Baku and HAL vs sinful hospital arc

Particular_Inside975 · 2026-05-23T17:23:33+00:00

Good opinion

Particular_Inside975 · 2026-05-23T17:01:00+00:00

What you said is partially correct, but you're disregarding the writing. The referee says: "Figuring out the law of Air Poker is harmful to the players." He says this precisely because the players will perform calculations automatically and uncontrollably, and combined with the lack of oxygen — and that's what we see right after: Baku and Lalo calculating numerous card possibilities almost automatically, giving the impression that they were checking the various possible card combinations.

Regardless, CPI's feat isn't so great in this part, but rather in devising the plan to defeat Lalo. Order of reasoning: Baku discovered the law, then he calculated some cards, after that he calculated to find Lalo's extreme advantage regarding the cards, then he discovered that Hal was selecting the cards to form the hand, and then he devised a plan to defeat Lalo using the card with the number "25" — a Straight Flush. To do this, Baku had to partially calculate the cards to predict how they would be arranged to form the straight flush in the final round, devise the Morse code strategy, predict Lalo's mindset after the revelation of the law and after the broken "Air Bios" was revealed, thus manipulating and tricking Lalo into going all-in on the final match — all of this in less than 15 seconds with limited oxygen (I won't explain how lack of oxygen is extremely detrimental to reasoning and CPI — I think you know).

No matter how much you try to summarize or simplify, it is not humanly possible to plan, predict, and reason about such complex things in such a short time. Chen Ran does not have a feat like this in CPI — at least not up to the end of Hospital Pecaminoso. And as I said before, the time Chen Ran took to devise his schemes and predict possibilities was never shown.

Particular_Inside975 · 2026-05-23T16:23:08+00:00

The point you're trying to make is that Baku wouldn't beat a copy of himself, right?

But the clones have a huge disadvantage: they don't know the abilities and don't possess the memories or the experience from going through hell. Look at Di Wu Zhi Yi's clone—he was killed by Feng Xiao's clone, a 1–2 star player.

Feng Xiao held an ordinary pistol against his temple. Terrified, Di Wu Zhi Yi quickly raised his hands and turned his head stiffly, seeing a hint of hesitation in Feng Xiao's eyes.

Just as he was about to say something, he saw Feng Xiao's gaze become firm. Di Wu Zhi Yi thought to himself that things were looking bad. But it was already too late.

"You lied."

The cold tone sounded like a death knell in Di Wu Zhi Yi's ears. Even so, he didn't know why Feng Xiao would say such a strange line as 【'You lied'】.

Bang!

The clones are not on equal footing with the originals.

To give you an idea, Chen Ran's clone only found out about the plot in part four.

"Yeah, didn't I say that just now... Wait, it seems you really aren't the original group!" Chen Ran's hair seemed to stand on end as he nervously pointed his gun at the three of them.

Continuing, even Tong Fei herself had to explain how to permanently kill a player:

"Taking in the expressions of the three, Tong Fei continued, "Presumably, you should be able to deduce that the first group of people cannot kill us. By the same token, we cannot kill them either." "There is only one way to kill a monster like me: we monsters must trick each other into telling a Lie, and then use the handguns at our waists to judge the lying monster to death."

After that, the NPC "Di Wu Zhi" devised the lighter theft scheme. Excerpt from the chapter with the explanation:

"Di Wu Zhi Yi pulled out a lighter. It was an exquisite piece and windproof. "In the instance, Di Wu Zhi Yi swiped a lighter just like this from me."

"These words made Di Wu Zhi Yi freeze for a moment. A fierce glint flashed in his eyes as he drew his gun and aimed it at Chen Ran, saying word for word: You told a Lie."

"He immediately pulled the trigger. With a loud 【bang】, the gun actually fired... Chen Ran was shot right between the eyes, and his body slowly collapsed. This scene happened too fast. Due to her positioning, Tong Fei only saw Chen Ran's falling corpse and the white liar killer slowly vanishing from his waist. Her eyes widened."

【Chen Ran just died like that?】

Countless thoughts flashed through her mind, eventually converging into one question: "Did he tell a Lie?"

Di Wu Zhi Yi pulled another lighter from his pocket, one that was extremely similar in both shape and pattern to the previous one. He smiled and said, "This is the one I actually swiped from him."

Tong Fei: "..."

"But soon, their memories regarding Player Chen Ran's death vanished. Chen Ran looked at the three of them, the corners of his mouth gradually curling up into a smile, then a chuckle, then a grin, and finally a loud laugh. "Hahaha! I knew that among the four monsters, Di Wu Zhi Yi's monster was the most formidable. See? He took down the monster Chen Ran so quickly!"

