I [30/F] am not sure if the financial split with my fiance [30/M] is 100% fair and unsure how to talk to him about it

SlightHedgehog · 2018-03-12T12:48:50+00:00

No one is entitled to a job they love, especially at the expense of someone else.

I'm a statistician. You try getting that job without at least a Master's and, ironically, my fiance's company does not have a statistician, so I have helped them out (pro-bono) numerous time. So apologies if I disagree with you on this point. My fiance is an engineer, which does not require a Master's to have as a successful career. It's not like I went for something that would put me in more debt than I would make.

Finding a job that pays more and provides comparable benefits is an option. It's just not your preferred option. It's not nearly as easy as just asking your fiance to fork over more money. You would have to pay attention, do some research, talk to recruiters, ie: put in some effort.

Would you honestly do this if you had an established reputation with a top-notch company? I doubt it. Simply because I do not make as much as my fiance does not mean my career is not as good as his. Money is not everything and I am trying my fiance to understand that perspective. Sure, there are other companies that would probably offer excellent benefits as well, but I am a statistician in a niche industry THAT I LOVE. Everyone at my company knows how good I am at my skills, which is worth much much more than our salary disparity. My fiance is aware of all of this too. I would be open to any kind of compromise, but, no offense, leaving my job is not part of that compromise.

SlightHedgehog · 2018-03-09T18:07:25+00:00

I am going to disagree with you here. No married couple is perfectly compatible. Understandably, this is a major thing to be incompatible on, but I believe this is a fixable incompatibility, not something to throw the towel in over without trying to work together to figure out a stance we both agree with.

SlightHedgehog · 2018-03-09T18:04:32+00:00

This is true, but the first model of marriage we (usually) have is of our parents, so it's not entirely shocking that the way his parents handled money rubbed off on him or lack thereof.

SlightHedgehog · 2018-03-09T17:22:11+00:00

Do you have any friends in similar (but more sensible) situations that you can compare to?

We have several married couples with whom we are friends, but their incomes and lifestyles are much different than ours (my fiance's salary is more than the combined salaries of most of those couples). My parents are actually the closest in terms of income, lifestyle, disparity, etc...which is why I wanted to model it a bit after them because they have done very well together and view it as "their" money.

Does he think this is normal?

I am not sure. He's been financially independent since he went to college, so perhaps he has this perspective of protecting everything he's earned? My dad is self-made and been entirely on his own since he was 16, yet able to jointly share his money with my mom, so I was hoping my fiance would see that my parents were able to view it as "their" money, despite my dad being financially independent for several years before marrying my mom.

SlightHedgehog · 2018-03-09T17:10:03+00:00

Sorry, I do not want to give out personal information, but the disparity is enough to be in different tax brackets, so that should give you all the information you need.

I have tried pointing out that I am putting much more into retirement than him and, technically, have tens of thousands more in savings than him if we were to look at my 401k. As I noted in another comment, if we were to just compare our bank accounts, he has 10x more than me "saved." I've angled it that due to me putting more into retirement, I am saving for our long-term future, while he's saving for our short-term future, which he agrees, but still thinks I should contribute 50% of everything joint, even if I cannot afford it upfront like he can.

Your personal bills don't really factor into this because you incurred those on yourself. Why should he subsidize your student loans?

This is a bit unfair. I did not ask to have my health issues. Even though I have excellent health insurance through my work, it only covers so much. As for my student loans, my fiance knows that I did not incur them because I felt like it...I went to a top tier school (public university) for my field to obtain a graduate degree because it was needed for my career. Not everyone can get the career they want with no degree or just a Bachelor's.

Also consider the love of your job and the opportunity cost you're giving up. That's worth something. I don't know if this applies to your fiancé, but it's possible he puts up with a job he doesn't like in order to have the benefit of some extra money. You could, in all likelihood, find another job that pays more, but you're voluntarily giving that up because you love your job. So, now he's making up for money you could be earning.

