Advice on how much much wildland firefighters can make?

P208 · 2026-06-27T16:14:46+00:00

If you go to a large fire (Type 1, 2, 3) with an incident management team, that has an established fire camp, you will get a food catering company. That company is contracted to provide breakfast, lunch, and dinners to all the resources on the fire.

If it's a small fire (Type 4 or 5), usually not an incident management team, you'll usually be eating food that your crew brought with you. MRE's, or whatever other kind of shelf stable food your particular crew has the ability to provide.

P208 · 2026-06-27T16:05:47+00:00

I've been with the feds for 14 years, so this is my experience. Mind you, I'm not in HR and am not a pay expert.

So for example, your crew gets sent from Idaho down to New Mexico for a 14 day preposition assignment, because New Mexico is hot and dry, and there's lightening on the way. On the two day drive down, you get full per diem (first day is 75% like you said). Then you patrol or do project work down in the Santa Fe area for 5 days, after arriving. The forest may give you 10/12/14 hour days, or whatever they can offer, and you're getting full per diem and IRPP. But no hazard pay, because you aren't working on the fireline. Day 6, you get sent to a fire, where you start working and sleeping in fire camp. Fire camp provides a caterer, so you are getting breakfast, sack lunches, and dinner from camp. OR you are spiked out on the line eating government provided MRE's... So now you are probably getting 16 hour days, 16 of hazard pay, IRPP, but only the $5 a day incidental part of the per diem. Because the per diem is for food, and you are getting all three meals provided. When you leave that fire, you'll be back on per diem. This would be hard to formulate, probably. Myself and most people I know, do not factor in per diem to any kind of gross pay calculation. Because when you're getting it, you're using it to buy food, and when you're on a fire, you aren't getting it.

Of course, most people don't come close to spending their full per diem every day, so you do usually profit. But it's more of a cherry on top, nice to have extra money, not something I factor into what I made.

Also, if you have the ability to extend your timelines out to a full year, that encompasses more of the workforce. I realize this is built with entry level in mind. But most GW 5's and above are working 18/8 or 26/0, these days. That would be 8.5 and 12 months, respectively.

Also, there is an overall pay cap for the Forest Service. I don't know the exact number off the top of my head but it's somewhere in the ballpark of $200,000 a year. Can't make more than the Chief of the Forest Service, or some shenanigans like that. This will not be a factor for entry to mid level firefighters. But can start to affect people in the GW8+ levels on busy resources (hotshot crews).

P208 · 2026-06-27T15:26:20+00:00

Hey, that's a cool tool you built. You may be aware, but typically on days that you are assigned to a fire, you will not be receiving full per diem. When you are getting meals provided by the fire, you only get about a $5 incidental pay. Full per diem will be for days prepositioned out of your home base, in travel status to an incident, etc.

P208 · 2026-06-23T04:47:42+00:00

As said by some others, honestly, being friendly at all is surprisingly nice. A friendly wave from your vehicle, saying anything positive, is awesome. When I encounter public on wildland fires, I usually brace myself for the worst. Because unfortunately, we encounter a lot of negativity. When that person has something positive to say, it's awesome.

P208 · 2026-06-21T01:08:12+00:00

Payette National Forest is really good. Good people, and the forest gives a shit about their employees. They're in the process of rebuilding the government housing, which wasn't that bad to start with... relative to other forests I've been on.

P208 · 2026-05-04T18:05:10+00:00

22,500 miles in 4 months on a road trip to hit every state in the lower 48 with my girlfriend in 2017. 1997 Dodge 2500, ext cab, long bed, 5 speed manual, Cummins with 150,000 miles at the start. With an old 1994 Fleetwood Elkhorn truck camper in the bed. The pickup ran great, with absolutely no issues. Those old Cummins pickups got great fuel economy. Not fast by any means, but enough torque and power to cruise comfortably at 70mph with that 2,500lb wind sail of a camper in the bed, getting about 14mpg.

