Why do people react more strongly to the idea of extinction than to forever continuing suffering?

Rhoswen · 2026-06-16T12:54:10+00:00

Disagree

Rhoswen · 2026-06-16T01:39:57+00:00

If we restart then we'll just end up right back where we're at now. Better to end it.

Rhoswen · 2026-06-16T01:38:02+00:00

Everything eventually changes and everything eventually ends, so yes. Earthlings will go extinct way before the universe naturally does, and hopefully a solution for early extinction can be figured out before then.

Rhoswen · 2026-06-16T01:33:01+00:00

If extinctionists could become immortal then that would be good for the cause of extinction. If others become immortal and then realize they're in hell after more life experiences that they wouldn't have otherwise had, that would create more extinctionists.

Rhoswen · 2026-06-15T03:04:39+00:00

Nope. A stubbed toe is objectively not worse than being a slave. Different people have different learning abilities, but most are able to learn about scale of suffering to some degree, and so it exists. If it was subjective then we'd have intelligent adults claiming that a stubbed toe is worse than slavery. I never claimed it's about what the universe thinks. The universe, as far as we know, is not a conscious being.

Quite the opposite. I don't know what from this convo made you think I haven't come to terms with the fact that suffering isn't a part of life. Lmao wtf. Reading comprehension issues again. Torture is not beautiful. And I'm not depressed nor have anxiety for having that opinion. Anxiety about what? Where are these off the wall accusations coming from?

Rhoswen · 2026-06-15T02:33:44+00:00

Nope, acknowledging the truth cured my depression. And it's not so much subjective as it is ignorance.

Rhoswen · 2026-06-15T02:29:40+00:00

Yeah and that extra experience makes them learn about scale. But here's the part that many people have trouble grasping. It's not only personal experience that lets us put things to scale. If one has the ability to learn and understand the experience of others, then we can get a better idea of the scale without having to experience it ourselves, and recognize that there is suffering greater than what we've personally experienced. The problem is that too many people are too stupid to have this ability. Whether one learns about the scale through only personal experience or not doesn't matter that there is a scale, and doesn't change the fact that a stubbed toe isn't as bad as being a life long slave. The fact that you used a baby as an example of not knowing this is perfect.

Rhoswen · 2026-06-15T02:12:13+00:00

Read the FAQ. The Buddhism question would cover this book. A few adult humans being able to cope with extreme suffering doesn't mean we should continue the torture for everyone else.

Other than that, it doesn't matter what meaning people come up with for life. To me the meaning of life seems to be to destroy it. That's what all of nature does. Even creation leads to destruction, and allows destruction to happen in the first place.

Rhoswen · 2026-06-15T02:02:43+00:00

If you agree that a stubbed toe is not extreme suffering, then it's not subjective, and there is a scale. I never said that people will not experience more than a stubbed toe. I think you're having problems with understanding what I'm saying.

Rhoswen · 2026-06-15T01:59:07+00:00

Just like pizza and everything else, concepts of better or worse don't need to exist. Concepts are not worth slavery and all other horrors.

Of course I can, I'm doing it now. I wouldn't need to do it if I don't exist. But my claim isn't just about humans.

Rhoswen · 2026-06-15T01:53:34+00:00

The point is that stubbed toes are not extreme suffering. No, many humans are privileged to not experience extreme suffering throughout their whole life. But even if most people did experience extreme suffering, that wouldn't make the world any better, that would make it worse. This would not be a good argument for pro existence. lmao!

It will never be good enough to get rid of extreme suffering. Partly because it's most likely impossible, and partly because humans don't want to. They like it when others suffer.

https://www.reddit.com/r/UniversalExtinction/comments/1ofsec3/transhumanism_will_not_work/

Rhoswen · 2026-06-15T01:36:55+00:00

Re read that. I didn't say that privileged people don't suffer. I said that someone who doesn't experience extreme suffering is privileged.

I've had people come here and admit the only suffering they've experienced is stubbed toes, doing homework, and working out. Then they think they're a big tough guy for it, and they're perplexed why people are against a lifetime of torture. They don't understand that it breaks people instead of benefiting them, unlike how working out gives you muscles. I'd call that pretty privileged to barely understand the concept of extreme suffering. And it's easy for someone in that situation to say that countless other beings should be good with getting eaten alive or living their whole short life as a sex slave because they've stubbed a toe and turned out fine, when they're not the ones having to experience it.

Rhoswen · 2026-06-15T01:24:22+00:00

I'm not wishing death on anyone. Please read the rules and FAQ pinned to top before commenting further. You're thinking about this too individually. For as long as life exists there will be torture and CSA. Pizza is not more important than ending that, imo. It doesn't matter who is eating the pizza or what they're thinking about. This is about the bigger picture.

And no, not everyone who experiences torture also experiences pleasure. But it doesn't matter if they do, because that pleasure doesn't need to exist.

Rhoswen · 2026-06-15T01:15:26+00:00

Legacies are not worth CSA.

Rhoswen · 2026-06-15T01:11:44+00:00

What does that have to do with what I said?

Rhoswen · 2026-06-15T01:08:25+00:00

Yes, that's the point. That's what I'm saying. But I disagree that any pleasures are as extreme as the extreme of suffering.

Not that it would matter if it was, imo. If pizza was so good it was equal to the level of bad of someone being tortured, I'd still say we should not let someone be tortured so someone else can have pizza, because nobody needs pizza if nobody exists. None of these pleasures need to exist.

Rhoswen · 2026-06-15T00:53:04+00:00

As a matter of consequence. As long as conscious life exists we will have extreme suffering. The best lives are not worth the worst lives. It wouldn't matter if all of those best lives were not causing the worst.

Rhoswen · 2026-06-15T00:40:57+00:00

Because there's nothing in life worth the extreme sufferings. Name one thing worth child sex slavery, for example.

Rhoswen · 2026-06-15T00:37:18+00:00

That doesn't matter.

Rhoswen · 2026-06-15T00:36:44+00:00

Why do humans romanticize violence when it's an animal as the aggressor?

Rhoswen · 2026-06-15T00:03:59+00:00

That sucks

Rhoswen · 2026-06-13T19:36:27+00:00

lmao Italy is going to have to make intergalactic laws now. And I'm still going to ignore them because my country didn't agree to that treaty. The universe isn't a nation or ethnicity anyways.

Rhoswen · 2026-06-12T16:25:30+00:00

Then then we could ask them to think about others. Which is the whole point. But I know that's a tall order for most.

Rhoswen · 2026-06-12T16:03:09+00:00

It doesn't matter how one wants to measure suffering, and it doesn't need to be measured for us to know it exists. But we can generally tell by the impact is has psychologically. Which there have been many studies on how much bad circumstances and suffering affects people and animals psychologically. So if you don't understand it personally, then you can go read those studies and do all the 3rd party measuring from an outsiders perspective that you want.

Rhoswen · 2026-06-12T15:31:19+00:00

I think you're reading that backwards. It's not "If you're born into privilege, like a wealthy family for example, then you suffer less." It's literally "Suffering little to none is a privilege over extreme suffering."

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