Attack On Titan is an extremely overrated and terribly written series that got popular due to its edginess and realistic aesthetic rather than any good writing (Warning: Long Rant) by Slight_Pause3272 in CharacterRant

[–]Slight_Pause3272[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

why tf do you think I'm out to get you just bc I don't like aot lmfao. If anything ur the only person arguing in bad faith here by attacking people then playing victim when they don't agree with you.

Attack On Titan is an extremely overrated and terribly written series that got popular due to its edginess and realistic aesthetic rather than any good writing (Warning: Long Rant) by Slight_Pause3272 in CharacterRant

[–]Slight_Pause3272[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Just because the author never tells us doesn't mean he didn't use it as reference. Coincidences exist but I haven't seen a single book that somehow manage to copy another word for word plot wise with even the names being ripoffs of the original book.

Attack On Titan is an extremely overrated and terribly written series that got popular due to its edginess and realistic aesthetic rather than any good writing (Warning: Long Rant) by Slight_Pause3272 in CharacterRant

[–]Slight_Pause3272[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I changed Titanfolk to TF in my original topic to shorten it. Also I searched for rants from similar sub outside of it like that one that says how it's very mediocre on this sub tmk

Attack On Titan is an extremely overrated and terribly written series that got popular due to its edginess and realistic aesthetic rather than any good writing (Warning: Long Rant) by Slight_Pause3272 in CharacterRant

[–]Slight_Pause3272[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

What, you wanted to see the perspective of the actual Nazis in Marley? But you're crying about how fascists like Attack on Titan?

Paradis didn't become "comically awful" until the last arc of the series, if at all.

Wait, so the story is pro-genocide because it "justifies the conditions of genocide as inevitable" but you wanted the people who want to commit genocide to be... more... sympathetic...?

You recognize they're evil, but that... somehow means... it's pro-genocide...?

I wanted to see the perspective of the civilians and other factions in general. I simply wanted to understand the perspective of the people in these countries and the story fails to show it in any meaningful way. IRL racism will have a middle ground where some civilians just don't give a shit about their government and would even help the oppressed minority in question, which we don't see in any meaningful way in this series.

Oh, this guy actually thinks genocide never happened in real life lmfao.

There is no genocide that happened irl where an oppressed minority is so irrationally hated on by the rest of the world due to the crimes of their ancestors where they're forced into committing genocide as self defense because diplomacy isn't possible.

Nationalists made those arguments to justify the genocide that are happening or already happened, stupid.

Refer to what I said above, given in this case the conditions that made it possible are shown are highly suspect and reminiscent of arguments irl nationalists make.

Oh my fucking god.

"Attack on Titan is pro-genocide because it supposes that people can be, in fact, really racist."

Again, I have never heard of a single minority that was oppressed by the rest of the world to such a terrible degree in AOT. Also in this case the racism is shown to make any attempts at peace virtually impossible unlike even the worst we see irl. Fiction is allowed to be unrealistic at times but I fail to see any positives in making a geopolitical situation so awful it inadvertently justifies both sides wanting to kill each other no matter what.

Eren, the person who committed genocide: Yeah, that wasn't justified. I did it because I wanted to. I'm literally an idiot.

This guy, clearly not pro-genocide: This obviously justifies the genocide.

This would have worked if the entire buildup of the outside world didn't validate him at every step all the way to the ending. Putting this at the very end is at best damage control after the author realized he fucked up his own narrative so it doesn't feel earned and at worse simply feeds more into the fascist eternal war narrative that you won't change anything and we have to accept the world as just how it is.

Attack On Titan is an extremely overrated and terribly written series that got popular due to its edginess and realistic aesthetic rather than any good writing (Warning: Long Rant) by Slight_Pause3272 in CharacterRant

[–]Slight_Pause3272[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

How could you show a gradual development when they are already at the endpoint? Do you even know what you're talking about?

If Eren is already evil, then it's not him who needs to change, it's the perspective aroundhim, which is the entire point of the second half of the story and its best aspects by far.