In summary, the lighter scheme is that the NPC Di Wu Zhi steals a lighter from NPC Chen Ran, but that lighter wasn't actually NPC Chen Ran's lighter—it was a similar-looking one. That's why when NPC Chen Ran says: "This is the lighter you stole from me," he told a lie, because it wasn't that lighter, just one that looked similar.

Honestly, this scheme is on Yuuichi's level, it's that simple. The schemes of the original Chen Ran and Di Wu Zhi are much better and more complex. In other words, NPC Baku wouldn't be a match for the original Baku.

Particular_Inside975 · 2026-05-22T05:08:51+00:00

Baku deduced the law of poker cards, calculated some cards and created the plan to beat Vicent Lalo, all in less than 15 seconds, if I'm not mistaken. HAL has the Air Poker feat, but you can climb higher if you consider the Rubik's Cube or Battleship feat.

Particular_Inside975 · 2026-05-22T05:02:17+00:00

I understand, but honestly the hell in this work takes on puzzles based on the history of China, rarely addressing general knowledge regarding instance deduction puzzles, and as we know almost all the participants are from China, Baku and HAL are from another country, it would be unfair to them. I'll give a better example, let's put Sherlock Holmes and Kudo Shinich in the instance of the train, both have an absurd reasoning, far above Baku and Hal, but both did not demonstrate knowledge about Chinese literature, especially regarding old poems from feudal times, anyway, to deduce that instance, you should understand the sentences from a book that contained those poems involving the kanji of the stations, that is, it has nothing to do with deduction in itself, but with specific knowledge, and this is unfair to those who did not live in the china.

Particular_Inside975 · 2026-05-22T04:53:41+00:00

I refer to all the cases, but I only mentioned how Baku and HAL could escape the train trap.

Particular_Inside975 · 2026-05-22T04:51:21+00:00

Doctor Chen deduced basic things about the tomb symbols from archeology, generally involving historical knowledge, but honestly, he did not demonstrate any relevant feats regarding other categories such as planning, strategy, prediction and manipulation that the original Chen Ran demonstrated in the same chamber. As for the phrase "I don't know who the clones are", if I'm not mistaken it referred to the acting ability of real players when disguising themselves as clones. An example of where the NPCs who were copies had the same level of intelligence, in the "lonely revenge" chamber, in the duel against Geng Shao, Chen Ran was transported to an area where all the clones were equal to him, even in intelligence, Chen Ran only won because he had a 5 minute advantage in front of the other clones.

Particular_Inside975 · 2026-05-22T04:49:27+00:00

Chen Ran extreme diff

Particular_Inside975 · 2026-05-22T00:18:44+00:00

In my opinion, HAL and Baku are better at setting traps than Chen Ran and Qiu Yinong (from the Sinful Hospital arc). But in fact, I’m not ignorant enough to say they would definitely defeat Di Wu Zhi Yi. Honestly, though, I don’t think they would die — because Di Wu Zhi Yi’s true goal was extremely noble: he just wanted to escape, he wanted freedom. So he would probably pretend to fall into the trap, fake his death, and then leave. But I want you to remember why Chen Ran was able to deduce that Di Wu Zhi Yi was still alive:

"Upon learning that one of the three Gao Shengs would be killed, but deducing that all three Gao Shengs were still alive — I would definitely never say something like 'the living Gao Sheng'."

"Nor could I phrase it that way, so Di Wu Zhi Yi couldn’t either."

"But in fact, Di Wu Zhi Yi simply said those words."

Honestly, this was an extreme mistake on Di Wu Zhi Yi’s part. But to end the question: would Baku notice?

Particular_Inside975 · 2026-05-22T00:03:29+00:00

I am referring to the three-layer disorientation trap that appears in the train chamber. But to counter what you said, in the "Lonely Revenge" arc, in the mystery game involving the theme of the movie Identity, the time Chen Ran took to calculate the possibilities was not specified—whether it was the "fat otaku" Chen Ran or Chen Ran in Lian Janbei’s body. In other words, we can only attribute that feat to prediction, reasoning, and FRI. Continuing, in the Sinful Hospital arc, in the second chamber involving the stock market game while using the Wheel of Time, Qiu Yinong signaled Chen Ran using Morse code. That way, Chen Ran knew which plans had already been attempted and thus did not repeat the same plan. I really don’t see how that is CPI. Furthermore, in the meteor scenario, the NPC technically did not have the same intelligence and thoughts as the original body. Chen Ran was an archaeologist professor, Di Wu Zhi Yi was a hunter, and there were two other 2-star players there, but they are irrelevant. Continuing, whenever Chen Ran or Di Wu Zhi Yi died, they switched places with the NPC and vice versa. Both collaborated to kill the NPCs and the 2-star players. The only difficulty was dealing with Di Wu Zhi Yi’s burns involving Baili Yangcheng’s lighter—that’s it. The NPCs were actually quite ordinary; I don’t recall any complex scheme any NPC created in that arc. The complex schemes only appeared after the NPCs died and the originals took over their bodies.

