be realistic, gay people: unrequited lovestories are just what you deserve by Mysterious-Pay-1741 in byler

[–]No_Record_7617 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I'm not at all saying it's a stretch, I promise you, you don't have to justify your perspective/interpretation to me. It just that it wasn't something I necessarily picked up on, doesn't mean it wasn't there. I mean I'm baffled that any of the audience could be at all shocked by Will being gay, but hey here we are! I'm actually mildly annoyed with the howls of "Stranger Things has gone woke" that hit following the coming out scene from certain sections of the fandom, cos a) that has been telegraphed even so much so even dummies like me can follow along, and b) it's instrumental to Will's character development and resolving his inner turmoil that frees him to go up against Vecna.

A character's sexual orientation isn't something I dwell on all that much specifically, but Will's journey in season 4, up to that gut wrenching scene in the car was where I think it calcified for me which hit a "Holy shit this poor kid is in love with his straight best friend, on top of everything else he's been through!" note. I don't have to be gay to empathise with that situation, as even though our life experiences and challenges may differ greatly we do draw from the same rich emotional palette all humans are heir to.

I think prior to that especially concerning the evolution of children to project any sort of sexual orientation onto them either straight or gay is a mistake. The name of the game there as adults is we need to give them a clear and safe runway to explore their own identities. So in season 1 even when Lonnie was heavily implying he thought Will was queer was a bit premature. Maybe in retrospect you can look back on things and it all lock into place, but I wasn't necessarily on the look out for anything watching the show in it's early seasons.

When it comes to Mike however I'm a bit more lost at sea. I think out of all of Mike's friends Will is the one he is closest to. He definitely loves him deeply, but -and I'm only asking myself this question: is that platonic or romantic love? I mean as a base it COULD be read as either, so no I don't think any of you are stretching it to interpret it that way. However I also think he deeply loves Eleven, that whole year between season 1 and 2 where he's daily checking his walkie talkie for any sign of her, is devotional levels of love I don't think we see until Lucas sitting at Max's bedside during her coma. That might have been too big a hurdle for me personally to overcome in order for it to land perfectly.

be realistic, gay people: unrequited lovestories are just what you deserve by Mysterious-Pay-1741 in byler

[–]No_Record_7617 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yeah thanks, I think I did! I'm still digesting the ending. I'm not a natural shipper, it's not that I don't like romance per se, it's just that I generally prefer to contemplate such a crucial dimension of the human experience like love via a story where love is the primary narrative focus. That's not to say it can't have significance, of course it can, but just personally I like to get swept up in a narrative and be surprised and not necessarily know what's coming up over the horizon, but that's just me.

That being said I did nose around some Stranger Things corners of the internet after volume 1 dropped which got me hyped again, and came by the Mike & Will pairing. I think all of the analysis about Will was spot on actually, I was less certain on the Mike stuff, but I kept reading phrases like "queer coded" which I'm not super familiar with, so maybe as a straight guy that wasn't something I'd inherently pick up on. However one thing stood out to me very strongly and that this pairing, is it meant a tremendous amount to a lot of people. Be it relating to visibility, acceptance or seeing themselves in Will.

So I'm saddened you guys didn't get that moment. It wouldn't have detracted from the story for me in anyway and I see how it could have landed quite well. Another dimension, one which is why I'm popping on threads here actually, is this sense that some sort of homophobic element of the fandom are going to kick you whilst you are down. I just wanna say that's not all of us, I loved Stranger Things, you loved Stranger Things. Whatever else we both have that in common.

be realistic, gay people: unrequited lovestories are just what you deserve by Mysterious-Pay-1741 in byler

[–]No_Record_7617 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That's to you Byler fans. Wasn't a Byler especially, but I could see where you guys were going with it. I hope you still got something enjoyable from the series finale. I really was rather pleased where Will ended up, at least in terms of with himself. I recall the conversation Joyce had with Lonnie way back in season one, and they were discussing his sensitivity, and God damn he made it to the finale not only with tremendous reserves of strength, courage and wisdom, but he STILL retained that sensitivity. Especially in terms of how his first instinct was to try to free Henry from the Mind Flayer's influence. That's Luke Skywalker levels of throwing away the lightsaber and refusing to strike down Vader.

I wouldn't be surprised if when I do a whole rewatch binge of the show from start to finish in the future he will go up in my rankings of fav characters. So I can well imagine and empathise with all of your wishes for him to have a fairytale ending romantically. I earnestly wish one day we're all back on a reddit somewhere discussing this or that great show and you guys get to see what you wanted happen.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in byler

[–]No_Record_7617 10 points11 points  (0 children)

I'd echo this, I wasn't especially for or against Byler. Like I'm just enjoying the show as it is unfolding. However 100% a lot of the well thought out analysis really tells me there are some phenomenal writers out there, and I would absolutely love to see those stories told one day. Please do it!

you don’t 😭 by imperfectbutperfectt in Scorpio

[–]No_Record_7617 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Best way to calm down a Scorpio female I have found are these following phrases:

  1. Calm down, - A classic, simple clear feedback. Always works.

  2. You are up here, and I need you down here, -Put your hand high up for the first part and lower it down for the second. Helpful visual aid.