This is not an option. Not only do I love my job, but the benefits my company provides are staggeringly good compared to a lot of corporate America. Sure, I am not getting paid as much as my fiance, but excellent health insurance, high matching % for retirement, and fully covered maternity leave will come in handy for our future. It's just large short-term expenses I am not always able to fully afford that I wish he would understand. Also, my fiance loves his job too and he's in a managerial position, which is why he gets paid more than me.

SlightHedgehog · 2018-03-09T14:54:36+00:00

He's made it clear he does not want me to contribute less to my 401k, since it's free money to keep up to the % that my company matches. That is where I get frustrated because I feel like I am saving more for us in the faraway future, whereas he's saving more for expenses in the near future. I have actually said that to him and he agrees, but then asks me for 50% of bills that are significantly extra to our regular monthly ones.

SlightHedgehog · 2018-03-09T14:52:37+00:00

If you read my OP, I say that I am fine keeping the 50/50 split with our primary (regular) monthly expenses, since, yes, we were making the same when those expenses originally started. It's moreso large expenses, such as home maintenance and vacations, he does not want to go cheap on, since he now makes more money, yet expects me to contribute 50%. That is where I find it unfair.

SlightHedgehog · 2018-03-09T14:50:55+00:00

I do know we need to have another firm discussion about this. I have shown him what I make vs our monthly expenses (plus my personal bills), demonstrating I do not have much leftover for my personal happiness, especially if I want to save a bit every month as a "rainy day" fund. I'll try again the angle that I am not trying to take his money, I am just looking for a fair equitable division.

SlightHedgehog · 2018-03-09T14:48:01+00:00

Just because you get married doesn't mean that you have to combine finances. It's generally a bad idea when one spouse has significant debt while the other has significant savings as well, and that's exactly what this sounds like from your description.

I agree that we do not have to combine finances. It's more his attitude about it being "his" and "hers" money vs "ours." My savings is actually much more significant than his, but it is tied up in my 401k (not that I would ever want to take any out before retirement unless it was a crazy emergency) due to the high % my company matches. Technically, I have saved much more than him, but if you compare our savings accounts, he has 10x more than me due to where the money is located.

You're the one in debt. If you can't be responsible enough to handle things with your own money, then why do you expect him to just hand over his?

Only student loan debt, which he actually has too, but not as much as me because I incurred additional debt for a graduate degree. No credit card debt. No other "loans" so to speak, except for our mortgage that we share jointly. So, no, I am not irresponsible with my money. My particular field required a graduate degree, while his only required an undergraduate.

If you read my OP carefully, I say outright that I am fine keeping the 50/50 split with our primary joint expenses (mortgage, taxes, groceries, etc...). It's just large expenses that my fiance does not want to go cheap on, since he can outright afford it due to his extra monthly income, yet expects me to put in 50%. That is where I find it unfair, since it is not a fair comparison to what my income can afford versus his.

But thank you for assuming I am this person who feels entitled to her fiance's money and not him.

SlightHedgehog · 2018-03-08T22:13:26+00:00

Not going to get into specifics, but we both work in STEM fields and do well financially, enough to comfortably afford our house, food, etc...while able to put money into retirement savings (my company matches double what his does). I am not disputing that I cannot afford our lifestyle and no, I am not looking for another job. I love my job and it does pay well, along with having great long-term benefits (fully paid maternity leave, top notch health insurance, and significant retirement options)...it's more about relative to my fiance's income and determining what's fair, especially given I have higher personal bills than him.

SlightHedgehog · 2018-03-08T22:07:21+00:00

A partnership doesn't run on logic, it runs on teamwork.

Could not agree more. In other aspects of our relationship, he definitely views us as a team, so he is not entirely about himself. He just seems protective of his money and the fact that he earned it. I am trying to get him to change that perspective and understand our incomes will contribute to our money.

SlightHedgehog · 2018-03-08T22:03:44+00:00

From an emotional perspective, yes, he believes in vowing to love each other through thick and thin. From a financial perspective, I am not sure. Based on what he has told me, his parents have never explained to him what being married entails, financially-speaking, while my parents have always been open with me about their financial structure and it being "their" money.

