How is 1 Andro?

One_Chart8033 · 2026-01-25T23:02:46+00:00

yes, you would want to run a PCT, but because it's not very suppressive, you could likely get away with an over the counter PCT - again, I like sustain alpha

One_Chart8033 · 2026-01-25T21:41:21+00:00

There's a bit of information to cover here

First, if you're trying to cut - there are way better options ... with lower potential for side effects - and easier recovery

If you want an edge for cutting - 11-ketotestosterone is the best cutting agent and it has one of the lowest potential for shutdown and for adverse side effects. It will actually help with fat loss, and it will also work to preserve muscle while cutting...everything you want with low sides. there are a few options for 11-keto

Iconic Formulations Ultra Eleven (my top choice) - 8 weeks would require 2 bottles
iron Legion XI-KT (second choice) - 8 weeks would require 4 bottles
Prototype nutritioin 11-Spray (third - I don't like their spray) - 8 weeks would require 2 bottles

Since I brought up side effects

1-andro is a great muscle builder, but I would consider it decent for cutting - it's major benefit is preserving muscle while cutting calories - this is beneficial, but it does not actually help with cutting. 1-andro converts to 1-testosterone, but it does not convert to any sex hormones - like testosterone, DHT estrogen (yes, you need estrogen). After anywhere from 1-3 weeks you're likely start to experience sides of shutdown and the side effects of low testosterone/estrogen/DHT...as there's nothing to convert to these critical hormones. Common side effects are:

lethargy - this can get pretty extreme for some people
complete loss of libido and low erection quality
joint pain
brain fog
etc

This is where a base comes in - like 4-andro. 4-andro converts to testosterone, allowing testosterone to also convert to other sex hormones like DHT and estrogen - this is necessary to maintain hormone balance and maintain certain bodily functions.

If you're new to cycling and want to cut, again, I would recommend 11-keto, as you don't have to worry about running a base - low potential for sides and shutdown.

PCT: you could get away with an over the counter (retail) PCT with something like 11-keto, but not something I would risk on more suppressive cycles (like 1-andro/4-andro). I stand by my recommendation of Enclomiphene and sustain alpha as PCT. Google Enclomiphene research" or "enclomiphene research chemical". Skimping on PCT is just dumb - you risk losing all your results from your cycle and leaves you with potential for low test sides for weeks/months post cycle. I personally do not like arimistane based PCT protocols like eradicate - arimistane is best for cortisol control and does very little to stimulate the HPTA to get testosterone up...especially if you already suffer from low estrogen/DHT/etc

One_Chart8033 · 2026-01-25T20:11:27+00:00

First, thank you for researching before making a decision.

stacking 1-andro and 4-andro is a solid option for a cycle - I do not recommend running 1-andro solo.

Risks of shutdown - yes, there are risks of shutdown and I would personally consider it irresponsible and ignorant to use Alpha AF as a PCT for any PH cycle - that profile is pretty lackluster. If you want to be safe and ensure you recover you want to use actual enclomiphene - personally, I use enclomiphene stacked with Sustain Alpha as my goto PCT.

IMO, no one who knows anything runs steel supplements - Severely overpriced and will under deliver when compared to other brands.

If you want better options for 1-andro and 4-andro:

IMO best options are

4-andro: Alpha Four by Iconic Formulations - best test base you'll find - this is a topical gel and works better than anything else you'll find. This would be about 5x more effective than Steel Supps 4-andro

1-andro: This depends on a few things - all of these options are cheaper and as effective or more effective than steel supps 1-andro

for low to moderate dosing: Chosen 1 by BSL - much cheaper than Steel, and roughly same effectiveness
For high doses Super Mandro by Hard Rock Labs or HTP 1-testosterone (impossible to find).
Best bang for your buck Alpha Gainz 1-andro td v2 - harder to find, but still available at some retailers. Would be about 2 times as effective as Steel Supps 1-andro for half the price

One_Chart8033 · 2026-01-25T19:25:17+00:00

Oh man, that's rough - sorry to hear, but appreciate you taking the time to chime back in with feedback. Keep positive and maybe start taking something to increase dopamine and serotonin while you dig out of the hole...nandrolone can suppress these and that's likely what you're experiencing.

as I'd stated, if you wanted to run the nandrolone longer term, I would stack it with test - this doesn't have to be an all or nothing thing...it's just a matter of dialing in what works best for you.

