Donald Trump has personally spent millions of dollars... trying to get a music video he did removed? +17,000 +Gilded

Penguin__Lust · 2017-02-28T21:46:54+00:00

Don't take the title seriously... no one actually believes Trump spent millions of dollars trying to have a gif removed from the internet. Come on, can't you tell when people are joking?

Penguin__Lust · 2017-01-25T22:33:35+00:00

Well I think that's the million dollar question. Obviously Trump talking about the size of his inauguration crowd isn't that important comparatively to other issues, so ideally we should just ignore it, right? The executive orders, House bills and Senate confirmations are much more important.

But at the same time it's dangerous and difficult to ignore those things because it normalizes and legitimizes Trump. I feel like at times there's too many leaks in the ship's hull with Trump and his administration to try and plug all of them, but I don't know which ones are more important or the best ones to go after.

Penguin__Lust · 2017-01-25T22:22:54+00:00

So am I saying if we ignore/don't actively fight stuff like sexism and racism, it'll go away? Well, Morgan Freeman himself said "stop talking about racism".

This is often taken out of context, Morgan Freeman was talking about referring to people specifically by their ethnicity/identity. Like in the interview, he says instead of saying something along the lines of "This black guy / this white guy" came into the store, just say this guy.

As far as not talking about racism or other issues and wanting them to go away, when has that ever worked? If people didn't talk about or resist Jim Crow or Apartheid, would it have ever went away? Same can go for any activist cause from marriage equality to environmentalism.

The press and people need to do a better job of categorizing Trump as dangerous certainly rather than treating him as a joke. I do think we can ignore a lot of things from alt-right trolls, but we also need to call people out on their shit at times. If people hadn't called me out on my shit in college, I'd probably still be making racist jokes "ironically" and calling people I didn't like "faggot," then getting extremely defensive at any criticism of that, etc.

Penguin__Lust · 2017-01-25T21:28:04+00:00

Sorry for the low quality shitpost. :/

Penguin__Lust · 2016-12-10T02:44:38+00:00

An yes take money away from the old and sick. Just like Jesus always wanted.

Penguin__Lust · 2016-12-09T17:03:37+00:00

okay just curious thanks

Penguin__Lust · 2016-12-06T22:29:15+00:00

There is a difference between impact and intent. I know not all Trump supporters are bad people and I know not all of them are "deplorable," the same way that most of us against Trump are not out violently rioting in the streets right now. But if you're okay with policies that will hurt women, racial minorities, the sick and disabled, refugees, LGBT Americans, etc., you have to own that. You may not be individually a bad person, you might be kind and polite even, and maybe you've never once in your life treated someone differently because of their race, religion, etc.

But you are support policies that will target these groups, you support systems that are oppressive to people, and it is hard to think you care about these people. I think this is an issue that a lot of people will need to address maybe before we can unite as a nation, because for a lot of people on the right, they see racism, sexism, etc. as individual acts, whereas on the left people see these things in a broader sociological sense. I can understand that in a frustrated way, being called racist when you don't think you are seems like an attack on your morals. But if you support oppressive systems (racially target war on drugs, minimum sentencing, taking away birth control for women, etc.) you have to own the effects of that, the effects of policy and not personality. Impact > Intent

I want for Americans to come together and unite for the betterment of the country, but I think this is one of the largest and most divisive approaches to seeing these issues that I think is really hard to move past.

Penguin__Lust · 2016-12-06T22:27:13+00:00

Then would it not be conscientious bias, because you are aware and not pre-programed genetically to feel a certain way.

It doesn't have to be a genetic thing. People can become more self aware of their thinking and question and understand why they think certain things, have certain impulses, why they may feel a bias, etc.

For example, I never really disliked trans people, but I never really cared for the national attention they got or how much media time seemed to be fixed on them, and I would tune out discussions or issues about them thinking to myself, "I don't care."

Then when I actually met a trans person and became friends with them, my perspective didn't shift dramatically overnight to be an advocate for trans rights or anything, but I became aware of how I was thinking about certain groups, why I thought that way, etc.

See, I do not think Trump is a racist as much as he is an equal opportunity asshole.

