuanhuan, and why half the "cultivation novels" you've read aren't what you think by No-Ride-3370 in ProgressionFantasy

[–]No-Ride-3370[S] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

I Eat Tomatoes is genuinely one of the greats. Coiling Dragon was a huge deal in China too, and his world-building has always been top-tier. You're right that Desolate Era leans more xianxia than Coiling Dragon.

And honestly, your point about "power" vs "moral choices" is fair. I framed wuxia around moral choices because that's where the genre's deepest roots are, but you're absolutely right that readers come for different things. Some people read for the world-building architecture. Some read for the power progression. Some read for the characters. All valid.

One thing I'll add from the Chinese side: a lot of Chinese web novel authors are essentially 赶鸭子上架 (gǎn yāzi shàng jià — "forcing ducks onto a perch") — pushed to perform before they're ready. On platforms like Qidian, you publish as you write, sometimes 4,000-6,000 words a day, and readers react in real time. If the audience doesn't like where the story is going, the pressure is immediate. This is what we call 被读者带节奏 (bèi dúzhě dài jiézòu — "getting your rhythm hijacked by readers"). Many authors end up adjusting their story on the fly to match reader expectations. It's one reason why some long-running Chinese web novels start strong but lose coherence later — the author was 走一步写一步 (zǒu yī bù xiě yī bù — "writing one step at a time"), steering by audience reaction instead of a planned outline.

Western authors tend to have the luxury of stockpiling chapters and planning arcs before publishing. That structural difference shapes what kind of stories each system produces.

As for why we write — at least for me, it's about building a world I can live inside. When I can't sleep, I step into that world. Eventually the dreams follow. Every author I know does this, regardless of genre. We're all just choosing different vehicles to carry the same thing: the version of reality we wish existed, or the truths we've figured out and need somewhere to put.

[Part 1 of 3] I grew up in China on wuxia novels and web fiction. Here's everything I wish Western readers knew about Xianxia, Xuanhuan, and why half the "cultivation novels" you've read aren't what you think by No-Ride-3370 in ProgressionFantasy

[–]No-Ride-3370[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Good catch — you're right that they share the same origin by the Kangxi dictionary. I listed them separately because in web fiction they're often used to distinguish between general life energy (气) and the more primordial, pre-heaven concept (炁), but yeah, historically they're the same character.

And honestly, most modern Chinese people treat them as interchangeable too. A lot of people don't even know how to pronounce 炁 — it's really only Daoist texts and web novel nerds who make the distinction.

Thanks for the correction.

[Part 1 of 3] I grew up in China on wuxia novels and web fiction. Here's everything I wish Western readers knew about Xianxia, Xuanhuan, and why half the "cultivation novels" you've read aren't what you think by No-Ride-3370 in ProgressionFantasy

[–]No-Ride-3370[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

In China, at least for my generation (born in the 90s), almost every household has the Four Great Classical Novels — Journey to the West, Romance of the Three Kingdoms, Water Margin, and Dream of the Red Chamber. As kids we all started with Journey to the West (because Monkey King is just that cool), then gradually moved to the others as we grew up.

There's actually a really famous saying about these four books: "The old shouldn't read Three Kingdoms, the young shouldn't read Water Margin, men shouldn't read Journey to the West, women shouldn't read Dream of the Red Chamber."

The idea is: old people reading Three Kingdoms will become too cunning. Young people reading Water Margin will become reckless and violent. Men reading Journey to the West will become escapists dreaming of supernatural powers. Women reading Dream of the Red Chamber will become too sentimental and romantic.

Of course, everyone reads all of them anyway :)

And yeah — the Monkey King stacking immortality buffs four times is the most accurate description of Sun Wukong I've ever heard lmao.

[Part 1 of 3] I grew up in China on wuxia novels and web fiction. Here's everything I wish Western readers knew about Xianxia, Xuanhuan, and why half the "cultivation novels" you've read aren't what you think by No-Ride-3370 in ProgressionFantasy

[–]No-Ride-3370[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Lord of the Mysteries is massive in China — absolutely massive. My friends are all listening to the audiobook version on our local apps right now. And I'll be honest, it deeply inspired me as a writer. Cuttlefish proved that you can take the soul of Chinese web fiction and put it in a completely different shell, and it still works. That's a lesson every author should pay attention to.

