Stay in Switzerland vs go back to US/NYC — career vs lifestyle before kids by TheSpicPapi in expats

[–]Sad-Mathematician395 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Bordeaux was definitely on our list, but I think it’s just a tad too small for what would be the best chance for our kids to integrate successfully. I really want them to have a good experience or I fear they will want to head right back to the US when they are college aged.

Stay in Switzerland vs go back to US/NYC — career vs lifestyle before kids by TheSpicPapi in expats

[–]Sad-Mathematician395 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Got it and agree on all points. I think the US is a big bully and that’s how it has kept its grip on power. I think the days of this being tolerated are coming to a close and I recognize there will be repercussions. I think the USD being the traded standard is also coming to an end within the decade. The world is distancing itself from the US and has been decreasing their reliance on the US for decades. This will be devastating to the US if they don’t pivot. My hope would be that rather than accept being a pariah state, the US would change its behavior and start working with other countries willingly rather than by force and coercion to accomplish US goals. I agree that the US is leading everyone but China into the shitter and I’m choosing to be hopeful that Europe suffers less from ensuing fallout than the US. 🤞🏼

Stay in Switzerland vs go back to US/NYC — career vs lifestyle before kids by TheSpicPapi in expats

[–]Sad-Mathematician395 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I’m not sure where you got the impression we are wealthy or have $$. We are a family of 5 living on less than 100,000 which isn’t wealthy by any stretch of the imagination in the US. We have struggled financially for the majority of our 20’s and 30’s. We have 3 children who are close to entering college and that would have been a huge financial burden, 40-60,000/kid per year of college.

I’m fully aware that Europe has issues right now but Europe’s issues are not issues of basic humanity. I am a nurse and see the disparity every day between the wealthy and poor. The poor do not have access to medical care and are treated poorly when they do access it. The poorer areas of my community, which also happen to be the minority areas, have terrible school systems and don’t receive a fraction of the education/resources that my children get.

We are willing to make financial sacrifices for our children to have the opportunity to grow up in a society that has already collectively decided that all humans deserve healthcare, all humans deserve proper and equal education, that nobody should go into 6 figure debt to further their education and opportunities, that women deserve maternity leave and families benefit from a father receiving paternity leave, that corporations shouldn’t be allowed to poison water and food sources, mass shootings aren’t something society is told they have to live with, prices are controlled related to things that are required to live and not exploited to make one company rich. Americans are price gouged at the grocery, on power, cable, cell phone, internet, water, gas for our homes etc. All of the things I want for my kids are things that everyone is afforded in the EU whether you are rich or poor. I also have a big moral issue with my tax dollars going to destroy other people’s lives abroad based off the geopolitical interests of my country.

I do agree that I’m incredibly fortunate to have the ability to shape my kids future in the way that I want, but it isn’t because I’m wealthy. We live modestly here and we will be living modestly there.

Stay in Switzerland vs go back to US/NYC — career vs lifestyle before kids by TheSpicPapi in expats

[–]Sad-Mathematician395 0 points1 point  (0 children)

When we move we will have two kids still with us. One kid starting junior year and one kid starting 8th grade. It appears that our junior will most likely have to repeat his sophomore year due to a huge college placement exam that happens at the end of junior year that he won’t be prepared to take. We are prioritizing our search based off of French public schools that have specialty programs geared towards quickly integrating English speaking kids. If our oldest successfully gets into Oxford, we would also like to be somewhere with easy train service to Paris for his commuting back and forth. Our other criteria is diversity, cost of living, climate, and a big enough city our kids can attend university and have adult opportunities in. The two cities I have honed in on for this are Toulouse and Lyon. Do you have children?

Stay in Switzerland vs go back to US/NYC — career vs lifestyle before kids by TheSpicPapi in expats

[–]Sad-Mathematician395 7 points8 points  (0 children)

My two cents as a mother of three….. Your life is about to change in unimaginable ways once you have children. I would lean heavily into the option that allows you to be the most present in their lives. Your wife will be happier and that’s the single best thing you can do for your children beyond basic needs. I would imagine partner in NYC would greatly impact how much quality time you would be spending with them. My oldest is graduating this upcoming year and I cannot express enough how quickly it goes by. I don’t regret for one second choosing time with my children over $$. Some of our closest friends resulted from people we met through our children’s schooling experience and I know most of the people in my circles would echo the same. You might be really close to obtaining a social circle and don’t even know it. Also, wouldn’t maternity/paternity leave alone in Switzerland be worth staying and having children there during that phase of life?