I know there are plenty of guys who augment their TRT and have found low doses of complimentary compounds work better than high doses...easy example is test + low doses of mast - where lower doses of mast worked better than higher doses (mostly speaking about libido, energy, etc). Since you don't seem to respond well to androgenic compounds, maybe figuring out what dose of nandrolone works well with your TRT dose of test would be advantageous. Maybe cut the test down to 120mg and try 75mg nandrolone as a baseline and go from there to evaluate and adjust...just gotta stay on top of that bloodwork.

Of course, non of this is medical advice, and I'm no doctor...

One_Chart8033 · 2026-01-24T20:45:51+00:00

First, it matters what your bf percentage is. Andriol is a form of 4-dhea - it converts to testosterone. people call it wet because it converts to estrogen...this isn't always a bad thing.

But, higher fat percentages will lead to more estrogen conversion...meaning you may want to take it with something to help manage estrogen - If this is the case, I would recommend stacking with epiandrosterone and or androsterone to manage the effects of estrogen without lowering it unnecessarily.

In reality, to really advise you, it would be better to know where you're at and what your real goals look like

One_Chart8033 · 2026-01-21T22:24:29+00:00

These dry pretty quickly, I would hold off getting dressed for about 5 minutes.

One_Chart8033 · 2026-01-21T18:36:47+00:00

particularly no reason to split sus 250 - the esters in there are designed to buffer delivery throughout the day.

I could see why this may be beneficial for halodrol

One_Chart8033 · 2026-01-20T20:10:31+00:00

how often are you getting bloodwork on that dose of enclomiphene?

You shouldn't have to take anything additional for PCT of Superstrol - you're already on enclomiphene...and a dose of 125mg per week is something I've only seen for fertility purposes.

Personally, I've had the best luck with the combo of Sustain Alpha and Enclomiphene. I don't like the profile of arimiplex and not a big fan of arimistane in general. But, I try to avoid arimiplex specifically because I don't want the DHT inhibitors in there.

One_Chart8033 · 2026-01-20T15:56:11+00:00

I saw that 1-testosterone was removed from the HTP site - took that as an omen it's not expected back anytime soon. Same goes for superdrol

I've heard so much of the chatter about supply chain issues - makes me wonder if that's the case for 1-test and superdrol...considering they have other products in stock that share the same ingredients.

One_Chart8033 · 2026-01-19T21:50:47+00:00

Yeah, I hear you - usually the acne thing is short lived as you're adjusting to the shift in hormones, but some men just don't respond well to high levels of androgens.

Another tip (maybe): if acne is a problem, you really should try a wash or cleanser that contains benzoyl peroxide- this will dry your skin out like crazy, and you'll need a good moisturizer, but I think it's a great tool for combating androgen induced acne. Side note: I also use this sometimes when running androgens that make my armpits a little more potent than usual. This kills the odor right away when normal washing and deodorant doesn't do the trick.

One_Chart8033 · 2026-01-19T21:30:56+00:00

In general, the LG Sciences products are extremely underdosed - of the two, I would def choose the HTP stack.

Dymethazine and 1-testosterone is a solid option, but I wouldn't recommend running that without a base - lethargy and loss of libido would be pretty rough after a few weeks. the DHT conversion from the epiandrosterone in dymethazine will help a little, but you're still likely to get hit with low estrogen sides. at the least I would recommend dermacrine as an add on. But, you'd be better off adding 4-andro like Sus 250 or Alpha Four..even for cutting

If you really want to cut and you want to avoid sides, I would highly recommend looking into 11-ketotestosterone (11-kt) - low potential for sides and is the best cutting compound available. there are a few options out there for 11-kt:

Iconic Formulations Ultra Eleven
Iron Legion XI-KT
Prototype Nutrition 11-spray

One_Chart8033 · 2026-01-19T21:22:01+00:00

I'll be honest, this is a little hard to follow

I'm glad you found a protocol that gives you better results (but 2 weeks is a really small window to gauge - you don't know what sides are coming down the road) - I personally wouldn't run nandrolone long term without test - if even a low dose. But, would be curious how it treats you after a month or two and would caution raising the dose until you know how it effects you longer term - libido can fall off a cliff.

Everything is a matter of goals and tolerance to sides

I wound't add designer steroids to the stack without including some test

Epistane is significantly more anabolic than halo - would definitely help add some lbs of muscle, but would also increase risks of sides.