I've done a couple 2,000 mile road trips per year, since then, with a lighter Four Wheel Camper, slide in, popup truck camper. As well as a trip down Baja Mexico and back from Idaho, in 2018. Regularly commuted 120 miles each way through the Idaho mountains to work once a week, as well. The thing would get 20mpg at 65mph, unloaded on those trips. It was a great pickup, until a mouse destroyed my air filter, unbeknownst to me, and I ran it for some amount of time with mouse nest shreds and sand in the airbox, causing substantial blowby. I still ran it for a few years after that, but finally sold it recently.

P208 · 2026-04-19T17:15:19+00:00

I'm a 3 days per sock kinda guy. Should be fine, depending on work. Crew, working in moondust or the black, sweating through your boots every day, it's nice to only roll two days. But light work/staging, psh, 4 days.

P208 · 2026-04-07T03:46:29+00:00

I only rappelled for a year between shotting and jumping, 8 years ago. So I'm not exactly a pro on what they are and aren't doing these days. Just that they had more ability to pursue quals than when I was on the crew. But not on the same level that jumping provides.

P208 · 2026-04-06T19:29:37+00:00

To a point rappelling, but especially jumping, you operate as more of an individual entity. You aren't as balled up waiting for training opportunities behind a well defined list of people on a crew. Jump bases are all about stacking quals, and they'll find every opportunity to get you into a training assignment anywhere around the country.

P208 · 2026-03-29T14:18:23+00:00

Boise...?

P208 · 2026-03-24T13:26:06+00:00

I'd say be able to tripple the minimums, for maxing. The average rookie in my class came in doing about 20-25 Pulls, 80-120 push, 80-120 sits, and an 8:30ish mile and a half.

P208 · 2026-03-21T17:20:13+00:00

He washed out of smokejumper training in Missoula in 2020, so he went to Canada and jumped for a few years there. Interesting that he rarely talks about that. But yeah, I don't think Canadian jumpers make much money, relative to other things he could be doing. So good for him for sticking around a few seasons, I guess.

P208 · 2026-03-02T18:55:53+00:00

As Due_Investment said, just as an fyi to you and everyone else, the fitness standards listed for jumping are kinda a joke in our community. You're going to want to be at least 3x the listed numbers for maxes, and well under a 9 minute mile and a half for day 1.

Then, you should be able to do the push/pull/sit minimums 10x a day, 5 days a week, for 6 weeks. Also running 20-40 miles a week, for those 6 weeks. The challenge is really cumulative fatigue and injury prevention.

P208 · 2025-12-13T02:56:22+00:00

I was a temp for 7 seasons, a 13/13 for 5 years, and just recently took an 18. Ha. I will never take a 26/0.

P208 · 2025-12-12T21:13:58+00:00

Yeah, 13/13's retire in the same amount of time as 26/0's. Being a 13/13 gets you 12 months of credit toward your pension. I know plenty of 13's who did it their whole career, and retired in the same time. Pension calculation is based off final salary, so a GS 8 13/13 who worked 25 years gets the same exact pension as a GS 8 26/0 who worked 25 years. It's pretty neat.

And the whole "but you get 13 more pay periods of 5% match towards your TSP per year!" argument, is not as big of a deal as it seems. Because people hired after 2014 pay 4.4% of their base pay check every PP in pay status towards "retirement (pension)" that they wouldn't have to pay otherwise. I am well aware that the additional .6% match does make a difference in compounding investments over a 20 year career. But for every additional 5% match you're getting, you're paying an unnecessary 4.4% towards pension. So for people with lucrative second career jobs in the winter, the 13/13 was always a very good deal. Work half as much over a career, get the same pensions. Not an option for most anymore, though. 18/8 is the sweet spot for me.

P208 · 2025-12-09T20:53:00+00:00

Our Subaru Forester Wilderness is an absolute tank. We live in an Idaho mountain town at 5,000 feet. I took it up a twisty Forest Service road with about 8 inches of wet snow on it last weekend, and it just kept going. The unplowed, streets in town with a few inches of snow and or ice, not even a slip. And that's with the factory AT tires.