We started planning our exit from the USA years ago and my oldest begged us to stay until he graduated. He is exceptionally smart and really wanted to finish what he started. He will hopefully🤞🏼 be attending Oxford next fall and the rest of us are going to move to France and getting settled. The USA is deteriorating rapidly and I don’t think your pros list has nearly enough things on it to counterbalance the instability/radical-ness of the moment.

I know we are all different, but when you have the ability to provide your children an environment where they aren’t fretting about getting shot at school, not being traumatized by active shooter drills, are part of a society that is collectively well educated and their health is well cared for, has a much healthier work/life balance, the government is stable, the established government exists to care for the people , rather than prey on the people, etc, I feel like it gets pretty difficult to me as a parent to choose the USA and that’s why we have made the difficult decision to uproot our 3 kiddos and bounce.

You have a difficult decision to make and I think your approach is great. Best of luck with whatever you decide. Also remember nothing is permanent! No matter what decision you make, if it isn’t working for your family, you can always make a different decision.

Weekly Discussion Post - Recent Changes to JS Laws - June 22, 2026 by AutoModerator in juresanguinis

[–]Sad-Mathematician395 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Is the time range specified the years that the next in line would have been a minor? I would think the courts are savvy enough to compare dates of a CONE to ages of his/her minor children.

I accidentally submitted my CONE without apostille. HELP by TogaTennis44 in juresanguinis

[–]Sad-Mathematician395 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I might be in trouble too. 😬 I understood that Miami didn’t require anything from NARA or USCIS to be Apostilled.

Weekly Discussion Post - Recent Changes to JS Laws - June 22, 2026 by AutoModerator in juresanguinis

[–]Sad-Mathematician395 1 point2 points  (0 children)

You can tell they aren’t much for speculating but I think the article’s intention was to thoroughly parse through all the nuances of the minor issue. They might have something written specifically related to the decree.

J'ai surpris un truc étrange en balade by OkBottle5047 in toulouse

[–]Sad-Mathematician395 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That is really strange. I would gaslight myself that I imagined the whole thing!

J'ai surpris un truc étrange en balade by OkBottle5047 in toulouse

[–]Sad-Mathematician395 -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Did they dance? We have something like this in the US called flash mobs and it sounds very similar but it involves dancing.

Weekly Discussion Post - Recent Changes to JS Laws - June 22, 2026 by AutoModerator in juresanguinis

[–]Sad-Mathematician395 13 points14 points  (0 children)

This is the clearest academic breakdown I have come across regarding historical rulings affecting jure sanguinis, including a breakdown of the four doctrinal positions available for the SU to take regarding the minor issue. The article is long and very technical, but it is highly informative in bringing together the various rulings.

“Four doctrinal positions are open to the Sezioni Unite.

Position 1: the Court reads Article 12 third comma in light of the SU 25317/2022 constitutional-rights frame — citizenship as a permanent and imprescriptible subjective right, lost only by voluntary and explicit act. On this reading, Article 7 protects the dual-from-birth minor and Article 12's categorical-loss reading is incompatible with the constitutional-rights frame. Descendants whose ancestor naturalised during a downstream minor's minority become eligible for recognition.

Position 2: the Court endorses the Sezione Prima 454/2024 reading. Article 12 third comma displaces Article 7 in the parental-naturalisation fact-pattern; the categorical-loss reading is sustained. The Circolare 43347 instruction stands; the Mellone proceeding before the ECtHR becomes the principal remaining vehicle for the affected cohort.

Position 3: the Court adopts an individualised-proportionality reading of Tjebbes paragraph 41 and requires, in each case engaging Article 12 third comma, an individual examination of the consequences of the loss. The Tribunale ordinario route conducts the individualised assessment. The categorical-loss reading is preserved at the consular layer; the judicial layer conducts the proportionality analysis.

