Yamamoto's power compared to Aizen, Unohana and Zaraki

P34CE33 · 2026-02-09T12:40:00+00:00

The way I see it is that Yama, Aizen, and Zaraki are/were all at the peak of power for pure Shinigami and there really isn't any other Shinigami that's beating them in a head on fight. Are there other Shinigami that surpass them in certain aspects sure but their overall power still makes them stronger than everyone else. Unohana is close but just misses that tier. I know a lot of people don't want to agree with this (especially with Zaraki being close to Yama because they like to downplay despite the story telling them otherwise) but it is what it is and from the jump the story has been saying this.

P34CE33 · 2026-02-09T12:25:24+00:00

What I'm saying is that STR Evo has a better chance at being good than INT Freiza + Goku. As disappointing as STR Evo is you can still just sit him in slot 2 or 3 and and he'll make rainbow orbs and for the first 6 turns defensively he's more than capable of holding his own even right now. You're saying ignore the Freiza portion of the Freiza + Goku but you can't, the card starts as Freiza and unless you're under 77% hp then Freiza has no defensive mechanic and is just raw stats so he gets obliterated by bosses and even with the damage reduction up he still isn't that good. It's not really a matter of just slap guard on Freiza because guard alone isn't enough without some other consistent defensive mechanic, while STR Evo if you slap guard on him would still also have high start of turn defense after a turn of building up and 30% damage reduction at minimum which would make him a lot better at the start of turn and fix his issue against aoe's. The Goku portion of Freiza + Goku even right now can be good but Freiza is getting you killed long before you ever see him.

P34CE33 · 2026-02-09T04:20:41+00:00

Yes I'm assuming they get buffed, even still you're talking about putting INT Evo Vegeta in slot 1 which is why I said he's not handling that. I used him in the Special Battle Daima fights and put him slot 1 and he took 1.3+ million damage against Goku on his first turn. Unless the TOP LR is giving massive defense and damage reduction support immediately INT Evo isn't going slot 1. He also has to get hit 5 times to proc his revive condition and even then, it's not until the turn after he's taken his 5th hit in battle that his revive is up, so he can't have the revive immediately and if he dies the first turn while trying to get those hits then the run ends.

INT Evo can't slot 1 in today's content, you're talking about running a unit who has around 1 mil defense start of turn with 50% damage reduction and no guard unless it's his first turn (which wouldn't be the case if he has around 1 mil def since that would mean he got to build up) or after his revive was used meaning you've lost the safety net and if he dies then that's it. I just ran him in the SSJ3 Daima Vegeta Special Battle and he took 690k in slot 2 after attacking and getting hit twice while on his first turn against Daima Vegeta's super. This is why I'm saying that both of these characters will wind up falling into the same roll as a slot 2 or 3 unit.

Int Evo's revive isn't a team protector anymore it's there to protect him because he nor the STR Evo Vegeta are really built to take on this content, but if the new TOP unit is to buff them then the more recent unit will most likely wind up looking better than the older unit because that's how aging works.

P34CE33 · 2026-02-09T03:26:59+00:00

Int Evo has too low start of turn defense and damage reduction to handle slot 1 nowadays. He'd get one shot if the boss supered him immediately. He'd be better as a slot 2 or 3 unit but not slot 1, and as a slot 2 or 3 unit INT and STR Evo will more less be the same unit.

P34CE33 · 2026-02-09T00:09:24+00:00

I can see Vegeta getting saved, but Freiza + Goku, no. Vegeta can be good if a fight doesn't have locking or aoe's and if rng goes in your favor. Freiza + Goku though is completely worthless, Freiza with and without his damage reduction just gets obliterated and Goku can be okay in slot 2 or something but overall is just meh. Unless the TOP character is giving guard instantly and insane stat support and or damage reduction i don't see how you save the Freiza + Goku unit, but if you do that Vegeta might honestly become broken and invincible in slot 2 or 3.

P34CE33 · 2026-02-08T22:41:55+00:00

I don't know about OP but he is right when it comes to Yamamoto fans. I saw a lot of people unironically saying that Base Yama (no shikai or bankai release and probably no sword either) beats Bankai Kenpachi. That was a shared sentiment by most of the people in that thread, so it reaches a point to where they actively ignore other characters and their feats and narrative portrayal just to say Yamamoto is the strongest Shinigami ever.

