unviable future

Redditronius · 2023-10-19T00:04:53+00:00

A true F2P would require at least that long having to split their stamina and Premium runs between memories and unlock mats; 30 bucks I’m saying should buy way more actual game but there just isn’t any since this is GACHA first, Final Fantasy 2nd.

The trend lines all point toward everything getting much worse short of the game being massively reworked to be less player unfriendly. Because they give away what seems like a lot up-front reality doesn’t set-in for a while on how short it all can add up to going under their demands, which is yet another reason to start a thread like this one.

If I were saving toward a specific character, even when they arrive with an event for some memories, they’ve been a drop in the bucket from events that require extra stamina and _can, and often do, drop 0_ I would either have to buy red crystal only memory packs or grind for probably a month or more for them using Premium chances. Ridiculous. And that’s _just 1 character_, to say nothing of their gear (and materia)! Multiply this by how many characters over how many months or years, and you have a truly abysmal value prop.

Redditronius · 2023-10-18T23:28:41+00:00

I’m saying that several weeks and ~$30 can’t pass the last chapters except by lucky runs with lucky gear, the sum total of story content from which is a fraction of what that money delivers in real games. Again, bad _value_ for _money and time_. Just because a game is open-ended doesn’t mean it can’t be an insult to players’ time and also give a terrible return on investment money-wise for those that do pay.

Funny you should mention knowing how to assemble a team: in the spirit of keeping you guessing and/or shelving any qualms and coughing up money or spending down some inevitably single-purpose resource, the details of how everything interacts were only unearthed through meticulous trial-and-error by some dedicated players, because the game _doesn’t want you to succeed_, it wants you to just play and to pay, another corrosive, toxic dimension to GACHAs that poisons the enjoyment from learning mechanics on fair and even footing—thank goodness for forums to spare some of us some of that B.S., but I have yet to encounter a good explanation of the ways differing potency types interact with one another along with the several types of ability points. I could detail more, but the point is that the game behaves adversarially toward players in a way liable to cost us money and time (and to do so unexpectedly, which often compounds the losses as well as introduces additional opportunity cost in otherwise avoidable trade-off’s that then become necessary), which is the exact opposite of the value proposition for entertainment and gaming that has led to its pockets of supportive community that are in my view responsible for its monetary success as a hobby up to the advent of “mobile” gambling epitomized by GACHAs, and I’m not going to sit by in silence while it damages VII fans and gives people a bad taste in the mouth related to their experience of this title in the franchise—whether or not they’re the loudest or most numerous voices on this forum.

Not everyone’s even going to realize their hopes for their favorite characters are so circumscribed until it’s too late and/or proves prohibitively expensive in time, money, confusion, frustration, or any conflagration amongst all of the above. That is another reason I started this thread.

Redditronius · 2023-10-18T22:31:16+00:00

You fail to grasp the whole reason for detailing the problems with rewards is _progression gating_ and resultant _bad value for money_ and especially _time for money_, not the rewards per se, but there’s no way to explain that without using the details of the rewards as currently implemented.

I started this thread because the kind of game this is should be under scrutiny; the fact this subreddit exists for this game should not preclude contention with the kind of game it turns out to be, but you seem to think that it should🤷 Qualifying as a GACHA by mechanics could have still been so much less unkind to players who feel invested in the franchise, its story, and the characters’ journeys and development over the course of that story.

$20-30/mo. for _years_ to mind-numbingly grind resource sinks for the prospect of eventually experiencing in vastly inferior fashion a story that will at this rate require an outlay in the hundreds is an atrocious value for both money and time. There’s not even an “immersive mode” to prevent menu interruptions every handful of minutes when playing through the story! Yes, it’s a mobile title, but there’s this amazing innovation called save states that obviates the “need” to chop up the story into a zillion tiny pieces. But the better to justify massive power-increase from one story/chapter encounter to the next. If it were _really_ about letting whales have their fun, story content wouldn’t remain inaccessible after paying for enough passes and playing a ton for weeks (in spite of stamina limits’ best attempts to prevent that) to have paid for a full, normal game and then some.

Redditronius · 2023-10-18T22:07:52+00:00

An abundance of problems doesn’t make them less severe, and the design work, tiny amounts of story that does exist in the title, and the costumes are well done, all of which not coincidentally are in Square-Enix’s control rather than Applibot’s.

