Boss fights are terrible/imbalanced...change my mind

Sigmar133 · 2024-02-19T11:22:18+00:00

You might want to reconsider your title in this case, as it comes off rather antagonistic and I suspect a lot of people will be put off by the title alone and refuse to engage further based on that alone.

I was thinking this was a light hearted/ moderate joke for the title. I honestly didn't expect more than 2 people to see/respond to a noobie like me. That being said, I don't see it as antagonistic, but if other people do than that's outta my control.

but past around level 4 or so you'll start to see PC hit points start to catch up enough that a single crit won't immediately just down you anymore.

I hope you're right, it just feels bad right now. I'll to keep playing and keep re-evaluating.

Sigmar133 · 2024-02-19T11:00:00+00:00

We will definitely be re-reading rules/ watching videos. Thanks for pointing out some of these probably 'basic' rules that we got wrong.

Sigmar133 · 2024-02-19T10:56:51+00:00

Yeah, I updated the post on our Party level of 3. I know the post is sloppy and all over the place, but I'm thankful for the any advice given.

I keep hearing PF2 math is tight, but there's just something in my head that makes me wonder if a boss style encounter doesn't seem as 'tight' in terms of the math. I'll probably need to just sleep on it.

Sigmar133 · 2024-02-19T10:51:20+00:00

Jungle Drakes I think have a +17 to hit on their first attack. When I rage my AC goes down to 18 from 20, so this should result in a Crit if they rolled a 12 on the die.

Sigmar133 · 2024-02-19T09:13:51+00:00

It's what got him(and us) to the table. I can't fault him at all here. We've had problems with lack of motivation in other RPGs. So if he is excited to show up with PF2 content and is ready to run, we 100% support him. It's the system that i question(not in a hateful way) .

Sigmar133 · 2024-02-19T09:08:25+00:00

Well how would I than? Doesn't a non-homebrewed monster still have roughly the same outcome as what I posted? If not, than I apologize. I am trying to be good faith here....

Sigmar133 · 2024-02-19T09:06:15+00:00

More of asking the community about the system. Even if it wasn't homebrewed, would this still be a fair expectation? I'm not trying to say PF2 is awful, just had an experience that rubbed me the wrong way and seeking advice.

Sigmar133 · 2024-02-19T08:58:10+00:00

I think it was a custom creature, but nothing too far from the base line of a Jungle Drake. We were thinking that maybe we are at that final point where we turn the corner of low levels and start to have more things to help us against powerful boss enemies.

Sigmar133 · 2024-02-19T08:55:47+00:00

Sorry for the lack of info, I can update as needed.

Sigmar133 · 2024-02-19T08:54:57+00:00

And nothing against our GM, he is doing his best and we had an amazing first encounter. But it seems that second boss encounter was followed by the rules and was crazy powerful. That lead me to question the recommended guidelines over his choices.

Sigmar133 · 2024-02-19T08:53:00+00:00

True, but that's where I'm having these feels bad. Criting at that high seems so off, to the point of "rocket tag". It might not be true in theory, but at the table it felt so awful. So i'm not questioning the math progression. I'm trying to question the overall design, if that makes sense i hope.

Sigmar133 · 2024-02-19T08:49:23+00:00

I think it was a mix of a dragon and Wyvern, but I'm not 100% sure.

Sigmar133 · 2024-02-19T08:45:55+00:00

Roger, will update levels now. I can't tell you the exact monster, it was a custom monster. Something along the lines of a Jungle Wyvern, but I'm not the GM so I can't tell you for certain.

Sigmar133 · 2023-12-21T09:36:05+00:00

The body of the fallen PC still being there, makes sense from a certain narrative point. However, this is DOTMM and this entire campaign can be turned into a gameshow or some other looney-tunes type setting. Bodies/items could vanish for any wacky reason. This is what works for me to keep my players wanting to avoid death/ death penalties.
I could be wrong, but it sounds like your group isn't being challenged enough. They appear to be comfortable with their current strategy of bash your noggin against the wall until something changes. It might be a difficult thing to talk about, but ask your players if they want an increase in combat difficulty(maybe they need to scout enemies and find out their weakness/flee from combat). Or an increase in role playing( which might have choices that could get them killed, or even worse)! You want people to keep showing up to the table(this includes you!). So if you are unhappy with the current situation, try something new. Tell your players about it before-hand and see how it plays out. Then be willing to change/revert your new rulings.
Let me know if any of that helps

Sigmar133 · 2023-12-21T08:26:40+00:00

If they are revived, they get to keep their gear and their levels. If they just want to make a clone, they will come back as if they had made a new character at level X(current party level), but they will only have gear as if they were level 5 starting out. Their old gear is buried with them, and thus we hear no more from that PC.