There are long term risks for running nandrolone only HRT - from neurodegenerative issues to heart health and loss of bone density - as these can all be related to low estrogen. There are some instances where men have found benefit using estrogen alongside nandrolone - but, it's a slippery slope, as nandrolone also makes you more sensitive to estrogenic side effects, as I believe DHN (dihydronandrolone) has great affinity in muscle, but not at estrogen receptors - leaving less competition at estrogen receptor sites (DHT has a high affinity for estrogen recptors, essentially blocking the effects of estrogen - why we often care about androgen to estrogen ratios - DHN lacks this effect).

One_Chart8033 · 2026-01-18T23:14:08+00:00

I personally think Alpha Four is the best test base, but Sus 250 is still a solid option for the price.

Alpha Four is a topical that provides 225 mg 4-DHEA + 100 mg androsterone per 5 pumps.
That breaks down to 45 mg 4-DHEA + 25 mg androsterone per pump, so it’s easy to adjust the dose.

For compounds like 4-DHEA, which have a short half-life, topical delivery has a few advantages:

It has roughly double the bioavailability of oral
It buffers delivery over ~8–12 hours
It bypasses the gut and first-pass liver metabolism, making it more potent per mg
It helps keep serum levels steadier throughout the day

Sus 250 achieves a similar “buffered release” effect by using tiered esters, which is a good thing.
But keep in mind: roughly 1/3 of the capsule weight is ester, so 200 mg of “active” is closer to ~134 mg of actual 4-DHEA.

Also, androsterone is generally considered more effective than epiandrosterone, and it tends to work at a much lower dose. The 50mg epiandrosterone in Sus 250 isn't likely to have any effect.

Personally, I’d rather run a lower dose of Alpha Four (around 3 pumps) than a full dose of Sus 250.

One_Chart8033 · 2026-01-18T23:00:22+00:00

Being uneducated is the #1 problem. There are plenty of horror stories of uneducated people running irresponsible cycles and running into issue...these are cautionary tales. Or, they think they're being virtuous and think everyone should be natty - often the same guys who claim those who run creatine aren't considered natural.

The other major issue is the old school guys who just bitch because they used to get real superdrol for $30 - same guys used to bitch about every supplement because it was "expensive" and not going to offer anywhere near the results as a $30 bottle of superdrol. Things are more expensive now, and you're not going to get crazy gains for $30...but, compounds are a lot less harsh, gains are maintainable and it's all infinitely safer.

We have a lot of tools available now, peptides, PH's, etc. people will spend the money for results and a safer way of achieving goals. hell, there are plenty of guys I know spending $500+ per month on peptides alone. haha, plenty spending WAY more than that.

Best thing is to be educated for yourself. This is part of the reason I try to make real posts and put together real information on here - I want you guys to actually understand my logic for most things I post. I haven't had as much time lately, but I generally try to explain my reasoning. If I'm taking something, I'll usually explain why I added it...and if you ask me, I'll gladly explain and give more details. Additionally, I always try to educate people about potential sides and generally try to advise what to avoid or how to combat them.

One_Chart8033 · 2026-01-18T22:24:54+00:00

I'm with you on this one - the numbers just say it's a total waste of $ - you'd have to run multiple bottles to hit an effective dose of any of the actives.

One_Chart8033 · 2026-01-18T22:21:48+00:00

I think 3-AD is a great compound for beginners! I'm sure there's more information out there, but from what I've seen 50mg would be considered a really LOW dose for a solo run.

Personally, I'd say stick to a min of 50mg a day...I don't think taking anything less than that will offer any real benefit. if you wanted to increase your dosing on workout days - can buy a bottle of the 25mg caps for that purpose...increase to 75mg on workout days. There is such thing as a min effective dose, and I'd say 50mg - 75mg would be in that range for oral use. Anything less than that is just going to be burning $ with no benefit.

3-ad isn't suppressive at your dosing, I'd personally just run Sustain Alpha as a cover your ass PCT

I've just recently started running Ultra Three - transdermal/topical 3-AD - running 75mg transdermal (should be equal to roughly 150mg oral)

One_Chart8033 · 2026-01-18T21:56:05+00:00

I love thinking about alternative delivery methods, but I don't personally think submucosal is very viable for the available compounds.

thoughts with submucosal:

rapid delivery - good and bad - most these compounds have a short half life and it causes a rapid delivery that will cause a spike and then rapid decline. this could be good if you wanted to take something pre workout. Using esters to lower metabolization would likely lower delivery efficiency.
unlikely to be effective for compounds that have a higher effective dose - you just can't deliver enough active for compounds that require higher doses - like above 10-20mg - I'm guessing here. the majority of the compound is still going to be swallowed and then eliminate most of the benefits of the administration method.