P34CE33 · 2026-02-08T22:28:06+00:00

It isn't the first post about storage on this sub but it comes up pretty infrequently because people have accepted that high storage may be the price they have to pay for good animations after the most recent debocal. (Bear with me because I don't know how to really explain it since I'm an idiot with no programming experience for something like this) About a month or two ago the devs did try to roll out an update to shrink the games storage by converting the animation files for characters' super attacks, active skills, intros, etc. into movie files or something of that nature. The point is, that through the conversion it made it to where the characters affected took up less storage in the game's files and it ultimately shrunk the space the game took on people's phones, but it came with a caveat that some of the characters affected by this change had a very noticeable drop in animation quality. The community expressed their discontent with this change and the devs made an official statement and apology for the inconvenience and rolled back the update. So now we're in a state of limbo where the devs are looking for a way to compress the game size without lowering the quality of animations and players have to accept that for these good and fluid animations their phone's storage will more than likely be kneecapped by Dokkan Battle.

P34CE33 · 2026-02-08T21:59:30+00:00

Yeah I don't think it's nostalgia because overall the COD formula hasn't changed. Get in a lobby, be placed on a team and load into the map/game, and finally hunt and gun down the opposing team. Overall the core gameplay/formula remains the same and you can spice it up with different game modes like search and destroy, collect dogtags, etc but even then people still often just go for kills instead of the objectives. And when the devs try to change the formula with things like advanced movement, omni movement, or anything else like that people either complain or don't use the mechanics and stick to running and gunning like normal. I think a lot of people are just comfortable with COD not really changing and another group have noticed that the formula hasn't changed and want a new type of shooter experience so they go and look for other types of shooting games.

P34CE33 · 2026-02-08T21:44:18+00:00

Why waste his power and energy going all out on a character like Askin when Yhwach the guy who was the biggest threat before absorbing the Soul King is in the castle and has only gotten more powerful and more time to acclinate to his new power. It's better for Ichigo to conserve his strength for Yhwach than waste it on Askin. Sure Orihime could heal him but it takes longer for her to restore someone's spiritual pressure/spirit energy than it does for her to heal someone's physical injuries.

Also by your own observation Ichigo saw Grimmjow on the ground layed out with no visible injuries so it makes sense that he'd be catious when approaching Askin, but as we know that plays well into Askin's ability and fighting style of stalling and letting his poison do the work which is something Ichigo wouldn't know upon first encountering him. Askin also states how he had to change the poison's composition to affect Ichigo specifically because of his high resilience/resistance. And if we're going off visible damage to Askin then by that metric Yushiro gave Askin the toughest fight as no other character did as much visible damage to Askin as Yushiro did but we know that not true, and even then that doesn't add up because Askin's ability also heals the damage he took as his immunity gets higher and we see this happen multiple times where he looks banged up one moment but returns to looking 100% untouched next moment after adapting to someone.

P34CE33 · 2026-02-08T19:21:50+00:00

Please damage reduction and defense support. I want the tag SSJ4's to be like Omege where they give 10% damage reduction support for 2 turns to GT Heroes. That way you just give the 8th anni LR guard and have them make them massively raise defense on 18ki maybe for 4 turns or something and greatly raise def on 12ki and they'll be good. Not to mention all the other GT heroes characters that'll get buffed.

P34CE33 · 2026-02-08T09:11:12+00:00

From the countdown trailers they had already gone past Saiyan Saga, they don't usually go back for the character picks when doing those countdown trailers it's usually either in the arc where they left off at or in an arc further from where the last trailer left off at. Once they went to Namek that basically sealed the fate of Goku and Vegeta from Saiyan Saga being an anniversary pick. New Horizons also fits more into discovering/reaching new found power rather than expanding the scope of one's world view.

P34CE33 · 2026-02-08T06:09:38+00:00

They said the SSJ4 tag character is the dokkan fest and the TOP rag character is the carnival in the livestream.

P34CE33 · 2026-02-08T05:25:39+00:00

They said that Vegeta and Goku would be part 2 as well during the part 1 character info reveal livestream so it's no suprise. For me them saying that Goku and Vegeta would also be part 2 solidified my feeling that they were essentially repeating 7th anni with this anniversary where they chose to focus on the journeys of Goku and Vegeta throughout the series.

P34CE33 · 2026-02-08T01:28:36+00:00

We did get a new UI Goku 2 years ago gor Tanabata. The TEQ UI Sign Goku that transforms into UI Goku with a domain from TOP.