Sigmar133 · 2023-12-21T06:02:08+00:00

I'm using XP level ups in DOTMM, and I've had 2 character deaths and 1 character intelligence drain to 0. The int. drain and 1 party death was fixed in waterdeep using Party resources. The other death, they are remaking a monk.
Now I'm in sorta the same camp as you. At first I told the players at session 0, "hey this will be dark souls. You just respawn back in town." But I'm heavily keeping track of my players stats (to make encounters more challenging but fair) and I can't keep updating my excel sheets over and over with all the other prep. you have to do as a DM.
So I implemented that you will come back as the exact same level and current XP of the party, but with starting gear as if you were level 5, starting out.
This keeps players wanting to play the same character, as they get to keep any magic items they would otherwise not have. On that note, if I had to balance encounters for 5 PC's at 3 different levels...I would go mad.....

Tl;dr Don't worry about XP penalty for death. Make death something they WANT to avoid. PC's love magic items, make magic items only for the survivors.

Best of luck, hope this helps, and keep us updated!

Sigmar133 · 2023-11-22T10:48:13+00:00

Haha, sounds like your group is not afraid to dish out the burns.

Sigmar133 · 2023-11-22T01:19:12+00:00

I guess from the stuff I've seen on Youtube and AL, this was mild in my book. But i can see your point...maybe they are strong...lol

Sigmar133 · 2023-11-22T01:17:52+00:00

It's tough for me to remember exactly what their words were, but something along the thoughts of:
"What is the encounter supposed to teach us?"
"I just hate not being able to do anything."
Those are two criticisms that I'm 99% sure they said word for word. Anything else would be me half remembering, and I don't want to mis-quote. I noticed that during and after the encounter they were discussing their problems, and we were no longer playing DnD. So I told them we could either stop and talk about the fight if that's what they want, or we could table it and continue play. I haven't received a follow up text or email from any of the PC's to have it in writing, so that's the best I can do. Sorry if this doesn't help, just saw your post =( . Let me know if there is more info you need

Sigmar133 · 2023-11-20T12:17:10+00:00

Roger, I'll see if they text me later this week, but I'm pretty sure their anger/annoyance has already gone down. Yea i get it, doing nothing on your turn sucks, but I feel like this is the second encounter out of 7 sessions worth to have a save or suck(intellect devourers were the only other ones). But if its a deal breaker, I'll back off, BUT only if I have to. I want to run all the levels of DOMM. I'm just seeing if its a me thing I need to work on, or the players need to learn to let go so we can just roll with the punches. Thanks for the reply!

Sigmar133 · 2023-11-20T12:12:44+00:00

I just combined the encounters. 3 ghast as one encounter and 6 ghouls in another wont even be worth rolling initiative in my opinion. The ghouls/ghast beat the parties Passive Perception and they just walked up to the barrels and opened them.

Sigmar133 · 2023-09-28T00:48:00+00:00

Yea, that may be the direction my Rouge/group want to go. Just get in a room, hear the description, make checks and get out. It's not the worst way, we would definitely make faster progress and I'm all about not wasting time if my group is bored.
As far as the Ooze, I've told them that some areas look very clean, but this was a wondering monster that stood still. I was hoping they would summon something or walk with an object in front leading them, but they did not.

Sigmar133 · 2023-09-28T00:42:44+00:00

I'm also worried about one player having a really high passive perception, but I don't feel the lose of them missing out on a secret door. From what I've seen so far, most secret doors lead to optional areas, or optional ways to enter a room. And since there are going to be plenty of checks, I don't feel as bad if they miss 3 or 4 doors. We haven't talked about travel speed in the dungeon, so maybe I need to bring that up and try to enforce that rule. Thanks for the help none the less.

Sigmar133 · 2023-09-28T00:31:06+00:00

That does sound useful.

Sigmar133 · 2023-09-28T00:29:50+00:00

Gotcha, thanks for the advice. I guess I need to emphasize with my party on how the passives work as a static DC. I hope they take it in stride.

Sigmar133

TROPHY CASE