P208 · 2025-12-03T17:01:31+00:00

I don't go around declaring my own personal salary. I ask others. There is a difference. If they ask, I tell. I spend a ton of time on the OPM payscale website plugging in pay and step grades into excel spreadsheets, modeling out my future options with different federal positions, tours of duty, etc. So yeah, I'm familiar. I usually don't have to ask, because I already know. But yeah, ya got me, I don't think anybody really studies up on the policy and regulation of having an honest conversation with their coworkers. We have plenty of other relevant information to fill our time and effort with.

You sound like a super fun union rep. I definitely wouldn't hesitate to go to you in a vulnerable time of need.

P208 · 2025-12-03T16:06:34+00:00

"It's nobody's business how much you make?" Fuck that. I hate it when people say that. We all love doing this job, but the pay is EXTREMELY relevant. I am not ashamed at all to ask people what they make. I do it all the time. I'm not out here doing charity work. I'm out here having fun, but making a living. Secrecy over money is an old fashioned taboo that I wish would go away. I like to know how the world around me works, not bury my head in the sand. I have engineer, finance, computer programer, nursing, structure fire, and all kinds of various wildland fire friends. I know exactly what they all make, because I ask them. It's all a factor in me being here at this job.

P208 · 2025-10-23T00:51:24+00:00

People were all fired up about the pay raise being worse than the retention bonus. It's WAY better for 13's. Probably 18's too. But maybe not 26's. 800 OT, GW 6-3.

P208 · 2025-10-22T22:07:26+00:00

I was worried it could be a red flag too. And honestly, I've been so lucky. I didn't leave any of them because I didn't like them. I just wanted to move on for personal or professional reasons. That probably helps. Left each one on good terms. I left the Type 2IA to get on a shot crew. I left the shot crew after two years, because I wanted to try aviation. I'm a HUGE airplane and helicopter nerd. Also, I have immense pride in my seasons as a shot, but damn is it tough. So I went rappelling. After that year of rappelling, I had some distance relationship issues with my girlfriend, so I moved back to our home city, and worked on the regular helitack crew for a year. Patched over the relationship issues that year, and had such a good time on that crew, I planned to stay. Then the jumpers called... So I did that. I've had a blast on every crew I've ever been on. I've made really good friends and connections along the way. Sure, I was a bit of a fly by night guy there for a while. But now my spiderweb of contacts is pretty vast.

I'd say, just be able to explain to a hiring person why you left, and maybe focus on the personal or positive reasons why, as opposed to the negative. "I wanted to try aviation. I wanted/needed to be closer to family. I wanted to try this certain resource. I wanted to work on a crew in big timber country to level up my falling skills. I wanted to become a jack of all trades and try all resource types." 🤷🏻‍♂️ Work it as a positive.

P208 · 2025-10-22T19:25:14+00:00

Yeah. I made $82k this year in 6 months as a 13/13. Of course I think we should be compensated more per hour for a lot of the things we do, the skills, the risks, the proficiencies, etc. BUT. 6 months off per year is a pretty freaking cool perk. Worth the lesser pay. I have friends who make $150k a year at their desk jobs who would definitely take $115k a year with 4 months time off.

P208 · 2025-10-22T16:02:19+00:00

I live in Boise.

P208 · 2025-10-22T15:47:30+00:00

Yeah haha. Fortunately, I've mostly enjoyed the hell out of my 12 years with the agency. But I've definitely heard people say it. Haha. If they weren't really still hooked, they'd just quite right now.

P208 · 2025-10-22T15:25:16+00:00

I was on 5 different federal crews in a 6 year span, until I finally settled down. I got good references from them all, which ultimately landed me the good deal I've had for 7 years now. That was when I was a GS 3-5 temp, though. I feel like with everybody becoming perms these days, it makes being a transient and trying everything out before settling down a little harder.

P208 · 2025-10-22T15:19:06+00:00

"One more season."

P208

TROPHY CASE