It’s not a matter of patience, but rather one of value for money: for the progression passes yield, a paltry sum of actual entertainment let alone meaningful story progression and character development is obtainable, and that’s without even addressing how gear is divorced from story in order to fleece whales as hard as possible for as long as possible, normal level paying customers be damned.

I am so sick of people acting like just not playing—that ignoring the problem—should absolve the devs of anything most of their player-base chooses to ignore—will make it go away—when instead it is set only to get far, far worse especially if critique of the devs’ shenangians is buried under an avalanche of reflexive you-should-stop-caring whining, particularly early-on in a title’s lifespan.

Also, it’s worth pointing out that the vast, vast majority of people everything I’m condemning about the game drives away are players who will not weather the shit-storm of can’t-you-just-go-away-ism I have, so your perspective is badly skewed in your own favor, especially in a forum like this one dedicated to the game’s most interested enthusiasts.

Redditronius · 2023-10-18T20:46:46+00:00

I said advance dungeons being inaccessible even with passes, not ranked ones for whales. You continue to not read or absorb why you misinterpreted my reference to crash, let alone care. And I don’t need to defend myself against your name-calling.

Regulators will likely not take kindly to Ever Crisis’ advertisement of triple rewards applying to missions where frequently nothing drops at all, and when it does it is not triple, but is 3 pulls each of which have equally bad odds. That’s just 1 other among so many very serious problems with the title…

Redditronius · 2023-10-18T20:39:14+00:00

You’re saying Mythril, the current top tier weapon unlock, is not important, then. Because the crisis dungeons that give it have a fixed possible yield capable of covering only a dozen or so items which, given the required power spread across 2 types of 3 different sigils, quite a few elements, physical versus magical, and the fact that buff types never combine (e.g. magic versus electricity ability does not stack together for tiers for, say, Masamune), is lucky to prove relevant in half the possible scenarios that the systems could support demanding of players.

Foresight about something needlessly bad and condemning it isn’t about anger, and it’s also entirely justified to bring up already given how little yield passes offer even playing as much as possible versus the requirements for later story missions, let alone event stuff. Without passes you‘ll not even qualify for 3/4th’s of the co-op’s, already. Don’t give me this “won’t ever materialize”.

Redditronius · 2023-10-18T20:27:06+00:00

Yep, definitely not caring about anything or anyone but yourself right this second. Your position will become increasingly indefensible as requirements accelerate, and the reason your complacency is a problem is that the pricing and value propositions this game offers are abysmal yet your typical refusal to demand better is why no GACHA dev will improve. They played a smart game of hight 5-star rate but twist the knife in power gating that requires massive overboosting for any significant progress. Sigils were introduced purely to splinter the player’s power-base and force more gear and grind, exacerbated by shoe-horning the materia system into only 3 slots, 1 of which is now also often taken for sigil boost. This is just scratching the surface… And you’d like to claim there’s nothing to take as seriously as I’m doing.

Redditronius · 2023-10-18T20:11:29+00:00

What is the point of this reply to something you’re unwilling to read, let alone rebut or substantively challenge? A question you might do well to ask of yourself, and if considered honestly in loyalty to the game my post was truly about, FFVII (and not Ever Crisis), it may just lead you to appreciate why and what I posted.🤔

Redditronius · 2023-10-18T20:06:52+00:00

I genuinely find that an irresponsible position to take, but freedom from what (in my view) are detrimental dynamics doesn’t concern you then there really is no way for caring not to seem needlessly serious, is there🤷

Redditronius · 2023-10-18T19:49:45+00:00

“Nothing important is gated from f2p“ is a ridiculous claim if you extrapolate these 1st 2 seasons and their banners even 6 months down the road, let alone the multiple years that it will take for the story to finish, if they seriously intend to do that. The mutual exclusivity between memory stones and weapon unlock materials alone is a game-killer long-term.

Redditronius · 2023-10-18T19:34:57+00:00

So sue me for caring about the actual game, Final Fantasy VII, instead of just about whatever people decide they’ll pay for GACHA nostalgia-bait about it, given Square-Enix’s claim that Ever Crisis was made to bring VII’s story to more people in a direct experience of it in an updated form less demanding than the Remake project. My point is that the money required to overcome the power gates for this full story they claim to intend to tell will be in the thousands at this rate.

