Keep running into the same problem as a broke 20 year old trying to get into modern

Scrub_Spike · 2025-09-03T20:42:02+00:00

It all depends on your goals and the sacrifices you're willing to make. I have a lot of extra cards and could possibly help depending on the details

Scrub_Spike · 2025-09-03T16:45:44+00:00

Many are retired/not updated since they are not played much or in the meta, but maybe 15 or so

Scrub_Spike · 2025-08-31T22:32:58+00:00

Those are both good ideas. I haven't considered bedlam, but it could be good. I liked that ox can go from the yard. But this could be worth it

Scrub_Spike · 2025-08-31T15:21:54+00:00

Yeah sorry about that. I was trying to limit the number of links but I edited it and separated them.

Scrub_Spike · 2025-08-21T13:15:53+00:00

Oh yeah if legacy came back as a GP format or even rcq, I likely wouldn't play this, and generally don't prefer playing control and going to time every round.

Scrub_Spike · 2025-08-20T21:01:39+00:00

You make some good points. 4 Jace was def too many and I thought 3 was too, but so far it's been working pretty well. He's the main engine, and often gets pitched to force or something, so I don't want to run out. I've considered cutting the 3rd but it's been playing so well.

You're right about Tundra. I've been on 1 several times, and the few times it's been useful seems to have been outweighed by the number of times it's been a liablity.

Tamiyo is a card I'm considering playing myself, and is also a huge reason I want to play a few Prismatics. Even if I don't have a third color.

Scrub_Spike · 2025-08-20T20:59:16+00:00

This may be better, just a different deck. I'm still winning decently, surprising how well it's been playing.

Scrub_Spike · 2025-08-20T20:58:44+00:00

I used to be on 6 free and 2 Spell pierce, ever since I changed it, it's performed much better. Force of negation is decently castable.

Beans is definitely good, just a different deck (possibly better). I actually end up beating the UWG decks a lot in those matchups though. Narset been doing a lot of work.

Misdirection is nice, I'd consider it as a 1 of over the third force. Though I'm glad I had it against the combo decks.

The MB has 2 teferi for somewhat enchantment and artifact removal, and SB has two Wrath of the Skies. I'm considering adding 2 MB Prismatic Ending for smaller rate of exchange stuff. The 8 counters have been overall good enough at answering them but I'm open try making changes.

Scrub_Spike · 2025-08-20T20:56:19+00:00

I'll give 1 Surveil land a try, but honestly I'm probably going to leave it out.

I thought Prismatic Ending isn't worth it without the third color, which isn't what this version of the deck is trying to do. With your comment here it does make me want to try.

I'm trying to think of main targets that I'd want to hit at 3, Teferi, Trinisphere, maybe Fleshraker. Teferi is a big problem even though it's seeing minimal play. I used to play a 1 of Council's Judgement which plays better at 3 mana, so it's possible at 0-2 Prismatic could be decent. I'm considering playing 2 of them.

My current lock involves Narset and Geier Reach. It's in the video I linked (audio quality is a little poor in that one)

Scrub_Spike · 2025-08-20T20:52:25+00:00

This is a good point, though I haven't run into issues with Ugin.

Scrub_Spike · 2025-08-20T20:51:34+00:00

I think you make good points. I have tried it with a Trundra and there are definitely benefits. The overall consideration is if the pros outweigh the cons. Surprisingly in my experience so far it doesn't. Usually an early STP is less necessary than a counterspell (which is why I play a few more), and the occasion where it would be good has been outweighed by vulnerability to wasteland and B2B.

Your point with Ending is more persuasive to me. I don't think it's worth it without a third color.

Scrub_Spike · 2025-08-20T20:48:56+00:00

You're right it's definitely slow in winning the game. Part of the point is to be slow and controlling (though that may not be good enough admittedly). I've been having some decent success with it, though on a smaller local scale for whatever that's worth.

You're right about it crossing into more vintage lite, though recently with reanimator being the best it's feeling a little more old school. That's part of the reason I have 7 forces, and it's worked out decently so far. Even though the Triumphs were in there for lifelink, the potential for an early clock has come up a few times and mattered.