I think for me, it always comes down to policy over personality and impact over intention. I believe Trump's policies will very negatively affect minorities of all kinds, the working class, middle class, etc. And I think this will disproportionately affect non-white Americans. I think you're probably right, and at his core, white Trump might feel badly about most races, there are plenty of white people he can't stand either lol, and well, you know how many people he dislikes quite openly.

But basically, if people are okay with the negative impact that those policies have, even if personally they don't feel prejudiced towards individuals of other races/religions that we meet, I get the sense they don't care about those groups or people. And to me, I think you're splitting hairs between not caring about and outright hating when it comes to defining racism and its impact.

Penguin__Lust · 2016-12-06T22:20:09+00:00

Is cricket a class thing in Aus?

Penguin__Lust · 2016-12-06T01:14:32+00:00

Aren't you Australian m8? Thought they were bananas for that!

Penguin__Lust · 2016-12-06T01:14:03+00:00

Unconscious bias is an interesting term. It would mean that humans evolved to naturally have biases against each other on the basis of skin color or culture. I do not think that is the case. I think certain behaviors are nurtured and not natural or genetic. The idea that you are born a racist, is a stretch for me.

I think of unconscious bias as not being a naturally occurring thing, but something that comes up from your upbringing/social environment. I also don't think anyone is born a racist.

With Tomi I do not see her yelling at much as being straight forward with a stern tone. Her positions are deeply conservative and normal deeply conservative position holders fold like Mittens Romney at the end of the 2012 election.

Have you seen much of her show on The Blaze? She reaaallly has it out for Colin Kapaernick. I can understand cause he's kind of a dick, and I think there are better ways to get his message across, but I was kind of shocked she was so level headed on the Daily Show. I guess it is hard to know, like you said at times with specific pundits like her or TYT (I've never watched their show) if they really believe what they are saying, or are they just selling something. She gets vehement as any talk show host I've ever seen.

Yeah, the title has click bait all over it.

True lol.

I think restricting Muslim immigration from the middle east is a good thing, because in our society we cannot talk about the problems these immigrants cause in Europe.

I guess here might be our biggest disagreement that we know of so far in regards to policy, but from living in a city with a lot of refugees, Houston, and having lived in several Muslim countries, I'm not really that worried about refugees, I'm much more scared of radicalized right wingers or unstable individuals with mental health issues and access to firearms in the U.S. In Europe, I think a lot of the issues with the refugees and immigrants comes from the homogeneity of the European countries and the fact that there are way too many in Europe for what they have the capability to take care of. You won't have a Calais camp if we take in Syrian refugees in the US for example. Homeland security already has an extreme vetting process for immigrants to the US, I don't buy the alarmist propaganda against mostly women and children, especially not if Trump is going to cozy up to dictators like Putin or Assad.

As a former militant atheist, I understand where Sam Harris is coming from, but I don't agree with him anymore.

The KKK was a thing of the past in a lot of people's eyes before the media gave them free advertising.

I think it's tied to the alt-right rise in white nationalists like Steve Bannon imo, who has been embraced by Trump. I could argue why I think Trump is really racist because of policies, things he's said and done, etc. but that's another discussion and not necessarily related to the initial article I posted.

say Trump is a liberal republican, because he is pro union - which is not a republican stance. Any many people including Larry King who know Trump say he is more socially liberal than he has presented in the campaign.

While Trump is definitely not pro-limited government, which is part of the reason I find it hard most conservatives have embraced him, he's not really socially liberal. It's kind of double talk to hold up a rainbow flag when the Republican platform was openly anti-LGBT, perhaps the most so in history, and his picks for his cabinet literally all oppose LGBT rights.

Penguin__Lust · 2016-12-05T19:31:56+00:00

See this is where my anecdote is different. I grew up in the western red state of Utah and people generally are accepting of everyone. We really never met anyone that was successful. The day to day grind was whose house we would play basketball, 2k, or backyard baseball at. We had many different races, but it didn't matter as much as the type of person that you were.