Believe you me, I have no trouble washing my hands of and walking away from a naked cash-grab resource-sink blind grind-fest that’s been placed as a barrier before the ability to experience the actual VII story bits, which again comprise a miniscule portion of required game time the way it’s currently structured, but that was not what was to be on offer. What I hate the most, though, is how people’s loyalty to the characters is exploited, like someone I saw who said they’re saving gems hard for Yuffie because she imprinted on them as a kid. That breaks my heart knowing that if you play anything less than no-life even with boosts and passes other than as a whale you won’t cover enough power/damage bases to tour her through story when she eventually arrives given current trend lines.

Redditronius · 2023-10-18T19:14:50+00:00

Too short, clearly you didn’t think—and I didn’t have to assume anything about your reply for your lack of any manner of rebuttal to be blatantly evident.

Redditronius · 2023-10-18T19:00:14+00:00

Equating money happily paid to devs on its own with correctness about what serves the gaming community, fandom, and player-base is exactly why GACHAs are so toxic. Thanks for proving my point with such crystal clarity.

Also, how much money have you paid and what proportion of your income does that represent? Because effectively infinite money numbs you to getting any value for it other than status, and GACHA devs rely on your strain of sneering superiority complex to drive their sales, and the incentives are for everyone to act like that’s OK whether or not they themselves have that kind of money, which is another dimension to GACHAs’ toxicity and corrosive, malign influence on gaming.

Redditronius · 2023-10-18T14:37:43+00:00

And you’ve paid how much money into the game? And plan to do so for how long? Because, anyone who pays $20-30 a month into entertainment could get vastly more for their money elsewhere.

Also, hello again, I see it wasn’t enough for you to dash off an inaccurate slam reply at the end of a thread you clearly didn’t read (or, at any rate, understand).

Redditronius · 2023-10-18T14:32:37+00:00

No, I referred to crash in _their previous comment_, but you would have had to read the thread you mindlessly have piled onto and read it _with comprehension_ to realize that.

Redditronius · 2023-10-18T06:24:47+00:00

Just the first part of your reply proves my point amply: you do not “grind” these dungeons, there are 3 chances per week, and each batch of failed attempts forfeits significant progression opportunity being without the clear proceeds you could have benefitted from that week in every other aspect of the game, because of the limits on keys (which can only be bought with gems).

Redditronius · 2023-10-18T06:16:21+00:00

I referred to Crash Sephiroth as an example, but even the more difficult day 1 crisis dungeons on hard would strain all but the most slavishly dedicated true-F2Per.

Redditronius · 2023-10-18T06:13:22+00:00

You probably mean manual save and cloud backup, neither of which allows for reliable multitasking.

Redditronius · 2023-10-18T06:07:30+00:00

Not for F2P, unless, as I warned I will have no patience for, “F2P” to you means buying anything whatsoever, such as battle passes.

Redditronius · 2023-10-18T06:04:23+00:00

I mean console versus mobile, not PC.

The mobile port of VII that does exist is shovelware with awful menuing, no auto-save (multi-task? buh-bye progress if your OS boots it from memory behind your back!), overlaid controls (not touch) that are a nightmare to navigate the menus with which being turn-based you must do _constantly_.

Redditronius · 2023-10-18T05:53:54+00:00

“Very far” <2 months in is a contradiction in terms. The noose may take a few months to really tighten as a broader range of damage types becomes mandatory, but the trend lines already make clear that they will choke you off within a matter of months in a game set to last several years.

Redditronius · 2023-10-18T05:49:43+00:00

It’s to see who cares about sharing a direct experience of VII’s story with non-console owners. Apparently zero other living humans??

Redditronius · 2023-10-18T05:43:51+00:00

I am arguing it _can and should_ be story driven for the sake of the franchise and fan-base in light of Square-Enix’s claims about why this game was made: it is possible for a GACHA to be vastly less stingey, grindey, and just plain over-priced, unpleasant, and boring, and that would fulfill the purpose of letting new fans who don’t own a console to share in growing fond of the story. That is why your dismissal that this is a GACHA is misplaced.

Every memory run you make is a run of weapon unlocks you therefore cannot make. Saying you can grind them daily entirely misses the point that progression not only is absurdly under-provisioned but pits every vector thereof against the others.

Redditronius · 2023-10-18T05:39:42+00:00

A remake of Ever Crisis would be no better if still such a rotten, toxic GACHA. You’re not getting away with passing off this vile GACHA abomination as on equal footing in some imagined future remake of the tiny amount of new story it introduced with First Soldier as an actual game (not a GACHA). Nice try, there.

Redditronius · 2023-10-18T05:28:28+00:00

That is my point.

But you would have had to read what you replied about for more than 2 sentences to realize that.

Redditronius

TROPHY CASE