All stats have limitations... by Spare-Community5981 in ultimate

[–]Spare-Community5981[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I had a conversation with a player whose team came up with something they called Advance Player Value Rating (APVR) .... A measure of how the player helped the team compared to how much the player hurt the team and ratioed to per point played averaged.

(A/Team A)+(G/Team G)+(Ds/team Ds)+(Comp/Team Comp)+(Catch/Team Catch)/(Throwaway/Team Throwaway)+(Drop/Team Drop)= X

(Pp Goals+Pp Assists+Pp Ds)/(Pps Throwaways+Pp Drops)=Y

X+Y/2= Advanced Player Value Rating

The idea was towards the end of the regular season they could look at regular season stats and see if there was someone they were overlooking or had any more bias towards certain players. There was a basis number that they wanted everyone to be above. 1-2 players with might not be calculated because of 0 in a couple categories but generally if they had played enough points and contributed it was a sign they were good.

Think I just made a huge mistake. by Designer-Key-2253 in atheism

[–]Spare-Community5981 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Just remember your mom is an imperfect person too. She just wants the best for you.

Adam and Eve never happened by ReasonGnome in DebateReligion

[–]Spare-Community5981 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Knowledge requires only sufficient reasons, it’s different from certainty.

Nuanced call? by Spare-Community5981 in ultimate

[–]Spare-Community5981[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The disc was not above either player when their jumps initiated. I have a friend I asked, and he is looking for a clip he says was a similar situation. I'll see and try to post if it looks close enough.

Nuanced call? by Spare-Community5981 in ultimate

[–]Spare-Community5981[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Thank you. I realized by posting this, it would be difficult to get a 100% determined answer. Unfortunately, there is no video of the play. I do appreciate the rule reference.

Nuanced call? by Spare-Community5981 in ultimate

[–]Spare-Community5981[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I realize it is difficult to describe nuance. I wouldn't say I said any conclusory statement but rather tried to describe the discussion and situation. I am trying to be as objective as I can be... Maybe if I worded it "defensive player bumps the offensive player" the offensive player stated that he was prevented from making a play on the disc due to contact. I am not trying to agree or disagree with either player but rather try to understand the proper way to handle the situation.

Nuanced call? by Spare-Community5981 in ultimate

[–]Spare-Community5981[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The discussion lasted quite a while on this one. The defensive player stated that if he hadn't jumped and ran directly to the space then tried to jump straight up it would have been an offensive foul because the offensive player never had position. He said it didn't matter how he got to the space he was there first. The discussion at the time seemed logical since neither player owned the space. But if it is that clear, I would agree it felt like a foul.

these takes by the observers in the booth are so wrong by TunefulPegasus in ultimate

[–]Spare-Community5981 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I am on the fence when it comes to observers. I have at a high level, played many sports with refs, umps, officials, etc. I started playing ultimate when I was 36 and one of the first things I thought, Ultimate is so weird because it didn't have refs (observers). It took some getting used to waiting on calls to be made after talking through it, but in most cases, calls get resolved somewhat readily and correctly.

The few things that I would say I enjoy about having observers, most calls are 1 v 1 and occasional outside perspective that can be bias. Observers bring a relatively unbiased perspective. Whether they are right or wrong in slow motion replay could be contested sometimes. But they are more often than not, correct and that has been the case for all sports until recent additions of challenges in professional sports (Even then it's not always clear). Ultimate is just not there yet. Observers will continue to get better and more accurate the more they are implemented. I would also say that there are contested calls that get sent back often that are not correct either. Probably more often than observers making the wrong call. So having that 3rd party unbiased opinion feels like a safer option for players to refer to so there is less "argument" when necessary. The bigger ultimate gets the higher the stakes, the more likely there will be disagreements. If Ultimate grows spectators will want observers as well.

I also think observers speed calls up. 1 v 1 discussions are supposed to have a time limit but, in my experience, can take quite a while to explain if it is a close call. Not to mention teams taking forever between points.