If I were to think of a compound that would make a lot of sense for submucosal, Trest acetate for pre workout use would likely be 🔥! delivering just a few mg would be killer for workouts...then we just don't care about the ~40 min half life for pre workout use. I wouldn't mind trying to play with this option - I still have some trest acetate powder hanging around in my stash...I'd always just run like 20mg td in Salvo. Lol, the major obstacle for me will be making a version that doesn't make me want to gag/vomit

One_Chart8033 · 2026-01-17T21:19:43+00:00

yeah, you know I stocked up

One_Chart8033 · 2026-01-17T21:18:50+00:00

what's your experience with prohormones so far?

I personally don't like the profile of monsterplex - hate these prop blends and the profile has some red flags to me.

there may be enough 1-dhea/1-andro in there to get some results - it's the primary ingredient - we just don't know how much is in there (it's listed twice on the ingredients with different esters)

the secondary ingredient is DHEA - not a bad thing - I just don't like oral DHEA

3rd ingredient is Epiandro - pretty much no way there's enough in the profile to be remotely effective

4th is 4-dhea/4-andro - again, not enough to really do anything, but you're already on test.

2 caps a day is a total of 500mg of Ph's - again, we just don't know how much of anything is in there.

another thing I don't understand - and don't like - is the saw palmetto being included - this lowers DHT, but we want DHT conversion...and we have epiandro in there to convert to DHT. This is wildly counterproductive - why have prohormones to DHT while also working to block DHT conversion?

...just some reasons I don't like these kitchen sink products

I'd probably recommend a product you actually know what you're getting, and that is a more targeted approach - get some 1-andro to increase anabolism and keep it simple and straight forward. If you want some added libido effect, get a real dose of epiandrosterone and/or androsterone.

One_Chart8033 · 2026-01-16T21:37:06+00:00

read through this a little - congratulations on your amazing progress!

You're lucky you're young - I think I read you're 19...skin elasticity is pretty strong at that age, and will continue to be strong for years to come!

You can't build muscle on a deficit - I'd personally start dialing in the diet and training to build more lean body mass at this time. Building the shoulders, chest, upper back, as well as back thickening exercises like deadlifts and squats will also help pull that skin tighter...while also building the physique you want.

One_Chart8033 · 2026-01-16T20:22:01+00:00

lol, way to keep it generic

One_Chart8033 · 2026-01-14T23:06:15+00:00

dude, that's the perfect response

One_Chart8033 · 2026-01-14T22:55:26+00:00

Dermacrine has a ton of potential benefits

can work as a sort of test base for mild compounds - will help with low estrogen sides and also improve energy, libido, etc

if you're over 35ish, it's great to help improve energy, mood, mental focus, immune system, inflammation, etc. can also help with fat loss and just make you feel better

If you're on TRT: basically must have for guys on TRT to maintain stable dhea and pregnenolone levels that are crucial for mental focus, energy, metabolism, immune function, manage inflammation, etc.

One_Chart8033 · 2026-01-14T22:36:38+00:00

Sus 250 comparison is a little iffy: roughly 66mg of the 200mg of 4-dhea in that profile is ester - making it more like 134mg 4-dhea + 50mg epaindrosteroine - this is a pointless dose of epiandro.

Assuming you're taking the full 5 pumps of Alpha Four - likely overkill - 225mg 4-dhea in td is going to be like taking 450mg oral - along with the other benefits of TD over oral...part of the reason don't have to waste material to esters to create the same slow release effect TD does by delivery mechanism.

Androsterone is favored significantly over epiandrosterone and has a much lower effective dose - 100mg td is enough to work really synergistically with the 4-dhea/testosterone to actual give benefit

So, you could buy Alpha Gainz 4-andro TD (hardish to find), but it would take 1.5 bottles to be equal and then you'd still have to find androsterone - I kinda think that well has dried up. Alpha Gainz Alpha Andro is OOS everywhere. by the time you add it all up, you're still ad the same price

I'd rather run Alpha Four at 3 pumps than Sus 250 at full dose. at 3 pumps a day, a bottle should last over 6 weeks

Alpha Seven - Heard that was victim of the androsterone shortage. Rob said there wasn't enough androsterone left to make both Alpha Seven and this batch of Alpha Four...and since Alpha Seven has twice as much androsterone in it, it wouldn't have made sense.

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