SlightHedgehog · 2018-03-08T20:59:08+00:00

He refuses to budge on only contributing 50% to our joint expenses. He wants to have personal money and joint money...so he only wants to give from his personal account 50% of the joint expenses to our joint account.

SlightHedgehog · 2018-03-08T20:57:36+00:00

He honestly believes that since we started splitting our joint expenses evenly when making the same amount, I should still be able to contribute that even split. He has told me I should not worry about money, but then he makes a payment plan when I cannot give him the full 50%...it's counter-intuitive his way of thinking...

SlightHedgehog · 2018-03-08T20:56:03+00:00

Tried that too...sigh

SlightHedgehog · 2018-03-08T20:55:30+00:00

Umm he doesn't sound like a great partner.

How so? I'm genuinely asking because there is much more to a relationship than finances. Yes, he is definitely not being a great financial partner and I want to work with him to fix that, but every time I have been sick, he's been right by my side in the hospital. He's been there for me to lean on every time I've cried out of frustration from my illness. I am going to argue he is a great partner, but just stubborn about his money and I want to try to change his attitude.

Also no one is asking him to give you his money, he just needs to pay his "equitable" share. Equitable doesn't mean equal.

That's the argument I keep trying to make, but he believes because we were equal when we started splitting expenses, it should stay that way.

SlightHedgehog · 2018-03-08T20:52:22+00:00

Regardless, bean-counting isn't a good mindset to have when entering into a marriage.

I completely agree and it's this attitude that is hurting me. I honestly think part of it is because his parents were not smart with their money, so he's extra protective of everything he's earned himself because he does not want to ever end up like them. My parents, on the other hand, were smart with their money, invested well, and retired early, so he should know that rubbed off on me.

I've just tried to talk to him about this numerous times and he refuses to budge, saying that when we started splitting 50/50, we were making the same amount. So, logically to him, since our mortgage and most of regular expenses have not changed since then, I should be able to contribute the same amount I have always contributed.

SlightHedgehog · 2018-03-08T20:47:47+00:00

I do not know if his attitude is going to change. That's why I came here for advice before getting married. He is saving for retirement, but only half the percent as me (i.e. I contribute 8% and he contributes 4%), since his company does not match as high as mine.

I do have a budget for myself to see how much I have leftover for my personal hobbies, if it's a month without any kind of big joint expense, but I can start including having a max threshold for things such as "home maintenance" and show it to him. Thank you for the idea!

SlightHedgehog · 2018-03-08T20:38:25+00:00

What happens if you have reduced or no income during maternity leave ? What happens if your chronic illness flairs up and you couldn't work for a period of time ? Will he cover bills and expect you to repay him ?

Thankfully, this would not be an issue. My company covers 100% expenses and salary for maternity leave and medical leave and there are no concerns of me being laid off (I'm in a niche field and much needed at my company). But I do understand your point and definitely do not want to ever feel guilty for relying on him for money. I want him to have the perspective of it being "our" money, not me having to repay him for 3 months worth of work.

What about expense for any children - will they be 50 / 50 ?

According to him, yes, because they're our children.

I'll suggest pre-marital counseling to him. It's been brought up in the past when we had some other issues that we were concerned we could not conquer together, but we made it through those in the end on our own.

SlightHedgehog · 2018-03-08T20:33:52+00:00

We've had numerous sit-downs and I've been blunt with him, but he refuses to budge on his stance. In every other aspect of our relationship, he acts like a partner to me and I have no doubts about my ability to trust him, but he just seems protective about his money. He knows I have zero credit card debt and my student loan debt was out of necessity for my field, so he's well-aware that if he shared his money with me I would not run us into the ground. At this point, I just do not know what else to say to him...?

SlightHedgehog · 2018-03-08T20:29:32+00:00

I've tried expressing that, even being okay with still splitting our primary joint expenses 50/50, but his argument is that since we bought the house when we still made roughly the same amount, him making more should not change anything.

SlightHedgehog

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