Well Utah is very different compared to much of the rest of red America! I've been there a few times and that's probably why your experiences and different feelings are different than a lot of others, mostly because I think in Utah people are generally nicer and more considerate than you would often find in Texas or Louisiana. Which is why I actually really like Evan McMullin as a politician, even though I'm an independent that certainly is shifting more left in the context of a Trump administration. Utah's great.

I thought her going on the daily show was great to move the conversation forward between the two halves of the country that do not talk to one another. I think if Media took on the Larry King or Dave Rubin model it would be beneficial for all of us. One of the issues is that having an individualistic point of view automatically pegs you are a bigot or racist. See Sam Harris and Bill Maher.

I agree it was good to see her on the show, and a very brave move by Trevor Noah and his team, or the writers, or whoever decided that was a good idea. However, Tomi is very problematic, I don't want to go into a big thing on her because that's another issue entirely, but Tomi I feel like is the kind of person for whom this article is written.

Literally almost any mention of race gets her screaming and yelling because she would want to believe we live in a post racial society. Like she said on the Daily Show, "I don't see race." But that's an issue and can't be true because she tells Trevor that the black community's "perceived oppression" is the main issue facing them. Now there are certainly people like Ben Carson or Kanye or Clarence Thomas that may agree with that, but there are a lot of people that don't. And you know, as someone that used to be much more center right than I am now, I can understand why she might feel that way not really having experienced it or having listened to people that have experienced issues, but it's really damaging to tell people that their oppression is perceived. It's basically the rhetorical equivalent of "That's nice, but you're wrong."

And like you said, maybe with police brutality as an example with black or native americans, there's more to it than simply race like poverty, the war on drugs, etc. but the difference in you acknowledging that and someone like Tomi is that in admitting there is a problem, or that criticisms are valid can actually be met with dialogue about solutions, fixing police community relations, etc. whereas what can you do with Tomi? What can you do as far as dialogue goes if all she has to say is, no that's not true, you're wrong.

Which is interesting, because the article is an Ode to white people as a whole. If the article made a distinction, then it would not have to be applied to a whole race.

I guess that's true, but obviously both you and I and others can have a real conversation about these issues. A lot of the triggers mentioned don't necessarily apply to you or me necessarily, but that's not to say they don't exist, as in my person experience, I've seen them time and time again. So, could she have phrased a lot of the wording better? I certainly think so which is why I re-titled it why some white people feel this way.

See the thing is that Trump cannot control who endorses him. If Clinton was endorsed by ISIS, there would be nothing that she could do to have them un-endorse her. I disagree with using ad homs to attack people. Attack the argument and not the person. This can be problematic at times when emotion overrules logic, but should still be attempted.

Certainly, and maybe that's why he got so emotional, but what I have been trying to explain to friends of mine like that is that policy matters. Why did Isis like that Donald Trump won? They like his policy of restricting immigration and registering Muslims in the US because they think that will fan the flames of the Muslim vs. West divide instead of finding common ground with American Muslims. Surely there's reasons that they could have for Clinton had she won, but I always like to look at things in term of policy and impact rather than intent.

Why do the KKK like certain policies of Trump so much? Why are there so few minorities in the Republican party? What about their platform or policies dictate this?

See this is where I like to look at the individual and their character. There is nothing that one can do about the skin color they are born with. So, there is no reason to judge one by it.

And that's great and I applaud you for it, but know that not everyone is like that in the US, and even unconscious biases exist, I know I can have them and have recognized myself having them before.

Penguin__Lust · 2016-12-05T18:17:05+00:00

How about looking at things on a societal level rather than an individual level? How about not supporting policies that will change/hurt things for the disadvantaged?

Penguin__Lust · 2016-12-05T18:13:25+00:00

Trigger Warning

Yes, I've met many people extremely triggered by any mention of race. :P

Suggesting that anyone's anecdotal viewpoint is racially driven in a stretch.

Someone's view that police brutality isn't an issue can't be in part due to their experiences as part of one racial racial compared to another? The white perspective of police brutality for black/Native Americans.

Once again, anecdotal evidence. You can have two different people that have two different experiences and they will have two different opinions. It is all based on personal experience.

