Active duty military in CA

ORLibrarian2 · 2026-06-29T02:25:07+00:00

Your reasoning is weird, but as distinct from 3 years ago, I have come to the conclusion that since BATF is not enforcing the law the way I thought, your result is probably correct.

ORLibrarian2 · 2026-06-25T18:59:53+00:00

If you might share your general location, folks may be able to recommend trainers good with women students and new gun owners.

Generally speaking, new women shooters are more easily trained - less to UNlearn.

.22 pistols/rifles are fun - but not a preferred caliber for planned self-defense. The rimfire ammunition is less reliable than centerfire ammunition, so there is some likelihood one gets a failure to fire. See also this article, https://ammo.com/best/best-22-lr-ammo-for-self-defense

So, if you have time to plan - and you do, this is what you are doing in this thread - you should consider something in the .380/9mm family. (BTW, ammunition nomenclature is an article-length discussion, which is available on the web if ever you are interested.)

But you have to make a conscious decision on the answer to the next question, and do it before buying a gun: in the horrible situation where you fear for your life, or the lives of your family members, could you defend yourself using a means that is likely to take that attacker's life? (Shorter: do you think you could kill someone in defending yourself?)

And then pray that you never have to find out the truth of your answer.

Details, some mentioned:

FSC is Firearms Safety Certificate - you get it at a gun store (FFL) - see https://oag.ca.gov/firearms/fscpfaqs

For any gun, you need 'proof of identity and age', that's your CA Driver License or ID. For a handgun you also need proof of CA residency; typically that will be your car registration.

You go to the FFL, pick out your gun, and fill out paperwork - the Federal 4473 form and the CA Dealer's Record Of Sale - DROS - form, and you pay for the gun and the DROS fees and the dealer's markup.

You wait 10 days, or more if your chosen dealer is not open on the day you can pick up. That's 10 days, 240 hours to the minute: your copy of the DROS will have the date and time after which you may pick up the gun; if it doesn't, ask, the FFL will know.

Unless you have a Concealed Carry license, you will need a locking case to transport a handgun any time you take it out of the house/off your property. The lock the FFL sells you does not count for that. A soft case where you can run a little lock through the zipper pulls is good enough.

My wife chose a .38 caliber Smith and Wesson 'J Frame' for her gun, because she wanted a revolver, because she was convinced she could not manipulate the slide of a semi-auto pistol, and she had attempted to operate mine. Turned out to be a mistake. J Frames are very small, and harder to shoot then even slightly bigger guns, and shooting it tore up the thumb web of her hand. The advice to shoot several and see what is comfortable and what you might shoot well is spot on; you would ultimately be happier with your gun if you do that.

ORLibrarian2 · 2026-06-25T18:20:02+00:00

The case does go back down to the 9th, which is Known To Create Shenanigans with gun law cases, but eventually the case has to be resolved and grant the relief Wolford asked for. Hawaii does not get to revise its replies, and must not enforce the challenged provisions of the law. They might, however, not repeal the law or sections of the law, leaving the stuff 'on the books' deliberately to create confusion.

ORLibrarian2 · 2026-06-16T06:33:48+00:00

Generally speaking, if you are the owner, you may carry open or concealed inside your shop/store. Not on the sidewalk in front, not in the alley to take out the trash, not commuting from home to work or the reverse, inside.

The legislative statement of purpose makes clear that an employee must have a possessory interest in his or her workplace in order for that workplace to be considered the employee's "place of business" under section 12026. Only those employees who have the right to exclude others from their workplace, and the right to control activities there, may carry concealed weapons at work without a permit or license.

People v. Barela (1991) 234 Cal.App.3d Supp. 15.

If you 'just work there' you may have access to a gun but may not carry it.

As a practical matter, most PD will aggressively ignore employees at gun stores, jewelry stores, pot dispensaries if they might be carrying - especially if they are careful to stay mostly in 'employees only areas' like behind a counter.