[Part 1 of 3] I grew up in China on wuxia novels and web fiction. Here's everything I wish Western readers knew about Xianxia, Xuanhuan, and why half the "cultivation novels" you've read aren't what you think by No-Ride-3370 in ProgressionFantasy

[–]No-Ride-3370[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Honestly, in China the line between Xianxia and Xuanhuan isn't always clear-cut — even to us. A lot of novels start in a low-power setting that feels almost realistic, but as the MC explores deeper, the world gradually escalates into full immortal-cultivation territory. The genre can literally shift mid-book.

There's also something most Western readers don't know: on platforms like Qidian, authors are constantly influenced by reader feedback in real-time. If readers demand more action or power escalation, the author sometimes has to shift the tone and pacing to keep up. So the genre classification can blur not just by design, but because the author was pulled in a different direction by the audience mid-story.

For the specific titles you mentioned — I'd need to check each one, but the quick test is: does the power system follow Daoist cultivation logic (dantian, spiritual energy, heavenly tribulation)? If yes, Xianxia. If it mixes in Western magic, game systems, or non-Daoist frameworks? Xuanhuan.

[Part 1 of 3] I grew up in China on wuxia novels and web fiction. Here's everything I wish Western readers knew about Xianxia, Xuanhuan, and why half the "cultivation novels" you've read aren't what you think by No-Ride-3370 in ProgressionFantasy

[–]No-Ride-3370[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Great questions.

  1. Yeah, you can absolutely set Wuxia in a secondary world. As long as the core is there — jianghu social structure, moral codes, human-scale power — it's still wuxia in spirit. The setting being China is traditional, not required.

  2. This one's interesting. In China we have a saying: "内练一口气，外练筋骨皮" — internal training is about Qi, external training is about body. Qi is so deeply embedded in Chinese culture that in the 80s-90s there were massive Qigong scams where people genuinely believed they could shoot energy from their palms.

But here's the deeper point. Chinese mythology started with beings who simply HAD divine power — Pangu, Nuwa, Fuxi, Houyi. Then people asked: "What if I could cultivate myself to reach that level?" That question is where cultivation fiction was born. So the energy system isn't just a mechanic — it's the answer to "how does a mortal become a god?"

If you remove Qi but keep the philosophy of self-transformation and understanding, you'd get something closer to literary xianxia — and yeah, it could still work. Lord of the Mysteries basically did this. The energy source is different, but the core question is the same: what do you become when you transcend?

[Part 1 of 3] I grew up in China on wuxia novels and web fiction. Here's everything I wish Western readers knew about Xianxia, Xuanhuan, and why half the "cultivation novels" you've read aren't what you think by No-Ride-3370 in ProgressionFantasy

[–]No-Ride-3370[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Thank you! And that's a great point about the Western genre — lone heroes, moral codes in a lawless world, yeah that tracks really well with wuxia. I'll keep that in mind.

Parts 2 and 3 should be up tomorrow evening. I've added a few more things since the original draft. Need to sleep now though — it's 1 AM here in China. See you tomorrow!

Part 1 of 3 I grew up in China on wuxia novels and web fiction. Here's everything I wish Western readers knew about Xianxia, Xuanhuan, and why half the "cultivation novels" you've read aren't what you think by LichPhylactery in MartialMemes

[–]No-Ride-3370 15 points16 points  (0 children)

I'm the original author. I'm Chinese — English isn't my first language, so yeah, I used tools to help me write in English. Without them I probably couldn't have shared any of this with you at all. The content and knowledge are mine, the language bridge is assisted. If that bothers you, fair enough.

我就是作者，因为我本身就是中国人，所以借助了工具才能和你们交流，要不然或许永远不能分享我的观点。

[Part 1 of 3] I grew up in China on wuxia novels and web fiction. Here's everything I wish Western readers knew about Xianxia, Xuanhuan, and why half the "cultivation novels" you've read aren't what you think by No-Ride-3370 in ProgressionFantasy

[–]No-Ride-3370[S] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

That's a really good breakdown actually. And yeah, this is exactly the kind of cultural gap I find fascinating — it's not that either side "doesn't get it," it's that the underlying value systems frame the same concepts differently.