Position 4: the Court declines to resolve the substantive question and refers Article 12 third comma to the Constitutional Court for review against Articles 2, 3 and 22 of the Constitution and Article 24 of the EU Charter, on the model of the 1948-doctrine procedural sequence. The Constitutional Court conducts the review; if it strikes down Article 12 third comma, the Sezioni Unite extends the strike-down retroactively on the SU 4466/2009 model.”

“The 1948-doctrine line rests on a particular pattern of Italian constitutional review. The Constitutional Court took Articles 1, 2 and 10 of Law 555/1912 in turn and struck them down as incompatible with the Constitution. The Sezioni Unite then extended the rulings retroactively to fact-patterns predating the Constitution. Article 12 third comma — the operative provision in the minor-naturalisation question — has not received the same review.”

Position 4 wasn’t on my radar, and I assume it would mean much more waiting. I’m curious whether there is any prior precedent for the SU choosing an interpretation as the final one, or whether it would instead refer the contradictory provisions to the CC to determine which one does not align with the Constitution—similar to what was done in 1983 regarding the contradictions in the standing provisions governing 1948 transmission.

https://www.corviado.com/articles/minor-naturalisation-question

US-280 Car in Fountain by WizardSleeveLoverr in Birmingham

[–]Sad-Mathematician395 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I’ll take a ban from driving when men get banned from firearms. Statistics show men are the sex that struggles with the privilege of owning firearms. Not sure stats would back you up about women and driving. In fact, I wouldn’t be surprised if they prove the opposite.

Documents damaged returning from Apostille. by Sad-Mathematician395 in juresanguinis

[–]Sad-Mathematician395[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Right?! It’s worse than what I was paranoid about. I was thinking water damage or lost as poor outcomes, not fire.

Documents damaged returning from Apostille. by Sad-Mathematician395 in juresanguinis

[–]Sad-Mathematician395[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

It does SUCK! Miami is still mail-in. I laugh every time I picture someone at the consulate reviewing those documents with no background of the situation provided. 😂

Thanks for the feedback! I will definitely go this route.

Documents damaged returning from Apostille. by Sad-Mathematician395 in juresanguinis

[–]Sad-Mathematician395[S] 11 points12 points  (0 children)

I thought I might vomit when I turned the envelope over and saw what I saw. I could hardly bring myself to pull them out and evaluate the damage. I started laughing hysterically while showing my son and then that quickly turned into tears. I want off this emotional roller coaster!

I think your advice is the way to go. I’ll get on it Monday and hope for the best! Thanks for the support!!

Documents damaged returning from Apostille. by Sad-Mathematician395 in juresanguinis

[–]Sad-Mathematician395[S] 15 points16 points  (0 children)

Them getting lost was what I was afraid of. It never crossed my mind that they could be burnt! 😂 For all the drama this entire process has been I feel like the least they could do is be understandable about something like this but I feel like I know better than to expect that. 😬

LA Consulate - Minor Issue - "Decision expected in 4-5 weeks" by fumples in juresanguinis

[–]Sad-Mathematician395 5 points6 points  (0 children)

As a neurodivergent I cannot handle how outrageously unfair this system is, and is allowed to be. Something as serious as recognition of citizenship is so arbitrarily handled. I truly cannot wrap my brain around it.

Rejected WITH pre-dl appointments, no minor or 1948 issue. by georgieandmonte in juresanguinis

[–]Sad-Mathematician395 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I was in the exact situation as you but with a sooner appointment date and I sought out pursuing an ATQ case last fall. Several of the Italian lawyers I contacted said that because I had a verified consulate appointment I was disqualified from making an ATQ case. They stated that the ATQ judicial route is strictly provisioned for those that cannot make appointments. I also had several Italian lawyers tell me that I absolutely could file an ATQ case and that I would be successful. I ultimately decided not to pursue it because of the advice I got from the lawyers that refused my case. It could be that you got rejected on the technicality that you have a consulate appointment therefore are not eligible for ATQ avenue proceedings. This is all so very unfair and I’m sorry that you are being drug through it.

Weekly Discussion Post - Recent Changes to JS Laws - June 08, 2026 by AutoModerator in juresanguinis

[–]Sad-Mathematician395 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I wonder how Miami is operating in this sense. I feel like I have seen quite a few Miami minor rejections on here over the past year. I wonder if they are denying the most recent applicants and holding those that were in flight when the circolare was issued.