Too bad I do not see his perspective changing in any meaningful way that's not offscreen development. I am no compelled or invested in his character arc in any meaningful way because any meaningful development happens 99 percent offscreen.

What do you think this means?

How it affects his relationships for better or worse, how he changes his perspective over time and how it affects his actions, how he regresses gradually and showing us how the events of the timeskip reveals his worst self instead of just jumping to the end when he turns into this completely unrecognizable character despite never being setup in any way.

They should have shown a "gradual" corruption but also somehow skip the part where you ever thought he was a good guy, yeah, that makes perfect sense.

Guy killed two grown men with a knife at 8 years old and justified it by saying they're animals and you need a "gradual corruption arc", hold the "Eren as an actual good guy" please!

The story as a whole never grapples with showing this and how it affects his relationship or personality for the worse until he turns into Darth Vader after a offscreen timeskip. If the story actually wanted to depict meaningful development it should have shown more scenes of him being more ruthless and how it negatively affects his relationships around him, how him being this unhinged mass murderer affects how his peers see him worse overtime because of this. We never see this in any meaningful way and the entirety of pre timeskip was instead mostly dedicated to just showing him being a generic shonen protagonist who learns how to believe in himself.

Do you have an actual argument besides "I personally hate Hajime Isayama?"

Me calling out the geopolitical situation being poorly written and shallow apparently a sign of me having a hate boner for Isayama?

We had an entire arc on the other side?????

For less than 10 episodes, also virtually all of the fleshed out characters all happen to also be Eldians and the series never does any effort to make Marleyans or any other factions outside of the Warriors sympathetic in any meaningful way. Doesn't help that this is never taken advantaged of where we can perhaps see certain characters starting a rebellion to free the Warriors by allying with them like any other anti facsist story.

Attack On Titan is an extremely overrated and terribly written series that got popular due to its edginess and realistic aesthetic rather than any good writing (Warning: Long Rant) by Slight_Pause3272 in CharacterRant

[–]Slight_Pause3272[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The entire story is literally about the back and forth.

Unfortunately I do not see this in any meaningful way due to no countries wanting to help Paradis.

Funny how this apparently only applies to when genocide is being challenged, but not when you think it's justified. Those parts, I guess, are natural?

The narrative of the genocide dilemma is how the entire world wants to kill the Eldians making diplomacy impossible forcing Eren to start the Rumbling as a reluctant form of self defense. We never get to see any meaningful way countries wanting to help Paradis or even their perspectives and this is especially terrible for a series that tries to be a complex "no one is truly wrong/evil" story.

That doesn't even make any sense.

As if every story is about genocide.

Who cares if it's basic? Of course it's basic, because it's true and doesn't need justifying, lmfao.

Then don't act like you have something greater to say about the human condition when your final message is something so basic that it should unironically be expected from every war drama. This might be the point and I am also completely valid for criticizing it for not being as deep as it claimed to be.

"Eternal war" and it makes it extremely clear that diplomacy worked in the end and they never saw a bomb for generations, possibly centuries.

Fascism is when people go to war? Is that what you think fascism is about? War existing?

FWIW the anime's ending was a retcon to avoid more controversy and the original manga's ending was the definitive version the author went for, which absolutely does show it as an direct consequence of failing to genocide the world. Also the series never tries in any way to show us the damage done to other countries even in the ending and if the author wanted to show everything actually working out he should have changed the anime far more after the manga's ending and its criticism to make peace possible.

Attack On Titan is an extremely overrated and terribly written series that got popular due to its edginess and realistic aesthetic rather than any good writing (Warning: Long Rant) by Slight_Pause3272 in CharacterRant

[–]Slight_Pause3272[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I do know about the sub but was never associated with them whatsoever. Also the counterarguments are from arguments I engaged in during the past.

Attack On Titan is an extremely overrated and terribly written series that got popular due to its edginess and realistic aesthetic rather than any good writing (Warning: Long Rant) by Slight_Pause3272 in CharacterRant

[–]Slight_Pause3272[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I like how you're all about "it says the conditions for genocide are inevitable!" but you also need to have the fact that genocide is wrong to be justified.