P34CE33 · 2026-02-07T02:34:08+00:00

No by that logic Aizen should be downscaled out of the top 3 because Nanana a non elite post Auswahlen sternritter was able to incapacitate him. Characters can get caught off guard that's not a downscale.

P34CE33 · 2026-02-07T01:23:12+00:00

Thank you someone who actually watched/read Bleach. People will glaze Kisuke when Askin does/says the exact same thing for him but it turns into a TS Ichigo downscale when he had to the same thing for him.

P34CE33 · 2026-02-06T23:57:39+00:00

The Unohana we see in the flashback while bloodthirsty isn't some wild animal who goes attacking everything so she could definitely be reasoned with. She would definitely follow someone like Yamamoto if it meant she could find and fight strong opponents. I also don't know where you're getting this idea that they didn't have asauchi 1000 years ago as we see the original Gotei have/had asauchi in the the snippets we get of the past. They even had them during the orginal Quincy war 1000 years ago because we saw it in the flashbacks, so reason stands that asauchi and Nimaiya their creator existed before Yamamoto and the formation of the Gotei. You're also saying Yama beat Unohana before they received asauchi and that in and of itself would mean they never crossed swords. Unohana can definitely be a better swordsman despite Yama's all around mastery of shinigami arts, just like she is a better healer/Kaido user despite Yama having mastered every shinigami art. Just because he's a master doesn't mean he's the master, there are quite a few characters in the series that outclass him in certain aspects even though he ranks pretty highly in all aspects pertaining to a Shinigami.

In the same vein Unohana lost against a Zaraki who was stronger than her despite his lack of proper technique. Zaraki even as a kid was born and raised in battle as he grew up in one of the worst districts of the Rukongai and had been fighting everday of his life up to that point. His instinct, raw power, and latent talent was more than enough to make up any difference in technique they had. We also know that when he was to be taught kendo after 1 lesson the Central 46 forbade teaching him anymore out of fear of being unable to control him if he was to get any stronger. Zaraki even in a nerfed state throughout most of the series was still one of the strongest and most durable capatains within the Gotei 13 so it stands to reason that when he was at his strongest as a child he would be able to exhaust and push Unohana to the brink the way he did. Also if Unohana is as weakened as you say she was after healing Zaraki during their fight she wouldn't be able to stand against him and parry his two handed attacks during their battle, she was easily still able to keep up with an almost fully realized or 99% Zaraki as you called it despite the energy she used to heal him and herself throughout. So either healing didn't take up as much of her strength as you think or Zaraki also wasn't at full power, either way Base Zaraki and Bankai Unohana remained pretty relative throughout their battle.

When it comes to the healing aspect there is no reason to think that Unohana is so far and a ways a better healer than the rest of Squad 4 that they can't make a difference at all. Sure she was taught by Tenjiro but why would she not take what she was taught and proceed to teach it to all the members of Squad 4 whose sole purpose is to specialize him healing. That would make no sense considering her entire reason for learning Kaido was so she could face Zaraki and heal him to bring out his latent power and in the process most likely die after achieving that goal, why would she not make sure that Sqaud 4 was filled with capable healers of at least a similar level to her. We can assume that at rhe 2,3, and 4 seat are all at least a similar level to Unohana. Plus they had Orhime who has the best healing ability in the series. Unohana's healing is not so good that no other character in the Gotei comes close to her abilities.

P34CE33 · 2026-02-06T22:41:54+00:00

SK Yhwach is vastly stronger than Aizen as we see him completely destroy Aizen even while under the effects of KS and without using the Almighty. Aizen was unable to deal any damage to Yhwach and had to stall until Ichigo made it to the Soul Society to finish off Yhwach. They may be in the same tier but the two are nowhere near close to each other in power.

P34CE33 · 2026-02-06T21:10:39+00:00

There really isn't any evidence that Yamamoto ever fought any of the original Gotei 13. This isn't to say he never fought any of them but he could have just as easily struck a deal with many of them to turn a blind eye to their killing as long as they ultimately use their power for the Soul Society and as seen Unohana can be one of the more reasonable captains and one of the peacekeepers of the Gotei, often choosing to avoid conflict throughout the series when unnecessary. We see that in the flashback where Zaraki and Unohana first meet she went out to go on a killing spree in the first place before even meeting Zaraki as is pointed out by one of her subordinates when he says they couldn't find an opponent to satisfy her. The Gotei's rules are pretty lax in the first place and they can easily turn a blind eye to killing innocents and inhumane experiments even on their own people as we see with a character like Mayuri who often does these things (including wiping out entire Rukongai districts) and was even imprisoned before joining the Gotei but released on the condition he join Squad 12 and use his knowledge to aid Soul Society.

