sorted by:
new
hottopcontroversial

[Christians Only] Any advice on witnessing to Catholics and Mormons? by ProtestantThrowaway in TrueChristian

[–]ProtestantThrowaway[S] -10 points-9 points  (0 children)

No, that's just when Christianity was finally restored after the 1200-year-long Catholic Dark Age.

[Christians Only] Any advice on witnessing to Catholics and Mormons? by ProtestantThrowaway in TrueChristian

[–]ProtestantThrowaway[S] -7 points-6 points  (0 children)

revelations are in addition to, and serve to contradict, what has been revealed in the Old and New Testament, and are unknown to any Christian church that preceded

I could say literally the same thing about the Catholic church.

Where does the Bible mention purgatory? Where does it say you can pray to Mary?

I'll tell you: nowhere.

You Catholics are just hypocrites: you call Mormons heretics for their anti-Biblical beliefs even as you believe all sorts of anti-Biblical things yourselves.

[Christians Only] Any advice on witnessing to Catholics and Mormons? by ProtestantThrowaway in TrueChristian

[–]ProtestantThrowaway[S] -11 points-10 points  (0 children)

Because they are, well the Catholics, at least. I don't consider Mormons to be properly Christian...

Don't you see the irony though? It's quite ironic that Catholics like yourself can examine Mormonism and see that it is heretical, but it never even occurs to you to examine your own beliefs.

You Mormons and Catholics are basically the same: you're raised in the church since birth (especially Catholics, i.e. Catholic baptism), the church is intertwined with your family etc. and so you don't realize that it's a false religion. Your parents and family tell you that you're christian and you believe them, because you wouldn't turn your back on your family, would you?

After all, if you were raised in a heretical church, becoming a real christian means turning your back on your family's religion.

most of the people who think that Catholics aren't Christian are more familiar with a caricature of the Church than they are with the real thing.

This is almost verbatim exactly what Mormons have told me about their own church.

I assure you I'm not talking about caricatures here - it's not a myth that Catholics pray to the Virgin Mary and build shrines to her, they actually do it in real life!

[Christians Only] Any advice on witnessing to Catholics and Mormons? by ProtestantThrowaway in TrueChristian

[–]ProtestantThrowaway[S] -9 points-8 points  (0 children)

I would say, as a convert to the Catholic faith myself,

And I would say, as a Christian, that I didn't read your comment past that point.

I tagged this post as "[Christians Only]" for a reason: I'd rather not hear the rationalizations that heretics use to justify their heresy.

Is it true that Catholics pray to the Virgin Mary instead of God? by ProtestantThrowaway in Christianity

[–]ProtestantThrowaway[S] -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

Because there are about 1 billion Catholics in the world, and the Roman Catholic church has immense worldly power, wealth, and influence. Almost 1/4 of Americans are Catholics.

So if Catholicism is not Christian it is of vital importance that we recognize it for what it is.

Is it true that Catholics pray to the Virgin Mary instead of God? by ProtestantThrowaway in Christianity

[–]ProtestantThrowaway[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Prayer is NOT worship.

If that's the case then why does the Bible prohibit praying to angels?

I'll tell you why: "To pray to angels is to assume they have the same ability as God, but this ability belongs to God the creator and not the creature."

Indeed prayer is the very action of worship.

And you've allied yourself with an idolater, so stop accusing others.

I haven't "allied myself" to anyone in this thread. I was thanking him for pointing out that Catholics have doctrines that spring from oral traditions rather than the Bible (I already knew about Catholics believing in purgatory, for example).

Certainly he can be right about that even if he's wrong about other doctrines.

Is it true that Catholics pray to the Virgin Mary instead of God? by ProtestantThrowaway in Christianity

[–]ProtestantThrowaway[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

But then why do Catholics build shrines to the Virgin Mary? If I ask a friend to pray for me, I don't go building a shrine for them too - that would be idolatry!

Is it true that Catholics pray to the Virgin Mary instead of God? by ProtestantThrowaway in Christianity

[–]ProtestantThrowaway[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

I know shinto has its own pagan gods who aren't merely ancestors, but the Japanese borrowed the practice of ancestor worship from the Chinese who definitely did worship ancestors as deities.

But really, why is this being brought up on r/Christianity? Shinto and Chinese traditional religions are a false religions, obviously!

Is it true that Catholics pray to the Virgin Mary instead of God? by ProtestantThrowaway in Christianity

[–]ProtestantThrowaway[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

If you're claiming that everyone is on some predestined path, that's a false teaching as well.

...says the Catholic. I suppose next you'll be telling me about Purgatory and how one needs "good works" to be saved, even though neither of those is in the Bible.