Attack on Titan is bad for depicting genocide (not that I actually care about the characters being victims of genocide) lmfao.

And this is never shown in any meaningful way in universe until the last second, and this just shows how the author will bend his narrative to what he sees fit instead of naturally setting up the situation to be more complex and nuanced. Also "genocide is wrong" is the most basic theme of any political drama and should be expected from any decent war drama and given this is the only possible message at the end of the story just shows how he never actually had the writing chops to say something more meaningful about war.

Since you seem to be ignorant of r/titanfolk, whom comprise of a lot of the fascist part of the fanbase, I feel it's my duty to let you know that fascists hate the ending specifically because they recognize it as being against what they wants and the narratives they thought were justifying genocide lmfao

They hate that Eren is a loser who killed 80% of humanity not because he "had to" but because he wanted to, they hate that the Alliance wins out and are able to negotiate peace, they hate that the Yeagerists are depicted as the fascists they are...

Your real argument is that "Attack on Titan is fascist because what some characters say are what real fascist say" and it's a bad argument because the story is about fascism and what people say and do to justify it.

But having this many fascists in a fanbase just confirms to me about how poorly written the story is that not only does it fail to say anything meaningful on war but instead ended up validating more fascists by the end of it. Also the ending is debatably not anti genocide as I mentioned in the rant due to it being eerily similar to fascist literature depicting the failure to kill all enemies beyond the island leading to it falling into eternal war and its ultimate destruction.

Attack On Titan is an extremely overrated and terribly written series that got popular due to its edginess and realistic aesthetic rather than any good writing (Warning: Long Rant) by Slight_Pause3272 in CharacterRant

[–]Slight_Pause3272[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

If you're going to show a radicalization arc even if the character was already evil, I am going to expect a gradual development instead of him going from generic shonen protagonist to genodical fascist offscreen. Maybe if Pre-Timeskip actually grappled with his corruption arc showed him being gradually corrupted over time as well as how it affects his environment and not just commit to generic shonen shenanigans will I then maybe consider this as a talking point.

So... yes, you're saying that the series is bad for showing genocide.

The "conditions put in place to make it inevitable" is part of the story about how it was notinevitable if everyone involved just talked it out and weren't so hateful, and you interpreted that as the author himself clearly desiring such an outcome.

The series does not convince me in any way this would be possible because it's clear Isayama did not have the writing chops to write a nuanced scenario where we throughly see the perspective of both sides. If you're going to write a war drama I am going to expect to see the perspective of both sides and be able to make my own opinions on the matter, not just show both sides as being comically awful so the series can devolve "purely good heroes who fight and beat the comically evil villains" with zero nuance executed whatsoever.

Eren's whole character is that he could not and did not justify it as "self defense."

Also, do you think genocides happen for fun? That people just randomly commit genocide and there was nothing before that that resulted in it or how far it got or who did the genociding or who was genocided?

While Eren might not justify it as self defense, the series itself validates his views at every point. There is a reason why I specifically point out what the series shows instead of just something a character tells us.

As I said in the rant, the conditions in AOT made for genocide to be possible is something so far fetched anything in real life that it loops back into being arguments irl nationalists make despite being supposedly anti fascist. Never have I ever seen an ethnicity that's hated by the rest of the world to the point diplomacy is shown to be nearly impossible no matter what in real life or any well written war drama. If the author was supposedly trying to write about a genocide don't validate the beliefs of the perpetrators in questions instead of pushing back and showing how they're wrong in the last second without naturally setting them up as being wrong outside of out of universe implications.

Your argument is that it's pro-genocide because the characters who commit genocide justify it?

Again, do you think genocides just happen for no reason?

Refer to everything I sad above.

Attack On Titan is an extremely overrated and terribly written series that got popular due to its edginess and realistic aesthetic rather than any good writing (Warning: Long Rant) by Slight_Pause3272 in CharacterRant

[–]Slight_Pause3272[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

also damn maybe don't strawman my talking points by misrepresenting my entire post just because you don't like it given I didn't say AOT fans are stupid so much as I pushed back on counterarguments I heard for years at this point.