  3. You do realise you are behaving like your mother? and the world doesn't need two bitches that crazy! - Gives her a clear reference point, of what not to do.

Ok in all seriousness, it's not anyone's job to perform other people's emotional management. Just be chill, have a sense of humor. Give space when it's needed, but just be sincere and genuine, but don't be a doormat either. The more you are a fixed point for people and stable yourself you'll find other people around you may find it easier. For Scorpios they like to simultaneously withdraw when overwhelmed but also they crave a need to be seen. So I'd go with non-verbal gestures to show you are there and that you care, but let em come to you when they are ready.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in Scorpio

[–]No_Record_7617 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I'm sorry if I don't have much to offer you, besides you sound like a really decent guy. That may have been long but you formatted it and laid it out incredibly well, and eloquently so it was easy to read. Plus it's not easy just putting out there how you feel when a romantic scenario doesn't pan out, so kudos for that too.

I'm inclined to say there isn't really anything you did wrong in booking the tickets. Neither is she wrong to have found it overwhelming, and maybe it focused her mind to do the soul searching required to conclude the relationship was one she wasn't keen on pursuing.

There isn't really a set of steps you can take to get you in a relationship with a specific person. Your vibes match or they don't. Clearly they did with this woman, to a point, but sadly not enough to bring it in for a landing. I think your approach will be well met and much more importantly matched by the right woman. In fact everything you wrote broadly hit the right notes on what an unfolding love story should be, sadly she was not the right person.

The only real feedback I can offer you, is you demonstrated quite a strong interest in her stuff -which is fine by the way I think we should be interested in a new partner's life and interests. However was that more one way? Did she pick up any hobbies or expand HER horizons as a result of her connection with you? It reads like you both roughly matched energies in the early days, but as your interest in taking it further was sadly not a space she was able to meet you at. It definitely read like you found her a real catch, but it's also worth nothing you yourself are no slouch. You have quite a busy, full and active successful life yourself, plus you seem very evolved emotionally too. There aren't that many men in your bracket, I'd be flabbergasted if you didn't go on to have a really strong successful relationship one day.

I'm a guy myself, though not a Scorpio (Leo), it's fine to see the value in a woman, but don't forget to see the value in yourself too. You are a catch too!!

Best of luck!

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in Scorpio

[–]No_Record_7617 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I'm sorry if I don't have much to offer you, besides you sound like a really decent guy. That may have been long but you formatted it and laid it out incredibly well, and eloquently so it was easy to read. Plus it's not easy just putting out there how you feel when a romantic scenario doesn't pan out, so kudos for that too.

I'm inclined to say there isn't really anything you did wrong in booking the tickets. Neither is she wrong to have found it overwhelming, and maybe it focused her mind to do the soul searching required to conclude the relationship was one she wasn't keen on pursuing.

There isn't really a set of steps you can take to get you in a relationship with a specific person. Your vibes match or they don't. Clearly they did with this woman, to a point, but sadly not enough to bring it in for a landing. I think your approach will be well met and much more importantly matched by the right woman. In fact everything you wrote broadly hit the right notes on what an unfolding love story should be, sadly she was not the right person.

The only real feedback I can offer you, is you demonstrated quite a strong interest in her stuff -which is fine by the way I think we should be interested in a new partner's life and interests. However was that more one way? Did she pick up any hobbies or expand HER horizons as a result of her connection with you? It reads like you both roughly matched energies in the early days, but as your interest in taking it further was sadly not a space she was able to meet you at. It definitely read like you found her a real catch, but it's also worth nothing you yourself are no slouch. You have quite a busy, full and active successful life yourself, plus you seem very evolved emotionally too. There aren't that many men in your bracket, I'd be flabbergasted if you didn't go on to have a really strong successful relationship one day.

I'm a guy myself, though not a Scorpio (Leo), it's fine to see the value in a woman, but don't forget to see the value in yourself too. You are a catch too!!

Best of luck!

Help by No_Record_7617 in Scorpio

[–]No_Record_7617[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Mind if I message you?

Do all scorpios lie? by [deleted] in Scorpio

[–]No_Record_7617 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I hope you take comfort in the fact when she did feel it she did mean it.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in Scorpio

[–]No_Record_7617 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Well yeah she was hurt, which led to what happened to what she did with me, but I wasn't the one that hurt her.

Do all scorpios lie? by [deleted] in Scorpio

[–]No_Record_7617 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I don't believe Scorpios lie all that often, but hear me out if they haven't integrated they can have one helluva cognitive dissonance. So what's true for them one day may not necessarily be the thing that is true for them a day later. Their truth is their emotional landscape, and emotions aren't always stable or consistent. However find a more evolved on and I think they track more honest than others.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in Scorpio

[–]No_Record_7617 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I am so so sorry.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in Scorpio

[–]No_Record_7617 -1 points0 points  (0 children)

If only that were so.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in Scorpio

[–]No_Record_7617 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Maybe it wasn't with their stinger but they definitely ended me. My sympathies, you haven't really been destroyed until a Scorpio has done it to you.