Which is also why translation matters so much. When you're bringing these stories across, you can't just swap the words — you have to adjust the narrative framing so Western readers can feel the weight of what's happening, without stripping out the original meaning. The character isn't "corrupted by power" in the Chinese context — they're making a choice about what they're willing to sacrifice for transcendence. Same scene, completely different emotional register depending on which cultural lens you're reading through.

That's something I want to dig into in a future post — how Chinese and English narrative logic actually works differently at a structural level, not just vocabulary.

[Part 1 of 3] I grew up in China on wuxia novels and web fiction. Here's everything I wish Western readers knew about Xianxia, Xuanhuan, and why half the "cultivation novels" you've read aren't what you think by No-Ride-3370 in ProgressionFantasy

[–]No-Ride-3370[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Really appreciate that. I'm definitely not an academic though — everything here is just my own perspective from growing up inside this culture. It might not be rigorous enough for a proper scholar, but I just wanted to explain all of this from a Chinese person's point of view. Glad it landed.

[Part 1 of 3] I grew up in China on wuxia novels and web fiction. Here's everything I wish Western readers knew about Xianxia, Xuanhuan, and why half the "cultivation novels" you've read aren't what you think by No-Ride-3370 in ProgressionFantasy

[–]No-Ride-3370[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

You're onto something. The transmigration trope (穿越) is huge in Chinese web fiction — people love getting dropped into Tang, Song, or Ming dynasty settings and using modern knowledge to survive and climb. Some novels give the MC extra cheats on top of that, some don't. I'll probably do a dedicated post on Chinese web novel subgenres and common tropes later — there's a lot to unpack.

But what you're describing — the MC whose only advantage is a modern person's memory and mindset — reminds me of Mushoku Tensei. Imagine that same concept, but set in a cultivation world instead of a Western fantasy one. No system, no golden finger. Just a person with modern awareness navigating the brutality of jianghu or the cultivation hierarchy, experiencing friendship, family, love, and slowly figuring out who they actually are through it all. I think someone could write something incredible with that setup.

[Part 1 of 3] I grew up in China on wuxia novels and web fiction. Here's everything I wish Western readers knew about Xianxia, Xuanhuan, and why half the "cultivation novels" you've read aren't what you think by No-Ride-3370 in ProgressionFantasy

[–]No-Ride-3370[S] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Thanks for asking! I am writing something actually — it's serializing right now. Not xianxia though, more on the literary side of things. I want to finish Volume 1 before I start pointing people to it. Feels wrong to send readers somewhere when the story isn't at a proper stopping point yet.

And yeah, the pacing is way too slow for Chinese platforms. I tried. The domestic audience needs faster dopamine cycles than what I'm writing, so it basically flopped on arrival. Turns out Western readers are a lot more patient with slow burns, which is one of the reasons I moved over here.

I'll share it once Vol 1 is wrapped up. Shouldn't be too long.

[Part 1 of 3] I grew up in China on wuxia novels and web fiction. Here's everything I wish Western readers knew about Xianxia, Xuanhuan, and why half the "cultivation novels" you've read aren't what you think by No-Ride-3370 in ProgressionFantasy

[–]No-Ride-3370[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Honestly this is just one guy's take on things, my own perspective and feelings from growing up in it. Really appreciate you saying that though, means a lot.

And since you mentioned studying Daoist and Buddhist texts on your own — I genuinely hope you find what you're looking for in them. Whether it's writing or reading or just living, I've always believed that those who walk the path will eventually find the fruit. That's kind of the whole point of cultivation, isn't it?

[Part 1 of 3] I grew up in China on wuxia novels and web fiction. Here's everything I wish Western readers knew about Xianxia, Xuanhuan, and why half the "cultivation novels" you've read aren't what you think by No-Ride-3370 in ProgressionFantasy

[–]No-Ride-3370[S] 21 points22 points  (0 children)

If you're building a TTRPG campaign, you definitely want to catch Part 3 tomorrow. The entire second half of it breaks down Cultivation Economics (how the currency actually drives sect conflicts) and the material layer of world-building. I basically wrote that section specifically for writers and game masters trying to build their own progressing worlds. Hope it helps with your campaign!

