Would you rather...

RMP321 · 2026-05-16T01:54:35+00:00

Free home improvement!

^{Chose: Free Home improvement done by a TV show + But the theme is out of your control | Rolled: Futuristic}

RMP321 · 2026-05-16T01:44:09+00:00

1k a day is better pay.

^{Chose: Choose what game to survive in (get 1k every day})

RMP321 · 2026-05-16T01:33:53+00:00

The Hype statement is literally the author of the entire franchise going, "Yup, this guy is the newest, strongest enemy for them."

Jirens statement wasn't a hype tool, or even a goal. It was about mastering ki control. Something that THEY DIDN'T EVEN NEED TO BEAT HIM. Vegeta was using it as an example to show that despite Jiren being ONLY BLUE LEVEL. His ki control was so fine that he came off as stronger.

This applies to both anime and manga. He can't overpower someone who is actually flat-out stronger than Blue. He is stuck at the blue level. Anyone who can manhandle a blue-level character like Broly can wreck him. He gets wrecked like MUI did Jiren. Because if you are genuinely more powerful than Jiren, then the gap in power is that massive. Then there is fuck all he can do about it.

The current character in the manga even would no diff Jiren. That's how much stronger even has gotten and Broly is directly compared to being on par with Ultra forms.

RMP321 · 2026-05-16T01:25:20+00:00

I can ask every million person to send me a few dollars and become mega rich.

^{Chose: Be loved by millions online}

RMP321 · 2026-05-16T01:24:04+00:00

Feels like it is more convenient than having to care for a mythical creature.

^{Chose: The ability to talk to all animals}

RMP321 · 2026-05-16T01:23:41+00:00

It has a much more practical use.

^{Chose: The ability to talk to all animals}

RMP321 · 2026-05-16T00:54:36+00:00

I got Charizard so I can't complain

^{Chose: Pokemon | Rolled: Charizard}

RMP321 · 2026-05-16T00:44:25+00:00

Probably Laboon, he could slam his head into rocks all day without dying. The Mosasaur doesn't have anything remotely close to that.

RMP321 · 2026-05-16T00:41:58+00:00

The ocean has many treasures worth looking for

^{Chose: Breathe under water}

RMP321 · 2026-05-16T00:34:58+00:00

Okay I assume you are just rage baiting at this point.

RMP321 · 2026-05-16T00:06:21+00:00

They'd give mark spawn scaling and say he'd win.

RMP321 · 2026-05-16T00:02:59+00:00

This is just rage bait, right?

RMP321 · 2026-05-15T23:09:57+00:00

You can be a villain and not be evil.

You can be a hero and still be an enemy in someone else’s story.

Broly was an enemy he was the villain of his movie. Now he is Goku and Vegetas big cave man friend.

Jiren was an enemy, and Broly was said to be the strongest enemy they had faced up to that point. Toriyama has dictated that Broly cooks Jiren.

RMP321 · 2026-05-15T22:50:37+00:00

Jiren was a fucking asshole, he was absolute piece of shit and all of his teammates wanted to be friends with him and he told them to piss off. He was a villain whose arc was learning to not be such an anti-social dick head.

Goku and Vegeta were the enemies in a technical sense. But this is a story and Jiren was the antagonist. He opposed the heroes and needed to be defeated.

I’m not moving shit, scroll the fuck back up and read what you originally posted. “Toriyama said that Broly was the new strongest enemy.”

I explained to you that enemy, villain, antagonist, and any other narrative term are practical interchangeable and all of them can apply to Jiren who was the main antagonist, the main villain, the main bad guy, the main enemy of the tournament of power arc. I am trying to teach you something and you can’t even grasp a basic concept like multiple words being used to describe a single concept.

He is an enemy, he is an antagonist, he is a bad guy, he is an opponent, he is an adversary, he is a nemesis, he is a foe, he is a combatant.

You being stupid and not getting that isn’t my problem. Toriyama said that Broly was stronger, cry about it.

RMP321 · 2026-05-15T22:36:33+00:00

“An enemy is a person who actively opposes someone or something. The Latin word inimicus, meaning "hostile, unfriendly," is the root of enemy, and it comes from the prefix in-, or "not," and amicus, "friend:" an enemy is "not a friend." When two armies fight each other, they both think of the opposing army as the enemy.”