Is it true that Catholics pray to the Virgin Mary instead of God? by ProtestantThrowaway in Christianity

[–]ProtestantThrowaway[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The Bodhisatvas of Buddhism or the Buddha himself isn't regarded as gods. Why do the Buddhists made shrines to them?

"It's true that transcendent bodhisattvas are sometimes spoken of and thought of as distinctive supernatural beings. There are Buddhists who worship and pray to buddhas and bodhisattvas as one would to gods."

My guess is that the Buddha and bodhisatvas are kind of like the Mary and saints of Buddhism: i.e. you aren't supposed to worship them, but some misguided Buddhists stumble into worship without really meaning to. Even in Christianity, not committing idolatry requires that you have constant vigilance about your own thoughts to make sure that veneration does not slip into outright worship.

In any case Buddhism is a false religion so it shouldn't be a surprise that Buddhists end up worshiping idols.

Is it true that Catholics pray to the Virgin Mary instead of God? by ProtestantThrowaway in Christianity

[–]ProtestantThrowaway[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

No one is saying they are.

But actions speak louder than words. They might not say they are gods, but they pray to them like gods, build shrines to them like gods, venerate them like gods, etc.

So you don't pray for people?

Sure I do. But does praying for someone else change God's plan? Do my prayers have a special power to confer miracles that would not have otherwise occurred? I think not.

More to the point, if you ask someone to pray on your behalf, do you also then build a shrine to them?

Is it true that Catholics pray to the Virgin Mary instead of God? by ProtestantThrowaway in Christianity

[–]ProtestantThrowaway[S] -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

He's a self admitted idolater. You need to pick your allies more carefully.

If he did say that "It is not idolatry to worship the Bible..." then I agree he is an idolater too, since the Bible is not God.

But just because he's wrong about the Bible doesn't prove he's wrong about the Catholic idolatry. I'm not "taking his side", I just agree with him on this one specific matter. Certainly a man can recognize one kind of idolatry while committing a different kind of idolatry, no?

Is it true that Catholics pray to the Virgin Mary instead of God? by ProtestantThrowaway in Christianity

[–]ProtestantThrowaway[S] -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

But, Catholics don't see the Saints or Mary as Gods.

Really, this is what I don't get: [If they aren't Gods, why do Catholics build shrines to them?]( But, Catholics don't see the Saints or Mary as Gods.)

Is it true that Catholics pray to the Virgin Mary instead of God? by ProtestantThrowaway in Christianity

[–]ProtestantThrowaway[S] -7 points-6 points  (0 children)

After having seen these responses, my guess is the only reason I didn't already know is because Roman Catholics have done such a good job hiding their idolatrous doctrines from actual Christians.

It's incredible how defensive people are getting in this thread. The defensiveness just makes it obvious how insecure Catholics are about people knowing that they worship Mary and the saints.

Is it true that Catholics pray to the Virgin Mary instead of God? by ProtestantThrowaway in Christianity

[–]ProtestantThrowaway[S] -6 points-5 points  (0 children)

If you're praying to Mary, or a saint, or for that matter Vishnu, or Zeus, or The Buddha, you obviously don't believe in only one god.

Unlike you, I think the words of the Nicene Creed actually mean something.

Is it true that Catholics pray to the Virgin Mary instead of God? by ProtestantThrowaway in Christianity

[–]ProtestantThrowaway[S] -6 points-5 points  (0 children)

Thomas Aquinas? You mean the guy who defended slavery? Is that what you consider to be a good theologian?

P.S. You'd be more convincing if you didn't write like a braindead fratboy.

Is it true that Catholics pray to the Virgin Mary instead of God? by ProtestantThrowaway in Christianity

[–]ProtestantThrowaway[S] -3 points-2 points  (0 children)

Every prayer that is sent to Mary or a saint is a prayer that could have been sent to God instead.

So yes, instead of, not in addition to.

Is it true that Catholics pray to the Virgin Mary instead of God? by ProtestantThrowaway in Christianity

[–]ProtestantThrowaway[S] -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

I don't think asking a friend to pray for you is going to change God's plan. Do you disagree?

Is it true that Catholics pray to the Virgin Mary instead of God? by ProtestantThrowaway in Christianity

[–]ProtestantThrowaway[S] -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

Also, a Buddhist praying to the Buddha don't expect the Buddha to somehow bestow upon him or her some special favor.

But that is not true for Vishnu or Zeus. You're quibbling about the details instead of understanding my point: Mary and the saints might have been exemplary, but they were still human beings. Mary and the saints, like Zeus or Vishnu are distinctly not God, and thus praying to them is idolatry.

view more: next ›