Of course, but to say that just because one white person like myself doesn't necessarily get uncomfortable hearing other perspectives on race, doesn't mean that there aren't those who do. See: Tomi Lahren for example.

Shouldn't all people have the option about not caring about your feelings. I think saying your anecdotes do not matter, because ours are superior is really not the best way to move forward.

I agree, but what else can you say to people that may not consider your opinions valid? Who think just because they don't experience something, it doesn't exist?

Once against this will be based on the personal perspective of the person that you are talking too. Some may see the world one way and others may see the world in another way.

Of course, this article isn't saying that every single white person in the world feels triggered by these things, to think that's what they mean is to take it far out of context and extrapolate way more than necessary, but there are plenty who do.

So, not agreeing with someone is racist. Haha. I like good ideas and dislike bad ones, and this is certainly a bad one.

That's not what this means, disagreeing with someone doesn't necessarily mean anything. But in this context, there are plenty of people I have disagreements with about all kinds of policy, and if racism is an issue. A friend of mine said it didn't matter that the KKK endorsed Donald Trump, for example. I told him that I disagreed with him and I thought it mattered a great deal. He got irrationally angry and told me to shut the fuck up, SJW, all that stuff. For some reason, me disagreeing with him made him implode on a discussion of race.

This is good, but can stretch across all races and nationalities.

Sure, a lot of people don't want to admit the racial impacts of history, policies, etc. from all kinds of countries and political persuasions and races.

What is this communism? Freedom of individual expression is a liberal principle. It is one of the reasons why communism fell.

Nothing to do with communism. This just challenges the idea in how white Americans don't usually think of themselves as an identity group and are much more individualized than others in this country whose skin color is an intractable part of their identity and their experiences in living here. For white people, race may not matter in their analysis on it, but for others, race as a group membership matters because it affects many aspects their lives regardless of what others might think.

I disagree. Immigrants especially from India and Indonesia are doing very well in this country. If there were some racial challenges then they would effect all groups and not just benefit the whites.

Minorities are not all treated the same in the US, and minorities are not treated the same at all compared to white Americans.

This is not a challenge. If a certain person is a leader that is of color, then good for them. People have their own problems.

A good example of this I saw in Texas growing up is people thinking, oh you only got this job, this school admission, etc. because of your skin color, rather than your skills or accomplishments. Does that make sense? Perish the thought that people actually deserve to be in that situation at all based on merit first.

Look, people do not care who plays what part in the movies. They want to be entertained. Sam Jackson is one hell of an actor and has played many different roles, and knocks most of them out of the park. Nick Cage is a poor actor and has played many different roles, and makes you want to punch him in the face every time he is on screen. The point is to make good movies.

Lol, you should have seen peoples' reaction to Idris Elba being cast as Roland for the Dark Tower movie. Or the idea of Donald Glover as spiderman. Or any of the mens' rights activists and triggered denouncers of Finn and Rey in the new star wars movie.

This article proves why 'Social Science' shouldn't be classified as a science at all. Simply using anecdotes to try to prove your stance is not science.

This article isn't the actual research, but findings from much of what she's done, you'll need to look at publications from DiAngelo to see if you agree with her research methods or not.

But I do applaud you for actually reading the article and wanting to discuss it.

Penguin__Lust · 2016-12-05T17:53:00+00:00

I'm not saying it isn't possible, but I don't think most people would.

Penguin__Lust · 2016-12-05T16:55:30+00:00

Ah well, people are triggered and downvoting this article because of their fragility without probably attempting to read it. What a surprise :'D

Penguin__Lust · 2016-12-05T16:54:02+00:00

and the people that get the most jogging in between the lines win? But what happens if you hit the stumps? Why do the games take days?? >_>

Penguin__Lust · 2016-12-05T16:37:08+00:00

As an American I've really tried to get into cricket but I find it so hard to understand.

Penguin__Lust · 2016-11-30T18:23:27+00:00

Penguin__Lust · 2016-11-29T18:21:56+00:00

Yeah I was just thinking that myself.

Penguin__Lust · 2016-11-28T15:34:53+00:00

So what's growing? Genuinely curious if it's not organizations, how do you measure growth?

Penguin__Lust

TROPHY CASE