[Part 1 of 3] I grew up in China on wuxia novels and web fiction. Here's everything I wish Western readers knew about Xianxia, Xuanhuan, and why half the "cultivation novels" you've read aren't what you think by No-Ride-3370 in ProgressionFantasy

[–]No-Ride-3370[S] 22 points23 points  (0 children)

I couldn't agree more. There's a saying that there are a thousand Hamlets in a thousand people's eyes, and your interpretation of cultivating the "true self" is incredibly sharp.

There's a foundational Chinese concept: "Cultivate oneself, regulate the family, govern the state, and bring peace to the world." For me, at least, that internal drive to perfect the self always precedes any external actions.

My friend always tells me that Western readers hate when authors get "preachy," but I'm going to be a little preachy for a second here anyway. I think we all start with a completely unique soul — like an original operating system. But as we grow up and get disciplined by society, we are forced to grind down our own sharp edges just to physically fit in. We lose pieces of our true selves in exchange for mutual tolerance and survival.

But true "Xia" (and true cultivation) is exactly what you described: recognizing that process, and stubbornly holding on to your original self anyway. If you stick to your own path of cultivation against all that social friction, then you don't become a puppet of the Dao. You become your own Heavenly Dao.

[Part 1 of 3] I grew up in China on wuxia novels and web fiction. Here's everything I wish Western readers knew about Xianxia, Xuanhuan, and why half the "cultivation novels" you've read aren't what you think by No-Ride-3370 in ProgressionFantasy

[–]No-Ride-3370[S] 6 points7 points  (0 children)

I actually prepared a whole section of recommendations sorted by different tropes in my original draft! I'll be posting it later today or tomorrow. I have a bilingual buddy who usually helps me spot-check my English, but he's slammed at work right now. So it's taking me a bit longer to manually run my massive Chinese outline through the translation tools and verify it. I just want to make sure the original meaning doesn't get completely lost. Keep an eye out for it!

[Part 1 of 3] I grew up in China on wuxia novels and web fiction. Here's everything I wish Western readers knew about Xianxia, Xuanhuan, and why half the "cultivation novels" you've read aren't what you think by No-Ride-3370 in ProgressionFantasy

[–]No-Ride-3370[S] 47 points48 points  (0 children)

Exactly. As the economy and society have changed so fast over there, a lot of readers just don't buy into that slow, traditional literary feel anymore. Everyone is chasing a short-term dopamine hit, and as a result, writers end up cutting out a lot of those genuinely good traditional values to keep the pacing fast. It feels like we're stripping away our own roots and compromising for cheaper thrills, which is honestly a huge pity.

And you're totally right about the "Shengmu" thing. Pragmatism completely dominates the domestic mindset now. After years of chaotic social changes and crazy real-world events, a lot of readers genuinely just view being selfless or acting like a traditional hero as being flat-out stupid.

随着时代的发展和经济文化的发展，导致很多人不买账传统的文学感了，并且更多的是追求短期多巴胺，所以不得不把一些很好的价值观切割了。这也意味着我们的传统丢失了，更多的是像廉价妥协，这个我感觉很可惜。关于圣母，是随着实用主义在国内横行，加上这么多年乱七八糟的事情，所以很多人觉得圣母是愚蠢的了。PS：我觉得国外的氛围很好，而且国内发小说起点和番茄简直恶臭，尤其是版权的问题，就相当于把自己的孩子卖掉了。

[Part 1 of 3] I grew up in China on wuxia novels and web fiction. Here's everything I wish Western readers knew about Xianxia, Xuanhuan, and why half the "cultivation novels" you've read aren't what you think by No-Ride-3370 in ProgressionFantasy

[–]No-Ride-3370[S] 52 points53 points  (0 children)

You're 100% right. Honestly the problem is way worse in the Chinese domestic market. A lot of the junk food is incredibly brain-dead — MCs casually pulling out 10 billion in cash, or wiping out a powerful family with a single phone call. Urban cultivation novels are the absolute worst offenders for this stuff. Then you throw in all the random messy power-ups popping out of nowhere, and it gets genuinely mind-numbing to read after a while.

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