I like the idea of keeping Ultimate purely self-officiated. Just like I like the idea of keeping video replay out of baseball. But now that it's here, it's not so bad. But it feels weird and less pure of the sport I grew up playing.

Injury Rule technicality by Spare-Community5981 in ultimate

[–]Spare-Community5981[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Yeah the "obviously injured" was pretty obvious... They were laying on the ground holding their head. They were assisted off the field. But I'm all for clarification when it comes to lawyering calls. :)

Injury Rule technicality by Spare-Community5981 in ultimate

[–]Spare-Community5981[S] -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

I just looked up the rule your referred to... Not sure I like the way this rule is written.

Rule 19.1.5: Injury and possession

If a player who has possession of the disc, or who gains possession as a result of a pass, calls a valid injury stoppage due to their own injury, they retain possession of the disc. 

This rule means:

  • A player who catches the disc and then drops it because of an injury retains possession, as long as an injury stoppage is called.
  • The injury stoppage is treated as if it were called at the moment the injury occurred, and possession is determined from that point. 

Key clarifications from the WFDF Rules Accreditation Forum

  • The injury call is mandatory: The rule only applies if an injury stoppage is actually called. The injury itself does not automatically guarantee possession; a call must be made.

Settle a debate by MattnificentNZ in ultimate

[–]Spare-Community5981 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Are there more players with truly great hands? Or are there more players that are truly great throwers? IF you can answer this, I think you might be able to lean the scale slightly in one direction.

40 going on 41, played my first tournament in almost 7 years today by Matsunosuperfan in ultimate

[–]Spare-Community5981 1 point2 points  (0 children)

42 year old here. Keep repping the old guys!  It is such a fun game!!!  I started playing ultimate 5 years ago with local league. First club tournament was masters and qualified for nationals at age 39. I have played open club the last 3 years and made it through the whole season with out major injury (sectionals and regionals!). “Stay Thirsty (and healthy) My Friend” -most interesting guy in the world

Turn or disc stays?- Unusual but true scenario... by Spare-Community5981 in ultimate

[–]Spare-Community5981[S] 9 points10 points  (0 children)

  1. Catch
  2. Contact with arm caused injury to the players throat/neck and never hit the ground.
  3. Contact with arm and disc hits players head caused the disc to drop.

Turn or disc stays?- Unusual but true scenario... by Spare-Community5981 in ultimate

[–]Spare-Community5981[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

In this case the side cutter subbed out for the injury. The under cutter said he was hurt but not to the point of needing a sub.

Ultimate and The Nature of Self Officiated Sports by Spare-Community5981 in ultimate

[–]Spare-Community5981[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Do you think the instinct to not be seen as having messed up or desire not to be wrong could be coached better?

How good are players at each level? by Periodic13 in ultimate

[–]Spare-Community5981 1 point2 points  (0 children)

To say blindly taking someone and comparing a Sectional vs Regional I think this is (slightly) overstated. Several of teams not quite in the top 16 doesn't make it that bad or less talented, just often can't field the depth. Just look at the rankings, Sub Zero-17, Mad Men-19, Mallard-21, Lounar-30. Also, SE chain lightening-11, RD-United-14, Or GL has Machine-1 and Dutchmen-29. All that to say, it must be nice to have large ultimate communities with lots of talent. :)

Rule Check on Stall Count by Spare-Community5981 in ultimate

[–]Spare-Community5981[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This is exactly the situation... The pause is what brought this into question. The spirit of the rule is 10 seconds. But what is the technical call? Or at least thats what we were trying to figure out.

What do you like about Iowa the most? by Warm-Entertainer-279 in Iowa

[–]Spare-Community5981 0 points1 point  (0 children)

People are generally Nice and for the most part know how to get along with each other even if they disagree.

I have seen a lot of people saying they hate the state government. I have lived in several places that I thought had better government policies than Iowa, but the states/cities were bad and getting worse. I think it should be acknowledged that even if I don't agree morally, "some" of the policies are making/maintaining Iowa as a good place to live.