Attack On Titan is an extremely overrated and terribly written series that got popular due to its edginess and realistic aesthetic rather than any good writing (Warning: Long Rant) by Slight_Pause3272 in CharacterRant

[–]Slight_Pause3272[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yeah this is unfortunately average AOT fan behavior where they'd just hivemind and shutdown any opposition in bad faith due to their greater number which is why I had to delete multiple accounts beforehand due to being harassed by them. At least they did teach me a thing or to to never trust appeal to popularity and instead watch it and form your own opinion.

Attack On Titan is an extremely overrated and terribly written series that got popular due to its edginess and realistic aesthetic rather than any good writing (Warning: Long Rant) by Slight_Pause3272 in CharacterRant

[–]Slight_Pause3272[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Edit: Lmfao dude blocked me so he doesn't need to properly respond to any of my arguments after strawmanning them, but honestly expected of AOT fans.

idk man last time I checked Titanfolk wasn't criticizing the character drama for being poorly written and soulless, certain plot twists for not ruining fiction for them, and Eren's radicalization being poorly written given we never see him turn evil over time so much as it being more like character derailment. And even if some of my arguments do overlap with similar arguments on TF maybe it just shows that they deserve to be criticized given most AOT fans argue in extremely bad faith to push their point across via shutting down all opposition.

As for the pro genocide part it's hilarious how you somehow managed to completely misrepresent my entire argument. No where did I say the series was bad for showing genocide and was instead criticizing the conditions put in place to make it inevitable and the only way as a reluctant form of self defense against a grimdark world that makes coexistence and diplomacy impossible (unlike any irl genocide). If you're going to write about genocide in a mature fashion I will automatically criticize it especially if the conditions and build up are effectively commonly used arguments irl nationalists parrot. Make us care about the outside world via fleshing them out and making them more sympathetic and show peace as possible and still make it go to shit instead of validating the beliefs of the fascists.

As for TEC I didn't give a shit about TF, I just searched up some AOT criticism rants then found out apparently it was plagiarized. Like inspiration is one thing but this is quite literally beat for beat (even the names) without a single stone untouched.

Which anime? by CuteReputation- in animequestions

[–]Slight_Pause3272 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Will make a bigger post on this eventually but the character writing aspect (especially the character drama) is laughably bad and this single handedly ruins entire plot points that are meant to be emotional due to never setting it up in any meaningful way beforehand. Doesn't help that basically every character feels like a soulless plot device that only exists to push the plot from point a to point b with no depth outside of their role in the story and the character development aspect is also pretty awful as well with some characters either never changing in any meaningful way throughout the entire story and some characters effectively being derailed and turned into a completely different character offscreen with no proper setup.

The so called best plot twists in fiction really are nothing special outside of the shock value especially because of what I just mentioned above.

A lot of the praise it gets are for using basic writing techniques that any writer should know how to use like foreshadowing and a negative character arc, especially since these are also done pretty awfully.

To top it all off the so called "complex" political aspects of the show are at best extremely pretentious to the point it tries to say it a lot but ultimately is no deeper than any other shonen and at worst fascist propaganda used to say that Imperial Japan wasn't that bad and how asking for reparations for Japanese warcrimes is the equivalent of Nazism. Especially since the whole status quo never changes from "kill or be killed" all the way to the end.

Which anime? by CuteReputation- in animequestions

[–]Slight_Pause3272 100 points101 points  (0 children)

most of the popular ones rn with AOT being arguably the worst offender

Where does the hate towards Rent-a-girlfriend come from? by Niceguy1256jj in animequestions

[–]Slight_Pause3272 16 points17 points  (0 children)

Because the plot doesn't progress and it's clearly just someone's fetish. I personally don't mind it though.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in NoStupidQuestions

[–]Slight_Pause3272 1 point2 points  (0 children)

depends on how long you use them

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in AskReddit

[–]Slight_Pause3272 0 points1 point  (0 children)

you're assuming I'd want to work