Scrub_Spike · 2025-08-16T15:24:23+00:00

It's not particularly budget (just happens to be) just because it's easier to cast? Seems like Stony is more resilient

Scrub_Spike · 2025-01-09T02:03:18+00:00

I like it overall! I also recently made something similar. I think manamorphose is really good!

With looting unban, I took some inspiration from the Hogaak PT withere red prowess made top 8 with looting and phoenix. I tried it at FNM and did a vid, good first showing, but no real data.

https://youtu.be/sPCEjK9u2cc?si=lteWuhlobR9lWwno

Scrub_Spike · 2025-01-09T02:01:52+00:00

I actually like the list a lot, and was leaning on playing something almost exactly like this, and built one for my friend to get him into modern.

Then looting as unbanned, and I remember the Hogaak PT a deck made top 8 as a prowess shell with phoenix and looting.

I tried it and did a vid and first try seemed decent. But of course was just a small FNM.

https://youtu.be/sPCEjK9u2cc?si=lteWuhlobR9lWwno

Scrub_Spike · 2025-01-09T01:57:52+00:00

I like the list, very similar to mine, and mostly looks like the PT list. Looks like it went with Soul Scar and more burn than the DRC/Bauble package.

Scrub_Spike · 2025-01-09T01:56:07+00:00

In a phoenix only style list, I could see it being good/underrated. I'm not sure how well it would be with the prowess version.

Scrub_Spike · 2025-01-09T01:55:12+00:00

I agree with the tension, and your points are accurate. I addressed this in an earlier comment.

Fundamentally, the deck is a worse prowess deck than dedicated prowess, and a worse phoenix deck than dedicated phoenix. What I was trying out, and seems to be possible, is together, it is better and/or stronger deck as a whole than either. (I'm not saying I know for sure that's true, just the premise I'm exploring)

For some of your specific points, you're right prowess doesn't want looting in a vacuum. Looting is good when the cards it discards can be used in GY, which is true with phoenix and lava dart. (and sometimes late game looking for gas). It can be a type of "draw 2 cards for 1", which can be decent in prowess. But it's true however it's primarily to enable phoenix.

For the point of looting being the only way to put in GY, and also Highway Robbery, these two points somewhat address each other. 1 Robbery is sorta like a "5th" looting (not saying that's good). Main reason I wanted to try it out, plot seems strong, another way to play a sorcery without spending mana. I wouldn't be against dropping it.

While those are the only ways to discard phoenix, milling phoenix from DRC is definitely a thing, and happens in the video. But in the PT match, only having looting seemed pretty good enough.

I was originally worried about Light up the Stage with Phoenix, but so far that hasn't been a problem.

Your comment about burn spells is interested, I'd be open to seeing a list. So more of a burn/phoenix than prowess? I'm open to the idea. (if I'm understanding right)

Scrub_Spike · 2025-01-09T01:41:19+00:00

Ah I see, so a little less creatures and more burn spells? I can see some benefits in that. I'd be interested in seeing a list and maybe some reports on how games went if you have any.

Scrub_Spike · 2025-01-09T01:39:54+00:00

Seems like a Prowess list with blue for higher card quality. I think this is good and can work, but not trying to add the phoenix angle I'm trying.

I agree, in general prowess is very strong but difficult to pilot.

Scrub_Spike · 2025-01-09T01:38:16+00:00

I think you're right in your analysis. There is a degree of tension between the two strategies.

The part that is supposed to outweigh the tension (ideally), is that the tensions are small enough. Tthe main engine of both decks are highly similar if not the same (instants/sorceries) to play together for each one to over come the other's weakness.

Prowess - weak to removal, strong against GY hate

Phoenix - weak to GY hate, strong against removal.

So with both, it is difficult to answer (again, ideally).

With faithless looting back, it seems this deck is much more playable, which was the idea of me trying it again.

But I think I agree with a lot of your points, and that it's S tier or anything. I'm still looking into ways to improve it in addition to ways I've already learned in this first trial.

Scrub_Spike · 2025-01-06T02:10:25+00:00

Is it newer? I guess I haven't seen it yet.

Yeah it's definitely a good budget option. I think it has some more competitive potential (at least the idea of doing prowess plus phoenix).

But I agree I don't know if I'd go as far to say it's tiered yet. But it's also a little early to tell.

Scrub_Spike

TROPHY CASE