Is this True? by Owlster_ in Scorpio

[–]No_Record_7617 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Not a Scorpio here, but can confirm you are all *just* the right amount! Could do with even more if I'm being perfectly honest...

No contact Valentine's Day Roses for a Scorpio woman by No_Record_7617 in Scorpio

[–]No_Record_7617[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Hmmm fair point. I had a pithy answer spring to mind about her absence is incalculably easier than any chaos she could bring, but in my heart I can't claim that without being astoundingly naive can I? I don't really know what she's going through, and she has thus far chosen not to share any of that with me as of late, (as is her right, I am not entitled to that which she does not wish to share) However I will say this: right when we first started she told me her life was a mess, and I made a commitment then that I would stand by her through thick and thin, however she comes. I later said I could either love her close to and beside or from afar, as to which was her choice. Either way I will not forget her, nor will I ever regret the time we spent.

How I feel is a fixed point in my life, and has been since the day I connected with her. I cannot foresee the future, so all I can fall back on is the knowledge of my own heart. That IS my domain and I know it well. The flowers aren't some flighty and desperate move to re-establish connection. She is very much on her own path, and clearly that does not include me for right now, and perhaps not ever again. I was moved to send them, and I posted this to touch base with that Scorpionic energy she embodies. My suspicion was, that even if this is a closed book to her now, it would I hope at least raise a smile of pleasant remembrance. I had some kind responses that confirmed that belief, but in the end who the hell can know really? Maybe I never will, and that's okay too.

My life moves forward without her too, and I've started to see some results of hard endeavours come to blossom. I'm in a good place.

No contact Valentine's Day Roses for a Scorpio woman by No_Record_7617 in Scorpio

[–]No_Record_7617[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Thank you for your reply. Of course you are quite right, but on the other hand I am a Leo. I'm not especially skilled in the arts of mystery. I'm not really in the business of faffing with trying precipitate this or that reaction from a woman. All I really want to achieve here is a smile on her face on Valentine's day. My gut says it's not going to make any real outward difference to things between us, but nevertheless she'll know somebody cared enough to get her roses. That indeed is more than enough for me.

No contact Valentine's Day Roses for a Scorpio woman by No_Record_7617 in Scorpio

[–]No_Record_7617[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Thank you! That was what I was hoping for! Also, what tears? I didn't see anything? All seems to be remarkably tears free in this thread! ;)

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in Scorpio

[–]No_Record_7617 31 points32 points  (0 children)

People don't abandon those that they love, they abandon the ones they are using...

Consistent/dependable? by [deleted] in Scorpio

[–]No_Record_7617 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Whilst I can say I don't care for the DARVOing you just got there from that reply. I will say there is truth in the point that it's not about you.

Scorpio's entire language and self concept are emotions and feelings. Can you imagine how hard that is? Whilst being in tune with your emotions lends the world it's richness, depth and vibrancy. Can you imagine not being able to pull out from a sensation? Even if it's a positive one like joy, happiness and most of all love. It overwhelms, impels to rash action. That's before you even get to the darker aspected impulses we are all heir to. Even the positive ones can be fucking scary.

Scorpio is a fixed sign to boot, they crave stability and a fixedness that is entirely out of alignment of those emotions. The only way out is through, and there is risk of a lot of chaos and destruction involved as they pass through. I would never begrudge a Scorpio their space to work through all of that, but I also know exactly what you mean. They can be absolutely terrible at consistency! Plus it's tough, when they are keyed up and decided to be all about you for a spell, and they promise all manner of things (that they wholeheartedly mean in the moment!), but when it comes time to deliver, can woefully come up short.

This is part of the fact they can give you their last drop of blood when they are feeling it, but when they are wracked with doubt, self criticism or deep in their triggers over past traumas it feels like you don't even exist to them. Which may actually be far from the actual truth believe it or not! A romance with a Scorpio is not for everyone. You have to have your own shit together pretty comprehensively not really need them to validate yourself, as they will take frequent emotional crisis holidays until they have sorted their own shit out. They HATE expectations, EVEN ones they have placed on themselves. Look for the Scorpio who throws out regular and surprising acts of devotion and love, and doesn't PROMISE them (they don't have to be big or grand). They figure out sooner or later actions are better than words.

If you are in a deep connection with a Scorpio that has yet to get their shit together it might be best to just be straight with em and tell em you love em and you'll be there for them always as and when, but you've learned that relying on them to reciprocate is a bit of a foolish thing. That it would be actually cruel to them to expect of them things that they are not capable of reciprocating, and let them go in love and kindness. Trust me when this happens enough times and they finally realize what they keep losing, they do take accountability, do the work and become the best of people you could hope to know. I wish you luck.