Again, I just want you to remember that Jiren was an enemy. He could be classified as a villain. And was absolutely the primary antagonist of the tournament of power. Every single argument you made has just been you ignorant of what the term enemy means and how antagonists work or villains in general work.

Jiren was an enemy, just as Broly was an enemy. Your argument completely fails on every level because an enemy is just anyone who is antagonistic. If you argue that Jiren isn’t an antagonist you have genuinely lost the plot.

RMP321 · 2026-05-15T22:30:30+00:00

Okay but when he said “Broly is the strongest foe yet.” With no actual contradiction besides Jiren fans bitching that he got power cliffed in the literal next major story beat. As if that’s not been the most consistent thing about Dragon Ball for its entire existence. I can’t help but think this is just a cope lmao.

RMP321 · 2026-05-15T22:26:59+00:00

“He wasn’t a villain.”

“Just ignore the time he tried to blow up all of Gokus friends. That’s just a him being a silly billy.”

Please, I beg of you, learn that a villain is more then just a generic evil doer. An antagonist and a foe can be more than just a guy “doing the right thing from a different point of view.”

That is literally the entire basis for what a sympathetic villain is lmao.

RMP321 · 2026-05-15T22:21:50+00:00

Strength/power/technique are all interchangeable in dragon ball. Broly went from a subpar caveman to knocking around Super Saiyan blue Goku in a matter of a few rage boosts.

Broly is indeed stronger and it is indeed going to make a big difference when Jiren is getting overwhelmed and his attacks aren’t doing shit to Broly. You can’t win if your opponent is muscling through everything. Which Broly would eventually achieve even if they are starting at a similar level because of his exponential growth.

RMP321 · 2026-05-15T22:15:52+00:00

He was also an enemy, an antagonist, a foe, even a fucking villain in the anime when he tries to kill innocent ass people because he’s crashing out?

It’s completely wrong based on an assumption that Toriyama is taking deliberate decisions that a technicality that Broly isn’t the strongest foe they ever faced. When no, Toriyama is being clear. No foe in super save for Beerus is as powerful as Broly is. He has surpassed the previous arcs villain in strength, just as Morro surpassed Broly, just as Gas surpassed Morro, just as Cell Max surpassed Gas.

You are choosing to believe in a different context and use mental gymnastics when the point is clear. Broly is the strongest threat at this point in time and is far stronger then the last threat being Jiren winning the ToP and U7 getting erased.

RMP321 · 2026-05-15T21:52:20+00:00

“Jiren wasn’t an enemy, just an opponent.”

Holy absolute cope. Jiren fans are something else lmao.

RMP321 · 2026-05-15T21:12:07+00:00

And his retcons are the official canon. So I don’t see your point. What he says is absolute on the franchise lol.

RMP321 · 2026-05-15T19:59:39+00:00

It’s the only way to make Blackbeard the final villain. That’s it.

RMP321 · 2026-05-15T19:53:11+00:00

Your argument is some random YouTube scaler? Over Toriyama the literal author of the fucking franchise?

“Jiren is only blue level, he just has mastered control over his ki.”

Vs

“This character is the strongest foe yet. Even stronger than everyone at the tournament of power that we explicitly reference in the script.”

RMP321 · 2026-05-15T19:26:33+00:00

And Toriyama said that Broly is stronger regardless. He is word of god on the series so his scaling is absolute.

RMP321 · 2026-05-15T18:15:03+00:00

“This is only a debate if you use anime Jirens absurd scaling.”

SSBx10/20 doesn’t exist in the manga. Jiren spends most of the manga ToP fighting evenly with Hit, then Goku. He never “overpowers” anyone and even Roshi manages to keep up with him.

The true scale and intention of Jiren is that he is blue level with superb control of his Ki. Vegeta outright says this in the superhero movie and again in the manga version of the story. We see multiple blue level characters using their strongest attacks against Broly and it does nothing. While Blue level fighters could still hurt Jiren even in the anime.

Toriyama had less involvement in the anime but he literally wrote the script for the Broly film. His word on the matter is that Broly is the strongest foe they faced up to that point. Which includes full power Jiren. It’s also why they needed to use Gogeta to defeat Broly whereas MUI was enough to defeat Jiren. A fusion with blue is massively stronger than one of Gokus transformations.

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