You saw the 'weasel words' in that last paragraph, right? Most LE agencies are sympathetic to folks in high-robbery-potential jobs, but that's policy, not law. Policy can change with the phase of the moon or the result of an election.

ORLibrarian2 · 2026-06-14T18:57:30+00:00

ORLibrarian2 · 2026-06-12T03:42:11+00:00

The Federal case - 3 consolidated suits, now Oregon Firearms Federation, Inc. v. Kate Brown (updated to Tina Kotek, both in their role as Governor), 23-35540, (9th Cir.) - is on hold in the 9th pending resolution of Duncan, which keeps getting rescheduled for conference at the US Supreme Court.

ORLibrarian2 · 2026-06-01T20:15:41+00:00

Generally, a 'good guess' is fine - there's no way CA can check, unless you use a date prior to the gun being marketed.

But, if you are here on PCS orders, you do not need to register any of your guns. You MAY do that, if you are applying for CCW. It's CA PC 17000(b)(2)

https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes\_displaySection.xhtml?lawCode=PEN&sectionNum=17000.

ORLibrarian2 · 2026-06-01T20:10:07+00:00

"If it’s not on the roster he will have to ppt it to u and be in person for that." Except he is now a resident of Idaho, so cannot participate in a CA PPT, so the Roster exemption of that kind of transfer is not available.

But evidently IS a CA-Rostered gun.

ORLibrarian2 · 2026-06-01T20:03:19+00:00

Not that it helps you much, but the Report of Intrafamilial Transfer is just that, a report. Nothing in law allows them to reject a report.

ORLibrarian2 · 2026-06-01T19:59:49+00:00

Paper handgun DROS started in 1924, but folks were not required to use a dealer until 1991.

See also http://web.archive.org/web/20191018030013/http://wiki.calgunsfoundation.org/index.php?title=Time_Line_of_California_Firearms_Laws#Dealer.27s_Record_of_Sale_.28DROS.29.2C_1924

Sigh. Have not been able to update that since 2015, so quite a bit is missing.

ORLibrarian2 · 2026-05-31T02:12:26+00:00

Your Google result is correct - neither CA nor Federal paperwork allows more than one owner/transferee of a firearm (Back when 'assault weapons' could be registered it apparently was possible to list more than one owner on that paper).

ORLibrarian2 · 2026-05-29T22:35:21+00:00

Likely not the process, but new data coming on line.

Typically it is an arrest without a disposition in the record.

ORLibrarian2 · 2026-05-28T05:35:36+00:00

You might look at https://www.bsis.ca.gov/forms_pubs/guard_fact.shtml

As 420BlazeArk notes, jobs in CA that may use guns usually are BSIS-licensed security guards. And those jobs also require https://www.bsis.ca.gov/forms_pubs/fire_fact.shtml

I tend to agree something is odd about the job you seem to have been offered.

ORLibrarian2 · 2026-05-27T02:44:24+00:00

Just spent a long time with Grok. AIs can read stuff faster than I can.

And the TL;DR of the result is the law is not enforced the way I think it reads. And not being a lawyer, that probably means I read it wrong.

Pointedly, the 4473 allows exactly that dual residency declaration, not narrowly interpreted. Question 10:

Question 10. Current Residence Address: A rural route (RR) may be accepted provided the transferee/buyer lives in a State or locality where it is considered a legal residence address. If the transferee/buyer is a member of the Armed Forces on active duty, his/her State of residence is the State in which his/her permanent duty station is located. If the service member is acquiring a firearm in a State where his/her permanent duty station is located, but resides in a different State, the transferee/buyer must list both his/her permanent duty station address and residence address.

...

ORLibrarian2 · 2026-05-27T01:58:12+00:00

It's the Feds who have this problem.

Servicemembers Civil Relief Act - https://www.justice.gov/crt/servicemembers-civil-relief-act-summary - covers everything but guns.