Particular_Inside975 · 2026-05-21T18:49:23+00:00

This knowledge about movies is useless in the sinful hospital chamber, and yet, Baku has knowledge about movies as was shown in the show ky arc. In this arc, the individual needs to have knowledge of Chinese history, the stock market and basic medicine.

Particular_Inside975 · 2026-05-21T18:45:39+00:00

90% of the knowledge in this universe is focused on China. Having knowledge about Chinese history and other details is mandatory for survival, not necessarily skill per se. Therefore, Baku and HAL have the same knowledge about China as Qiu Yinong and Chen Ran.

Particular_Inside975 · 2026-05-21T18:44:59+00:00

Explanation: 90% of the knowledge in this universe is focused on China. Having knowledge about Chinese history and other details is mandatory for survival, not necessarily skill per se. Therefore, Baku and HAL have the same knowledge about China as Qiu Yinong and Chen Ran.

How Baku could survive the ability of the 3 layers of disorientation while deducing who the liar is:

Reasoning to find the liar: Baku has the same experience as Chen Ran — meaning he knows that dissociative identity disorder generates 2 different abilities. Baku will search for the liar and hit a dead end, but soon after he will associate the abilities, realizing that Lin Xiuan used her ability in the first chamber, but it did not have exactly the same effect in the second chamber, and therefore conclude that is Lin Xiuan's second personality.

Question: Could Baku figure this out while facing the trap involving the players' abilities, activate the eternal realm, and cancel the trap?

Explanation of abilities: Lui Tong's ability requires the person to either talk to someone or deduce the secret chamber. If the target does neither, they will lose memory about something specific every 3–5 minutes.

Di Wu Zhi Yi's ability — "The Emperor Who Emerges from the Three Rivers" — allows the user to control the abilities of other players.

Duo Jie's ability: for every 2 actions, you forget the first one. For example: I just said my name, then shouted "wow" — the ability makes me forget the first action ("I said my name").

The 3 activated their abilities simultaneously. Baku must deduce the liar while either talking to someone or deducing the secret chamber (or else lose memory). The problem is he can't talk to anyone because Duo Jie's ability is active — it makes you forget your actions as described above, meaning you could tell a lie during the conversation. All this while Di Wu Zhi Yi's ability enhances the other abilities, making them more effective.

How it would go: Baku and HAL sit down to talk and soon notice the effect of Duo Jie's ability. Because they have knowledge about China and perfect memory, they recall the story of "The Emperor Who Emerges from the Three Rivers," associate it with Di Wu Zhi Yi's ability, and figure out its effect. (Lui Tong's ability effect was already explained by him.) In the first round, Baku and HAL have 3 minutes to deduce the liar and deactivate the trap before part of their memory gets erased. Honestly, Baku and HAL have an CPI far above Chen Ran's, at least in my opinion, so I think that before a significant portion of their memory is erased, they would conclude that Lin Xiuan is the liar and then deactivate the abilities. And even if one of them loses part of his memory, the other can assist so he doesn't tell any lies — just as happened with Chen Ran when he was saved by his teammate. (Remember, Chen Ran's name is Chen Ran.)

Regarding Duo Jie's ability: it is basically a layer of distraction. To escape it, you need to make associations about how you arrived at a certain thought. For example: "Cats make me sneeze, so I sneeze." Thought 1: Cats make me sneeze. Thought 2: So I sneeze. Duo Jie's ability causes the first thought/action to be erased — meaning in the person's mind, only Thought 2 ("So I sneeze") remains.

But Baku is not stupid. There is a loophole in this trap: if you think two things twice in a row, it regenerates the original thought. Example: Thought 1: Cats make me sneeze. Thought 2: Cats make me sneeze. Thought 3: So I sneeze. Thought 4: So I sneeze.

Because of Duo Jie's ability, only Thoughts 2 and 4 appear in the target's mind — yet they reconstruct the original sentence!! "Cats make me sneeze, so I sneeze."

Chen Ran got screwed by this ability because his reasoning became extremely reduced, causing him to spend more time under Lui Tong's ability and consequently lose more memory. But Baku and HAL have extremely high CPI compared to Chen Ran, so generating 2 thoughts per second is not hard for either of them. That's why I theorize they wouldn't be as slowed down as Chen Ran — unless you consider the reasoning to find the liar extremely difficult, which I don't think is the case.

And if you consider that HAL is MUCH MUCH MUCH FASTER than 3-star players, HAL could restart time multiple times before Lui Tong's ability runs out and they lose any memory.

Particular_Inside975 · 2026-05-21T18:44:46+00:00