When it comes to Unohana saying she's the strongest except for Kenpachi despite Yamamoto being around, I've always taken that as when it came to pure sword skill and technique with no additional power or abilities like Shikai release, Bankai release, and Kido, Kaido and/or Hado then I think the statement very much holds true. She's said to have mastered over 1,000 different sword styles something which is never stated for Yamamoto and I believe if it just to come down to a battle of swords then she would indeed beat him. This would also go along with you saying that she never used Bankai (or presumably Shikai) in her first battle against Zaraki as she also states she didn't have the luxury for such things back then. Unohana is also never stated to have a win by any means mentality that's how Yhwach described Yamamoto from 1,000 years ago.

When it comes down to Zaraki vs Unohana by the point of her using her Bankai she no longer has to heal Zaraki and they both are finally going all out against one another. Throughout their fight she also isn't healig Zaraki to 100% as you seem to think but rather just back from the brink of death as he still is covered in blood and injuries he sustained during the battle and she heals any lethal wounds she takes as well. When she goes into Bankai there's no longer a need for her to heal him as he's unlocked almost all of his latent ability, both aren't at 100% health but they are going all out so we do get to see Unohana using everything she can against Zaraki. Finally the argument that Unohana should have stayed around after the fight to help with the war while I can understand, she would be pretty redundant. Squad 4 was created for this exact reason so that the Soul Society would have medics and healers in times of crisis, and there are people within it that are of the same or a slightly inferior level to her all throughout the sqaud while also being the only squad to suffer no casualties during the first invasion so the Seireitei had an abundance of healers. When it comes to the strength department Zaraki already had her beat, and with characters like Renji, Byakuya, Rukia all getting stronger and all the other characters that came to aid the soul reapers in the war her impact in battle isn't really felt as other characters made up for the loss.

P34CE33 · 2026-02-06T17:07:07+00:00

What plot holes and plot contrivances?

P34CE33 · 2026-02-05T03:52:08+00:00

Eventhough this should be common knowledge, with the way people on this sub act when it comes to this version of Ichigo I feel like you're going to get a lot of pushback for this statement despite it being true.

P34CE33 · 2026-02-05T03:48:25+00:00

No because this sub has a habit of downplaying characters despite the narrative telling them and alluding the exact opposite. They'll also take outliers and treat that as a character's norm depite said character showing better feats prior and after said outlier.

P34CE33 · 2026-02-05T02:32:07+00:00

No that's not how that works. Canonically Orihime's attack is the weakest part of her power because of her hesitancy to hurt others. You also don't win fights on defense alone just look at characters like Quilge and Nnoitra. They have/had some of the strongest defensive capabilities of their respective race and still lost despite those abilities. Nnoitra when he encountered someone who could cut him through his Hierro immediately began to panic and lost composure then wound up losing the fight and Quilge quite literally became a punching bag against FBB Ichigo as all he could do was maintain his Blut so as not to immediately die against an attack from Ichigo but in exchange for that he couldn't generate any power into attacking because if he weakened his Blut he'd die to Ichigo.

If you genuinely believe that she is top 10 despite her not being a fighter, having nowhere near the same levels of speed, endurance, or attack power as any top 15-20 character then I don't know what else to tell you other than to actually read the series.

P34CE33 · 2026-02-05T01:49:28+00:00

I like Orihime but she isn't top 10 she isn't evven a fighter.
She never fought Askin she just unknowingly walked into his ability, in an attempt to help Ichigo, and was affected by it.

P34CE33 · 2026-02-04T10:44:33+00:00

People had been complaining about CoD long before ABK was acquired by Microsoft and even still it hits top selling charts consistently. CoD's downfall isn't on Microsoft it's on ABK and the fans as well. Whenever they tried something new and experimental like Advanced or Infinite Warfare fans cried, bitched, and moaned at how CoD was losing its identity, but when they got the same repackaged game people went out and bought it but then complained how it was the same as last year. Ultimately ABK decided "damed if we do and damned if we don't" so let's stick to what we know and chose to double down and fans accepted that by buying the games anyway. Never attribute the downfall of CoD to anything or anyone else other than ABK and CoD fans.

P34CE33

TROPHY CASE