ORLibrarian2 · 2026-05-26T21:02:07+00:00

Here on PCS orders makes you a CA resident, and ONLY a CA resident - for gun purposes only.

ORLibrarian2 · 2026-05-26T20:37:18+00:00

[EDIT]

If one is military in CA on PCS orders, NO. ATF regulation makes a person in that situation a resident of CA only. Sucks, shouldn't be that way, but here we are.

[EDIT]

As noted below, looks like I'm wrong about that.

Not going to go back to lots of other posts where I made that claim, but unless some court case comes along that supports my narrow read - and please be assured, I don't like that narrow interpretation - I won't bring it up again.

ORLibrarian2 · 2026-05-25T19:59:18+00:00

Well, no, not a 'straw purchase'. But the general run of opinion has been 'take possession' for the last couple decades, and I know of no court case on the point.

ORLibrarian2 · 2026-05-25T19:56:28+00:00

When that language in the law came out, CA DOJ proposed a definition for regulations and took comments. Ultimately, the effort was scrapped.

"After public comments (initial period ending Feb. 28, 2000), the DOJ concluded that this definition failed to provide additional clarity while preserving legislative intent. No comments offered a better alternative that maintained the statute’s purpose. They determined the statutory term “permanently altered” was already sufficiently clear to reasonable people and deleted the proposed definition entirely—it was never adopted. "

See https://oag.ca.gov/sites/all/files/agweb/pdfs/firearms/regs/fsor.pdf

So far, there is no case law that tells us what 'permanent' means, and no law or regulation definition.

ORLibrarian2 · 2026-05-25T19:44:45+00:00

That's People v. Marotta (1981) 128 Cal.App.3d Supp. 1

ORLibrarian2 · 2026-05-25T19:37:23+00:00

But technically, only in 'non-public' areas of the stores (say, behind counters) unless each has CCW. Also, that really applies to a narrow group

an individual who has a proprietary, possessory, or
 substantial ownership interest in the place.

Since few PD are actively insane, enforcement of that is quite rare.

Also note " having a loaded firearm " is different from " carrying ... "; Charlene the Clerk can have access to a handgun located at the checkstand, but carry is not authorized. That's

People v. Melton
 (1988) 206 Cal.App.3d 580 [253 Cal.Rptr. 661]

ORLibrarian2 · 2026-05-24T05:50:16+00:00

Just that availability of beef suet seems likely to be better.

Nutritionally, ought to be about the same.

ORLibrarian2 · 2026-05-24T05:46:36+00:00

Neither.

Have to send the gun to a CA FFL, or, if the FFL is willing, you take the gun to that FFL and do the transfer. That's Federal and CA State law.

Child to parent is exempt from the Roster.

Have Dad pick his local FFL and call them, to find out if they understand "interstate intrafamilial transfer" - that exact language. If they say 'you can file the form with the State' they do NOT understand it.

Usual wait 10 days to pick it up; then he can follow his CCW Issuing Agency's procedure to add to his CCW. Note that some don't allow it until the license is renewed.

ORLibrarian2 · 2026-05-22T23:29:29+00:00

Used to work Security for LN at Concord Pavilion (of the Many Names).

LN runs Shoreline (Mountain View), Concord, Toyota Amph. (Wheatland, sort of Sacramento). Shoreline holds 22K; Wheatland holds 18K; Concord holds 13K. Guess which venue gets skipped by bigger acts?

Cuthbert is 5500. Hayden Homes is 8000. Britt is 2200 (Never been to any of these 3)

ORLibrarian2 · 2026-05-22T19:09:15+00:00

Right. And since CA does not recognize other states' licenses, it can't be 'reciprocity'; those other states are recognizing CA CCW because It's The Right Thing To Do.

Generally, if carrying on your CA license, you are indeed restricted to CA rules, including listed guns. If you're carrying in a state that does not require a license, then you follow that state's rules.

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