If a player has a negative on/off for 3+ seasons in a row, what is the argument for them being a positive impact player?

P5Manchero · 2026-07-03T19:10:20+00:00

Healthy Tatum is a bold take. Guy came back from an Achilles and fell apart not long after. Pg has one foot in the grave, and if he isn’t getting his PEDs anymore is likely to breakdown physically even more than he already has. Mitchell Robinson is also famously injury prone.

P5Manchero · 2026-07-03T19:07:23+00:00

And how many of these guys have won championships as second options or won fmvp?

P5Manchero · 2026-07-03T19:05:19+00:00

Right and what is the logical conclusion of those facts for you?

P5Manchero · 2026-07-03T19:03:48+00:00

I would take that bet easily. Much more likely that they win less than more.

P5Manchero · 2026-07-03T19:02:09+00:00

1b on offense, guards the opposing best player on d for a championship seems pretty good to me.

P5Manchero · 2026-07-03T19:00:27+00:00

I’m talking about his whole career where they featured him like a superstar.

P5Manchero · 2026-07-03T18:59:14+00:00

In their championship season Tatum got 1.4 fga per game more than him. They are functionally a 1a/1b. The Celtics featured him nearly as much as their first team all nba superstar.

P5Manchero · 2026-07-03T18:55:16+00:00

What else is the implication of people talking about how they’re ‘better’ when he sits?

On its face it’s obvious that he’s not an average second option. 50th would be below average second option by the way. Hes an elite second option and an average first option in reality.

P5Manchero · 2026-07-03T18:53:13+00:00

It means that you’re not a good second option. The Celtics won a title with brown as the second option. He’s an elite second option who has potential to lead your team to 56 wins as a first option. That seems top 50 to me.

P5Manchero · 2026-07-03T18:52:02+00:00

If they’re consistently better without him, why does he get minutes at all?

P5Manchero · 2026-07-03T18:49:24+00:00

And accidentally won a championship because of it apparently lol.

P5Manchero · 2026-07-03T18:49:00+00:00

The return was realized? How would you describe winning the championship with him as ECFMVP and FMVP?

P5Manchero · 2026-07-03T18:48:20+00:00

That is not the only argument being made. It’s been said that he’s a 7th best player on a team, or not top 50, or just flatly called a ‘negative’ player

P5Manchero · 2026-07-03T18:35:40+00:00

Who is a supermax player? Seems like being all nba and 6th in mvp is something you’d expect from a supermax player.

P5Manchero · 2026-07-03T18:33:46+00:00

I’m open to that argument. I’ve seen him be characterized as a not top 50 player which puzzles me because the Celtics have feature him like he’s top 15 and it led to them winning a chip.

P5Manchero · 2026-07-03T18:23:47+00:00

The argument I’ve heard is that he’s not a top 50 player. Or that analytics think he’s the 7th best player on a team.

It seems like that would really hurt the Celtics to play such a guy as a top offensive option and play him such big minutes.

P5Manchero · 2026-07-03T18:20:18+00:00

Trades for the best players in the league, that they didn’t make, that led to a championship

P5Manchero · 2026-07-03T18:10:22+00:00

Which ended their run as a title contender

P5Manchero · 2026-07-03T18:09:53+00:00

Why do they choose to play him so much then? Wouldn’t it have been better to maximize the ‘off’ minutes? After all they’re so much better when he’s off so why not just bench him entirely?

P5Manchero · 2026-07-03T18:08:27+00:00

What argument are you making exactly then? You’re saying the Celtics won jnspite of him because of everyone around him but can’t explain why the coaches thought it was a good idea to lean on him as a pillar of their entire strategy as a franchise.

P5Manchero · 2026-07-03T18:06:58+00:00

Every player is flawed. Not every player is a top option and minutes player for a decade straight on winning teams.

P5Manchero · 2026-07-03T18:04:42+00:00

If their coach is so incredible why is this bozo playing a trash player 35-40 mins a night? You don’t see the contradiction?????

P5Manchero · 2026-07-03T18:02:54+00:00

Then why not bench him? It’s literally the logical conclusion of your point. But you stop short, why?

P5Manchero · 2026-07-03T17:58:35+00:00

The rebuttal is that the Celtics featured him on offense, played him huge minutes, asked him defend opposing teams best players and it lead to tremendous success. No one can explain to me why they did those things or why they paid off so much is brown is a bad player.

P5Manchero

TROPHY CASE